IGindex discussion thread

[shadowninja]

shadowninja said:

A window for each chart = loads of Windows to alt-tab through.

The clue, as always, is in what I write.

And I have 3 screens. One for my trading platform and the other two are to collect dust. \/

Edited by shadowninja on Monday 28th July 15:30

[xiphias]

If you have three screens why are you alt-tabbing?

[shadowninja]

xiphias said:

If you have three screens why are you alt-tabbing?

You can never have enough screens.

[limpsfield]

shadowninja said:

xiphias said:

If you have three screens why are you alt-tabbing?

You can never have enough screens.

A traders P&L is directly related to the size and number of screens you have.

That is FACT.

I have one of these



but will be getting one of these if gold just closes down by 5:30

Edited by limpsfield on Monday 28th July 16:49

[shadowninja]

I wonder if you get free binoculars when you buy 9 screens or more. The screens in the far corners would be harder to read, surely? (Assuming they're all covered in graphs and numbers.)

[ATM]

ATM said:

g4ry13 said:

ATM said:

xiphias said:

You have an open position, you click close - it says the price is no longer valid. Now I could understand if I were buying on the market as you need an opposite position etc, but it's spread betting - just based on the market value. If I can't close my position then IG essentially have my arm behind my back!

I used to get this a lot. Use a different broker. There are some others which are easy enough to find which work much better in my opinion.

I've had this with Capital Spreads before and Finspreads are the absolute worst - disconnecting you and so on. I think IG are fairly reasonable in this respect; you're bound to get it anywhere when there's spikes and high volatility.


Who do you recommend ATM?

I am not recommending anyone. But what I can say is lately I have been using Cantor exclusively and I have NEVER had a price rejected or no longer available etc.

OK so I had my first problem with Cantor and price rejected due to volatility etc. This was made double'y worse by the fact that once a close request has been rejected the close button for the position in question is then rendered useless. Only way round this I could see was to log out and back in. This did cost me obviously.

I called Cantor to discuss this and found out that every time I click to buy or sell / open or close each and every request goes through to a human to accept or reject. This concerns me. I thought these things were automated.

So I'm now thinking of trying other brokers. Does anyone know if this human accepting every transaction is standard or differs between companies?

[ingelow]

ATM said:

So I'm now thinking of trying other brokers. Does anyone know if this human accepting every transaction is standard or differs between companies?

Not 100% sure, but I'd imagine it's fairly standard depending on four things: Market, Size, Volatility and Client.

If you're betting £1 a point on FTSE, these will be autofilled pretty much anywhere I'd guess, if you're doing £10 a point, I'd expect someone to take a look at it. If you're sniping over the web, prices go stale very quickly in a volatile environment - they may allow a small amount of slip depending on the market, but it won't be much.

In very volatile conditions, they may well check every trade - in which case, it's probably worth doing it over the phone and asking for a price.

[Horse_Apple]

ATM said:

ATM said:

g4ry13 said:

ATM said:

xiphias said:

You have an open position, you click close - it says the price is no longer valid. Now I could understand if I were buying on the market as you need an opposite position etc, but it's spread betting - just based on the market value. If I can't close my position then IG essentially have my arm behind my back!

I used to get this a lot. Use a different broker. There are some others which are easy enough to find which work much better in my opinion.

I've had this with Capital Spreads before and Finspreads are the absolute worst - disconnecting you and so on. I think IG are fairly reasonable in this respect; you're bound to get it anywhere when there's spikes and high volatility.


Who do you recommend ATM?

I am not recommending anyone. But what I can say is lately I have been using Cantor exclusively and I have NEVER had a price rejected or no longer available etc.

OK so I had my first problem with Cantor and price rejected due to volatility etc. This was made double'y worse by the fact that once a close request has been rejected the close button for the position in question is then rendered useless. Only way round this I could see was to log out and back in. This did cost me obviously.

I called Cantor to discuss this and found out that every time I click to buy or sell / open or close each and every request goes through to a human to accept or reject. This concerns me. I thought these things were automated.

So I'm now thinking of trying other brokers. Does anyone know if this human accepting every transaction is standard or differs between companies?

Welcome to the world of smoke and mirrors.

Not every firm has made it into the 21st century.

The only time an order should have manual intervention is when the size is greater than the liquidity at Best in the underlying market. And even then the firm should have enough internal volume to take it on automatically in most cases.

This is a very, very clear example of why just a couple of firms are 10 to 20 times the size of most of the others.

Technology costs and liquidity is vital.

[Horse_Apple]

ingelow said:

ATM said:

So I'm now thinking of trying other brokers. Does anyone know if this human accepting every transaction is standard or differs between companies?

Not 100% sure, but I'd imagine it's fairly standard depending on four things: Market, Size, Volatility and Client.

If you're betting £1 a point on FTSE, these will be autofilled pretty much anywhere I'd guess, if you're doing £10 a point, I'd expect someone to take a look at it. If you're sniping over the web, prices go stale very quickly in a volatile environment - they may allow a small amount of slip depending on the market, but it won't be much.

In very volatile conditions, they may well check every trade - in which case, it's probably worth doing it over the phone and asking for a price.

In all honesty, if a broker needs to check a £10 deal on the FTSE then they probably shouldn't be in business. Even £100 is a little concerning.

[ATM]

I've been sniffin around and there seems to be possibilities beyond spread betting but I dont really understand the differences. Interactive Brokers looks big and widely used but its a whole new ball game and not sure what kind of learning curve is required.

[Horse_Apple]

ATM said:

I've been sniffin around and there seems to be possibilities beyond spread betting but I dont really understand the differences. Interactive Brokers looks big and widely used but its a whole new ball game and not sure what kind of learning curve is required.

They offer real futures and are fantastically cheap.

However, you need to bear in mind that they are over in the US and you try getting through on the phone when you are long a tanking market and your internet isn't working or their system is down.

It is also important to note that a daily spread bet is created directly off the futures market (funding out, divis back in) and yet you have greater liquidity, smaller margins, more tollerance, etc.

Drill down and in core costs spread bets are more expensive but in honest comparison the upsides are infinately superior, which is why pretty much no one in the UK in the retail market trades real futures.

[limpsfield]

ATM said:

I've been sniffin around and there seems to be possibilities beyond spread betting but I dont really understand the differences. Interactive Brokers looks big and widely used but its a whole new ball game and not sure what kind of learning curve is required.

I assume you are trading the actual futures contracts with them so it would not be a quantum leap.

however, I would say that I think for the vast majority of people the benefits of spread betting: tax free; technology of the platforms; ability to size you trade according to your individual requirements rather than being stuck with exchange minimum contract sizes would more than outweigh other avenues.

Personally, I have always found it more profitable to spend time on trading approaches rather than flipping from one provider to the next every few months.

Edited by limpsfield on Thursday 31st July 10:05

[ingelow]

Horse_Apple said:

In all honesty, if a broker needs to check a £10 deal on the FTSE then they probably shouldn't be in business. Even £100 is a little concerning.

Sorry, you're right, £100 is more realistic actually - but any decent broker will be able to set a threshold from market to market.

Horse_Apple said:

The only time an order should have manual intervention is when the size is greater than the liquidity at Best in the underlying market. And even then the firm should have enough internal volume to take it on automatically in most cases.

Difficult this one - on the web when you've got to take latency into account - say I publish a price in a volatile market, price moves against me (the broker), punter tries to trade on an old price - which would put him in profit and me in loss. If I'm a sensible broker I'm not going to allow that (within reason obviously)

Now as I probably have clients on the other side of that trade anyway and because I don't want to knock tons of trades back, I'll allow a bit of slip, but if it's a very quick move - I'll knock you back, prevents sniping pit traders taking me to the cleaners on the oil price as they have it before me for example.

If you think that's bad, I'd stay away from FX markets

[Edit] Spelling

Edited by ingelow on Thursday 31st July 12:21

[Horse_Apple]

ingelow said:

Horse_Apple said:

In all honesty, if a broker needs to check a £10 deal on the FTSE then they probably shouldn't be in business. Even £100 is a little concerning.

Sorry, you're right, £100 is more realistic actually - but any decent broker will be able to set a threshold from market to market.

Horse_Apple said:

The only time an order should have manual intervention is when the size is greater than the liquidity at Best in the underlying market. And even then the firm should have enough internal volume to take it on automatically in most cases.

Difficult this one - on the web when you've got to take latency into account - say I publish a price in a volatile market, price moves against me (the broker), punter tries to trade on an old price - which would put him in profit and me in loss. If I'm a sensible broker I'm not going to allow that (within reason obviously)

Now as I probably have clients on the other side of that trade anyway and because I don't want to knock tons of trades back, I'll allow a bit of slip, but if it's a very quick move - I'll knock you back, prevents sniping pit traders taking me to the cleaners on the oil price as they have it before me for example.

If you think that's bad, I'd stay away from FX markets

[Edit] Spelling

Edited by ingelow on Thursday 31st July 12:21

It's not the market, it's peoples choice of brokers. Avoid monkey market making brokers and you avoid getting ripped off.

[ATM]

ingelow said:

Horse_Apple said:

The only time an order should have manual intervention is when the size is greater than the liquidity at Best in the underlying market. And even then the firm should have enough internal volume to take it on automatically in most cases.

Difficult this one - on the web when you've got to take latency into account - say I publish a price in a volatile market, price moves against me (the broker), punter tries to trade on an old price - which would put him in profit and me in loss. If I'm a sensible broker I'm not going to allow that (within reason obviously)

Now as I probably have clients on the other side of that trade anyway and because I don't want to knock tons of trades back, I'll allow a bit of slip, but if it's a very quick move - I'll knock you back, prevents sniping pit traders taking me to the cleaners on the oil price as they have it before me for example.

See my view is they make their platform and it should know at any one time what trades are running and for who and the underlying prices. Then shirley with that info to hand and one of them there fancy computer thingy majigs it should be able to calculate if it can show prices or if it needs to adjust them a little. Then when I click a buttoin showing a price it should be able to fill me immediately or it should not have displayed that price. As soon as you put humans in the chain then volatility is one thing but a human having to make a decision on sevaral orders at once is never going to happen in a timely fashion.

[Christoffer]

Are there any spreadbetting firms / possibility of CFD trading where you can bet the amount you want on the index futures?
Any of you know the commissions? About 5 round turn trades a week.
Looking to trade European index futures but would like to trade a quarter to a half of one futures contract per trade.

[Horse_Apple]

Christoffer said:

Are there any spreadbetting firms / possibility of CFD trading where you can bet the amount you want on the index futures?
Any of you know the commissions? About 5 round turn trades a week.
Looking to trade European index futures but would like to trade a quarter to a half of one futures contract per trade.

All spread bet firms do fractions of a contract.

Most CFD firms will off the minis.

£1 a point on the FTSE is 1 tenth of a contract.

[Christoffer]

Thanks - so you can bet a tenth of a contract. Do you know anyone that offers good commisions? Less than the 0,1% IG seems to offer that is.

[Horse_Apple]

Christoffer said:

Thanks - so you can bet a tenth of a contract. Do you know anyone that offers good commisions? Less than the 0,1% IG seems to offer that is.

You get what you pay for in life.

With regards to spreads and CFDs, the comm is usually not the relevant cost. The real costs can be much much larger and nicely hidden away.

Every broker is different and caters for a different type of client. You will need to do your own research but as a friendly warning, if you focus on comm then you are almost certainly going to lose money.

[Christoffer]

Thanks Horse Apple

Yes I know the biggest cost are the losses but therefore one can also try to cut the commisions down.

Thanks for the advice though. Primarily trading Forex at the moment but looking to trade futures on hourly charts.

Thanks