Farming. How easy to start with zero knowledge?
Discussion
Lungauer said:
Actually not quite zero as I spent a year doing practical experience on a mixed farm when I was 18. Plan then was to go to agricultural college and pursue a career in farming. For various reasons (mostly related to affairs of the heart) I didn't go and spent the next 35 years working in the family business in London, a career which couldn't have been further removed from the land.
I've decided I don't want to do it anymore and given that pensions aren't worth a light and neither is cash, thought about investing in a small farm, probably somewhere lending itself more to pasture than arable (and away from London's thrall). I'm mot looking to get rich, just to survive in an area of great beauty and balm for the soul. I wondered about the possibility of share farming where I, as landowner, might get a percentage of profit from activities conducted on my land (sheep, cows, goats etc.), or possibly just renting out the fields (though I imagine pasture doesn't earn a lot in rent).
This is probably all pie in the sky, certainly there are plenty of farmers giving it up as a bad job, but that year on the farm was the happiest of my life and feel it must be possible to make a go of it. Somehow.
Failing that I suppose there's always the dreaded holiday cottages...
I also have the dream of farming and whilst thats probably never going to happen, I think I will do something on a smaller scale one day as a hobby. Have had Chickens previously and that went well, we were getting 3-4 eggs a day, plenty for the family breakfast. I've decided I don't want to do it anymore and given that pensions aren't worth a light and neither is cash, thought about investing in a small farm, probably somewhere lending itself more to pasture than arable (and away from London's thrall). I'm mot looking to get rich, just to survive in an area of great beauty and balm for the soul. I wondered about the possibility of share farming where I, as landowner, might get a percentage of profit from activities conducted on my land (sheep, cows, goats etc.), or possibly just renting out the fields (though I imagine pasture doesn't earn a lot in rent).
This is probably all pie in the sky, certainly there are plenty of farmers giving it up as a bad job, but that year on the farm was the happiest of my life and feel it must be possible to make a go of it. Somehow.
Failing that I suppose there's always the dreaded holiday cottages...
Just my two penneth...
I'm also from a 'long line of farmers' (as far back as I've managed to get on Ancestry anyway). My parents farm (arable, with turkeys for Xmas trade), been on our current farm for 35 years, with an additional tenancy 3 miles away for the past twenty.
A couple of years ago, a tenancy on the farm adjoining my parents came up; just shy of 100 acres. Using precise figures from my parents accounts, we could only project an income of £14.0K (arable); and that was 'borrowing' all of the equipment from my Dad at zero cost. We ran business plans for three additional activities; one would be immediate and using the small amount of pasture but only add maybe a couple of thousand extra per annum at best, another we would not start for 5-6 years due to funding, and the third we would kick off with ASAP, which would hopefully become the key earner (both the latter two were added value diversification routes) for my wife.
The reality of it all was that I would continue with my existing business (consultancy), working the farming in partnership with my Dad (we would also actively look for another 5-600 acres to make the 'whole' operation stack up for two families, as it stood I could run it all part-time), until such time he chose to retire and I'd undertake it all single-handedly.
Not precise figures, but it might give you an idea as to how it looks. It's not just buying the farm, but within reason, most routes also require a fair chunk of start-up capital on top; machinery, animals, Asparagus plants, vines! I'd say in agreement to most that to get a reasonable return you need to take the diversification route, ideally value-adding to your own produce.
I'm also from a 'long line of farmers' (as far back as I've managed to get on Ancestry anyway). My parents farm (arable, with turkeys for Xmas trade), been on our current farm for 35 years, with an additional tenancy 3 miles away for the past twenty.
A couple of years ago, a tenancy on the farm adjoining my parents came up; just shy of 100 acres. Using precise figures from my parents accounts, we could only project an income of £14.0K (arable); and that was 'borrowing' all of the equipment from my Dad at zero cost. We ran business plans for three additional activities; one would be immediate and using the small amount of pasture but only add maybe a couple of thousand extra per annum at best, another we would not start for 5-6 years due to funding, and the third we would kick off with ASAP, which would hopefully become the key earner (both the latter two were added value diversification routes) for my wife.
The reality of it all was that I would continue with my existing business (consultancy), working the farming in partnership with my Dad (we would also actively look for another 5-600 acres to make the 'whole' operation stack up for two families, as it stood I could run it all part-time), until such time he chose to retire and I'd undertake it all single-handedly.
Not precise figures, but it might give you an idea as to how it looks. It's not just buying the farm, but within reason, most routes also require a fair chunk of start-up capital on top; machinery, animals, Asparagus plants, vines! I'd say in agreement to most that to get a reasonable return you need to take the diversification route, ideally value-adding to your own produce.
We have started a 'farm' with practically zero experience but its only a hobby and certainly not an investment. We are lucky enough to have great advice from neighbors and friends, which you cannot put a price on. We currently have 20 black angus, chooks and vegies on 100 acres in Australia and its not even a proper hobby farm. There have been big highs with the birth of the first calf and a few lows, livestock = deadstock. I have a never ending list of jobs to do from fixing fences, weed spraying, chainsawing dead trees, irrigation and pest control. But the produce tastes amazing and it provides a big relief from our day to day working lives. If you go in with your eyes and check book open and are prepared for lots of hard work go for it. I am tempted to plant some vines next...
I can put you in touch with someone who did exactly that a few years ago.
He's an ex city trader, sold up in London and bought a large farm in the country. Started with zero agri knowledge, but being switched-on, decided that he could learn. He did learn, but it looks like hard work. I think I remember he said he just broke even financially on year three.
That said, it is idyllic. He has a lovely wife who is equally happy to graft, and three great children who love the life. Seeing them enjoying having such a huge playground, and being responsible enough to enjoy the farm machinery and associated quad bikes and Land Rovers gladdens a PH'er heart too
they all look really happy, but it is graft with early starts and late nights - or sometimes no nights at all!
PM me and I'll ask him if I can give you his number. Lovely chap, I'm sure he'd be happy to help you.
He's an ex city trader, sold up in London and bought a large farm in the country. Started with zero agri knowledge, but being switched-on, decided that he could learn. He did learn, but it looks like hard work. I think I remember he said he just broke even financially on year three.
That said, it is idyllic. He has a lovely wife who is equally happy to graft, and three great children who love the life. Seeing them enjoying having such a huge playground, and being responsible enough to enjoy the farm machinery and associated quad bikes and Land Rovers gladdens a PH'er heart too
they all look really happy, but it is graft with early starts and late nights - or sometimes no nights at all!PM me and I'll ask him if I can give you his number. Lovely chap, I'm sure he'd be happy to help you.
I farm 650 acres as a tenant with two landlords.
I used to have all my own equipment and do it all myself (at that time it was 900 acres). We were loosing money so needed to make a change. Contracted it out to allow me to do other things.
Started a second totally unconnected business which, along with my wife's income is what we live on. The farm is somewhere we live and enjoy but our income comes from off farm activities.
My farm is high yielding land farmed to stand in the top 10% in UK regarding costs, efficiency and output. We made less than the threshold to pay tax last year and this year looks like we will make a loss. This is after receipt of EU subsidies!
If I owned the land I would make an acceptable living. But it would be like living off the interest of the money(value) at 1.5% per annum before tax.
Land as an asset has tax advantages and appreciation on it's side. But it is a long term investment.
We have had years when we made a reasonable profit but they are outnumbered by those we don't.
I went to agricultural college for 3 years and I am a qualified agronomist so knowing how to farm was not the issue.
We are currently in the process of growing the unconnected business which is buying our own small plot to retire to, and that business will provide our income during 'retirement'.
My advice would be to have another form of income that provides all you need and expect the farm to make nothing - and you won't be disappointed.
I used to have all my own equipment and do it all myself (at that time it was 900 acres). We were loosing money so needed to make a change. Contracted it out to allow me to do other things.
Started a second totally unconnected business which, along with my wife's income is what we live on. The farm is somewhere we live and enjoy but our income comes from off farm activities.
My farm is high yielding land farmed to stand in the top 10% in UK regarding costs, efficiency and output. We made less than the threshold to pay tax last year and this year looks like we will make a loss. This is after receipt of EU subsidies!
If I owned the land I would make an acceptable living. But it would be like living off the interest of the money(value) at 1.5% per annum before tax.
Land as an asset has tax advantages and appreciation on it's side. But it is a long term investment.
We have had years when we made a reasonable profit but they are outnumbered by those we don't.
I went to agricultural college for 3 years and I am a qualified agronomist so knowing how to farm was not the issue.
We are currently in the process of growing the unconnected business which is buying our own small plot to retire to, and that business will provide our income during 'retirement'.
My advice would be to have another form of income that provides all you need and expect the farm to make nothing - and you won't be disappointed.
Ray Luxury-Yacht said:
I can put you in touch with someone who did exactly that a few years ago.
He's an ex city trader, sold up in London and bought a large farm in the country. Started with zero agri knowledge, but being switched-on, decided that he could learn. He did learn, but it looks like hard work. I think I remember he said he just broke even financially on year three.
That said, it is idyllic. He has a lovely wife who is equally happy to graft, and three great children who love the life. Seeing them enjoying having such a huge playground, and being responsible enough to enjoy the farm machinery and associated quad bikes and Land Rovers gladdens a PH'er heart too they all look really happy, but it is graft with early starts and late nights - or sometimes no nights at all!
PM me and I'll ask him if I can give you his number. Lovely chap, I'm sure he'd be happy to help you.
Thanks Ray. PM sent. Haven't given up on the idea entirely yet!He's an ex city trader, sold up in London and bought a large farm in the country. Started with zero agri knowledge, but being switched-on, decided that he could learn. He did learn, but it looks like hard work. I think I remember he said he just broke even financially on year three.
That said, it is idyllic. He has a lovely wife who is equally happy to graft, and three great children who love the life. Seeing them enjoying having such a huge playground, and being responsible enough to enjoy the farm machinery and associated quad bikes and Land Rovers gladdens a PH'er heart too
they all look really happy, but it is graft with early starts and late nights - or sometimes no nights at all!PM me and I'll ask him if I can give you his number. Lovely chap, I'm sure he'd be happy to help you.
Lungauer said:
Ray Luxury-Yacht said:
I can put you in touch with someone who did exactly that a few years ago.
He's an ex city trader, sold up in London and bought a large farm in the country. Started with zero agri knowledge, but being switched-on, decided that he could learn. He did learn, but it looks like hard work. I think I remember he said he just broke even financially on year three.
That said, it is idyllic. He has a lovely wife who is equally happy to graft, and three great children who love the life. Seeing them enjoying having such a huge playground, and being responsible enough to enjoy the farm machinery and associated quad bikes and Land Rovers gladdens a PH'er heart too they all look really happy, but it is graft with early starts and late nights - or sometimes no nights at all!
PM me and I'll ask him if I can give you his number. Lovely chap, I'm sure he'd be happy to help you.
Thanks Ray. PM sent. Haven't given up on the idea entirely yet!He's an ex city trader, sold up in London and bought a large farm in the country. Started with zero agri knowledge, but being switched-on, decided that he could learn. He did learn, but it looks like hard work. I think I remember he said he just broke even financially on year three.
That said, it is idyllic. He has a lovely wife who is equally happy to graft, and three great children who love the life. Seeing them enjoying having such a huge playground, and being responsible enough to enjoy the farm machinery and associated quad bikes and Land Rovers gladdens a PH'er heart too
they all look really happy, but it is graft with early starts and late nights - or sometimes no nights at all!PM me and I'll ask him if I can give you his number. Lovely chap, I'm sure he'd be happy to help you.
http://www.heskethfarmpark.co.uk
Here is a successful local "farm". Highly diversified, very popular. Still a working farm in the background, but the kids stuff is what makes them the money each year.
Here is a successful local "farm". Highly diversified, very popular. Still a working farm in the background, but the kids stuff is what makes them the money each year.
Ray Luxury-Yacht said:
I can put you in touch with someone who did exactly that a few years ago.
He's an ex city trader, sold up in London and bought a large farm in the country. Started with zero agri knowledge, but being switched-on, decided that he could learn.
Same route as Jimmy of 'Jimmy's Farm' I believe. The most expensive sausages I've ever seen!He's an ex city trader, sold up in London and bought a large farm in the country. Started with zero agri knowledge, but being switched-on, decided that he could learn.
uber said:
Build a farm park and have the enjoyment of the farm life with the income of a leisure operator!
I know nothing of farming but this seems like a good idea to me. Families love these places and you only need to go and visit a few to see how they are set up (and check their accounts!)I'm surprised no one has posted this yet.
(NSFW as it mentions having rough sex from behind with a farm worker.)
Farmer Mark's Sunshine Valley Happy Lambs Free Range Cottage Farm And Slaughterhouse
Alternatively you could build rocket ships or just stick pictures of Justin Timberlake on to the back of rucsacs...
(NSFW as it mentions having rough sex from behind with a farm worker.)
Farmer Mark's Sunshine Valley Happy Lambs Free Range Cottage Farm And Slaughterhouse
Alternatively you could build rocket ships or just stick pictures of Justin Timberlake on to the back of rucsacs...
Well lets drag up my favourite YouTube clip on farming profitability
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kY9EX28GKvk
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kY9EX28GKvk
Visited this farm yesterday.
It was bursting with visitors.
http://www.parksidefarmpyo.co.uk/
Maybe worth spending 15 quid at Companies House to see if they're making money.
Phil
It was bursting with visitors.
http://www.parksidefarmpyo.co.uk/
Maybe worth spending 15 quid at Companies House to see if they're making money.
Phil
Transmitter Man said:
Visited this farm yesterday.
It was bursting with visitors.
http://www.parksidefarmpyo.co.uk/
Maybe worth spending 15 quid at Companies House to see if they're making money.
Phil
Profit after tax and dividends of £220k for the year ended 31/10/15. Year before slightly smaller but still good.It was bursting with visitors.
http://www.parksidefarmpyo.co.uk/
Maybe worth spending 15 quid at Companies House to see if they're making money.
Phil
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