Macbook Pro (2016)
Discussion
Lol at all the fanboys from both camps coming out. I have no skin in the game, I'm primarily a Windows user but also have used or owned some Apple Laptops too, plus about 25 years in the IT industry so thanks for saying I know nothing, I'm sure my clients will be pleased. 
On the whole (with caveats) the Mac OS tends to be more stable but that's understandable as the whole Apple ecosystem is more tightly controlled in terms of hardware and software so what you loose in flexibility, you gain in stability. Mac hardware also tends to have better build quality (note I said tends fanboys), only a few Windows manufacturers can rival Apple in that regard but to get that level of build quality in a Windows machine you usually pay Apple prices anyway.
However Apple tend to be overpriced for the actual performance on offer these days. They've always been expensive due to the brand name but historically they used to be about equal on performance too but have definitely fallen behind in the last 5-6 years. Yes a lot of the hardware they use is now similar to stuff you find in Windows laptops but they tend to prioritize form over function these days so you won't often get the latest\greatest chipsets so in terms of raw numbers or things like gaming they can't compete. What they counter with is stability, usually a bit more longevity, looks and brand kudos. The OS on the Mac is also a bit more efficient so it can do more with less high spec hardware.
Neither approach is right or wrong, some people are all about the numbers chasing that last few hundred points on performance scores or FPS but others want a sexy, easy to use machine that won't blow you away on specs but is good enough. I must have used literally hundreds of laptops and PC's over my career and home life, very few Windows machines look as sexy or feel as good as a Mac but then if I want to play the latest games running ultra detail at 100fps+ I won't be reaching for my Macbook either so it's horses for courses.
I do find it weird that there is such animosity between both camps, I use the right tool for the job and unless you own shares in Apple or Microsoft I find the partisan approach that a lot of people adopt very strange.
On the whole (with caveats) the Mac OS tends to be more stable but that's understandable as the whole Apple ecosystem is more tightly controlled in terms of hardware and software so what you loose in flexibility, you gain in stability. Mac hardware also tends to have better build quality (note I said tends fanboys), only a few Windows manufacturers can rival Apple in that regard but to get that level of build quality in a Windows machine you usually pay Apple prices anyway.
However Apple tend to be overpriced for the actual performance on offer these days. They've always been expensive due to the brand name but historically they used to be about equal on performance too but have definitely fallen behind in the last 5-6 years. Yes a lot of the hardware they use is now similar to stuff you find in Windows laptops but they tend to prioritize form over function these days so you won't often get the latest\greatest chipsets so in terms of raw numbers or things like gaming they can't compete. What they counter with is stability, usually a bit more longevity, looks and brand kudos. The OS on the Mac is also a bit more efficient so it can do more with less high spec hardware.
Neither approach is right or wrong, some people are all about the numbers chasing that last few hundred points on performance scores or FPS but others want a sexy, easy to use machine that won't blow you away on specs but is good enough. I must have used literally hundreds of laptops and PC's over my career and home life, very few Windows machines look as sexy or feel as good as a Mac but then if I want to play the latest games running ultra detail at 100fps+ I won't be reaching for my Macbook either so it's horses for courses.
I do find it weird that there is such animosity between both camps, I use the right tool for the job and unless you own shares in Apple or Microsoft I find the partisan approach that a lot of people adopt very strange.
Edited by Guvernator on Wednesday 23 August 13:09
dmsims said:
ashleyman said:
When I was on Windows in a creative agency I went through so many top end desktop towers in the space of 14 months it became a running joke,
This make ZERO sense, what did you do to them ? Throw them, pour coffe down them, set them on fire ?My PC is just over 7 years old (and will crush any Mac)
Mine is 9 years old and still works fine every day (was top of what you could get back then and still holds its own).
p1stonhead said:
dmsims said:
ashleyman said:
When I was on Windows in a creative agency I went through so many top end desktop towers in the space of 14 months it became a running joke,
This make ZERO sense, what did you do to them ? Throw them, pour coffe down them, set them on fire ?My PC is just over 7 years old (and will crush any Mac)
Mine is 9 years old and still works fine every day (was top of what you could get back then and still holds its own).
(N.B. I wouldn't consider this to be Dell's, or Microsoft's, fault...!)
Guvernator said:
I do find it weird that their is such animosity between both camps, I use the right tool for the job and unless you own shares in Apple or Microsoft I find the partisan approach that a lot of people adopt very strange.
Yup. all good fair points, but your earlier post was somewhat riddled with inaccurate and odd statements 
MacOS is a Unix-like OS based on Mach Kernel/BDS/Nextstep. It's linux-like, but not "based on linux".
"Viruses" : If your system is full of viruses, the least of your problems is their effect on performance! The demands and performance of anti-virus software are a big issue, though - particularly third-party stuff. Windows Defender is good, but you'll still see the "Windows Antimalware service" chewing up CPU on occasions.
"Windows Bloatware" : "Bloatware" is preinstalled software when you first get the machine. Even if you can't remove it (which is unusual) it doesn't usually slow the machine down over time.
"Increasing demands of the OS" - I'd dispute that one too. Windows versions since Vista have typically been no fatter or slower than previous. Windows 10 has the same hardware requirements as windows 7, which is basically 8 years old.
"Macs don't run taxing software" Tell that to people doing video editing and music production on Macs. Windows is now also used heavily in this market, as most of the software is now available for both platforms. but I think Apple have higher market share here than in general 'domestic' PCs. Gaming's another matter entirely, though
(Mac user since '87. PC user since '84. I've upgraded a few times along the way...)
The whole Mac vs PC is terribly dull and sadly inevitable in almost all threads about Macs.
Back on topic, I've been using the latest MacBook Pro for the last few months.
Battery - disappointing.
Touch Bar - surprisingly useful, but probably no help to the battery.
Screen - delicious, and yes, you guessed it, no help to the battery.
USB-C - It's convenient having two sockets either side, but they are a pain to insert, and MagSafe, oh MagSafe, I do miss you. It does allow a single cable connection to the LG screen (which is gorgeous) and you can then connect various peripherals to the screen, but annoyingly an external HD for use as Time Machine Backup doesn't automatically mount.
Keyboard - It's fine.
Performance - fantastic.
Build and form - as usual drop dead gorgeous.
I moved from a four year old Air and wouldn't go back, but I do miss MagSafe and longer battery performance.
Back on topic, I've been using the latest MacBook Pro for the last few months.
Battery - disappointing.
Touch Bar - surprisingly useful, but probably no help to the battery.
Screen - delicious, and yes, you guessed it, no help to the battery.
USB-C - It's convenient having two sockets either side, but they are a pain to insert, and MagSafe, oh MagSafe, I do miss you. It does allow a single cable connection to the LG screen (which is gorgeous) and you can then connect various peripherals to the screen, but annoyingly an external HD for use as Time Machine Backup doesn't automatically mount.
Keyboard - It's fine.
Performance - fantastic.
Build and form - as usual drop dead gorgeous.
I moved from a four year old Air and wouldn't go back, but I do miss MagSafe and longer battery performance.
mikef said:
I'll take the Pepsi challenge. In what way(s) other than gaming will it crush my 2010 12-core 128GB RAM Mac Pro?
Okay (there was a bit of poetic license ) but just about anything especially when a program doesn't use multiple cores properly (and there are a lot of them)Your 2.66 Ghz speed is so last year
silentbrown said:
Yup. all good fair points, but your earlier post was somewhat riddled with inaccurate and odd statements
MacOS is a Unix-like OS based on Mach Kernel/BDS/Nextstep. It's linux-like, but not "based on linux".
"Viruses" : If your system is full of viruses, the least of your problems is their effect on performance! The demands and performance of anti-virus software are a big issue, though - particularly third-party stuff. Windows Defender is good, but you'll still see the "Windows Antimalware service" chewing up CPU on occasions.
"Windows Bloatware" : "Bloatware" is preinstalled software when you first get the machine. Even if you can't remove it (which is unusual) it doesn't usually slow the machine down over time.
"Increasing demands of the OS" - I'd dispute that one too. Windows versions since Vista have typically been no fatter or slower than previous. Windows 10 has the same hardware requirements as windows 7, which is basically 8 years old.
"Macs don't run taxing software" Tell that to people doing video editing and music production on Macs. Windows is now also used heavily in this market, as most of the software is now available for both platforms. but I think Apple have higher market share here than in general 'domestic' PCs. Gaming's another matter entirely, though
(Mac user since '87. PC user since '84. I've upgraded a few times along the way...)
A lot of my statements where general without getting into boring symantecs. Linux is a Unix clone but more people are familiar with the term Linux so I used that name instead. MacOS is a Unix-like OS based on Mach Kernel/BDS/Nextstep. It's linux-like, but not "based on linux".
"Viruses" : If your system is full of viruses, the least of your problems is their effect on performance! The demands and performance of anti-virus software are a big issue, though - particularly third-party stuff. Windows Defender is good, but you'll still see the "Windows Antimalware service" chewing up CPU on occasions.
"Windows Bloatware" : "Bloatware" is preinstalled software when you first get the machine. Even if you can't remove it (which is unusual) it doesn't usually slow the machine down over time.
"Increasing demands of the OS" - I'd dispute that one too. Windows versions since Vista have typically been no fatter or slower than previous. Windows 10 has the same hardware requirements as windows 7, which is basically 8 years old.
"Macs don't run taxing software" Tell that to people doing video editing and music production on Macs. Windows is now also used heavily in this market, as most of the software is now available for both platforms. but I think Apple have higher market share here than in general 'domestic' PCs. Gaming's another matter entirely, though
(Mac user since '87. PC user since '84. I've upgraded a few times along the way...)
Viruses and virus removal software are an issue on both platforms but Windows is effected more simply because more people tend to target Windows machines, there are a lot more of them and the Windows OS has a larger attack surface. I've had more problems with viruses on Windows then on Mac's, that doesn't make Mac's somehow better, it's just the way it is due to the above. It's just one of but not the only reason why Mac laptops tend to have a longer useful life without having to do a full re-install which was the real point I was trying to make.
WIndows 10 is more efficient but it's probably the first OS that is less of a system hog than it's predecessor and most software you run on Windows gets bigger and more power hungry with each version so again without getting into symantecs, my statement holds true that newer versions of software usually bloat and need more power.
You've quoted my Mac's don't run taxing software and skipped the bit of the sentence immediately afterwards where I acknowledge people use them in the work environment to do intensive editing work.
My mistake though, I forgot I was writing on PH where pedantry and spelling mistakes matter more than the general gist of the posts.
dmsims said:
ashleyman said:
When I was on Windows in a creative agency I went through so many top end desktop towers in the space of 14 months it became a running joke,
This make ZERO sense, what did you do to them ? Throw them, pour coffe down them, set them on fire ?My PC is just over 7 years old (and will crush any Mac)
Not really my problem what happened to them as it wasn't mine. Same tasks on a Mac and it lasted 2 years before being upgraded to a better model. At home I have a 1.5 year old iMac and it's perfect, just waiting for either the new Mac Pro or iMac Pro and will upgrade to that instead.
Don't care for the whole Mac vs PC debate either. Both have their strengths and weaknesses. Both good for different things. To argue one is better than the other is pathetic and like saying a BMW is streets ahead of a Merc. blah blah blah buy what you want and get on with life.
My post was just to educate that I have got viruses on Mac. And in MY experience Macs have performed better than Windows.
blah blah blah
Guvernator said:
A lot of my statements where general without getting into boring symantecs. Linux is a Unix clone but more people are familiar with the term Linux so I used that name instead.
Viruses and virus removal software are an issue on both platforms but Windows is effected more simply because more people tend to target Windows machines, there are a lot more of them and the Windows OS has a larger attack surface. I've had more problems with viruses on Windows then on Mac's, that doesn't make Mac's somehow better, it's just the way it is due to the above. It's just one of but not the only reason why Mac laptops tend to have a longer useful life without having to do a full re-install which was the real point I was trying to make.
WIndows 10 is more efficient but it's probably the first OS that is less of a system hog than it's predecessor and most software you run on Windows gets bigger and more power hungry with each version so again without getting into symantecs, my statement holds true that newer versions of software usually bloat and need more power.
You've quoted my Mac's don't run taxing software and skipped the bit of the sentence immediately afterwards where I acknowledge people use them in the work environment to do intensive editing work.
My mistake though, I forgot I was writing on PH where pedantry and spelling mistakes matter more than the general gist of the posts.
It's like listening to a Trump press conference.Viruses and virus removal software are an issue on both platforms but Windows is effected more simply because more people tend to target Windows machines, there are a lot more of them and the Windows OS has a larger attack surface. I've had more problems with viruses on Windows then on Mac's, that doesn't make Mac's somehow better, it's just the way it is due to the above. It's just one of but not the only reason why Mac laptops tend to have a longer useful life without having to do a full re-install which was the real point I was trying to make.
WIndows 10 is more efficient but it's probably the first OS that is less of a system hog than it's predecessor and most software you run on Windows gets bigger and more power hungry with each version so again without getting into symantecs, my statement holds true that newer versions of software usually bloat and need more power.
You've quoted my Mac's don't run taxing software and skipped the bit of the sentence immediately afterwards where I acknowledge people use them in the work environment to do intensive editing work.
My mistake though, I forgot I was writing on PH where pedantry and spelling mistakes matter more than the general gist of the posts.
Alternative facts?
Guvernator said:
A lot of my statements where general without getting into boring symantecs.
<snip>
My mistake though, I forgot I was writing on PH where pedantry and spelling mistakes matter more than the general gist of the posts.
"semantics" - Which is all to do with meaning, the very thing you're complaining I'd missed.<snip>
My mistake though, I forgot I was writing on PH where pedantry and spelling mistakes matter more than the general gist of the posts.
Agree with you about why virus writers target Windows, though.
Welcome to the brotherhood!
If there's any cash left in the piggy bank, I can recommend this Dell Hub: https://www.businessdirect.bt.com/products/dell-ad... for your Ethernet and HDMI needs and a USB-3 adapter or 2: https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B01EL4PVFE
If you miss the MagSafe connector, this is the Snapnator kickstarter project I mentioned in an earlier post: https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/436147229/sna...
If there's any cash left in the piggy bank, I can recommend this Dell Hub: https://www.businessdirect.bt.com/products/dell-ad... for your Ethernet and HDMI needs and a USB-3 adapter or 2: https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B01EL4PVFE
If you miss the MagSafe connector, this is the Snapnator kickstarter project I mentioned in an earlier post: https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/436147229/sna...
mikef said:
Welcome to the brotherhood!
If there's any cash left in the piggy bank, I can recommend this Dell Hub: https://www.businessdirect.bt.com/products/dell-ad... for your Ethernet and HDMI needs and a USB-3 adapter or 2: https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B01EL4PVFE
If you miss the MagSafe connector, this is the Snapnator kickstarter project I mentioned in an earlier post: https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/436147229/sna...
Thanks will have a look at them.If there's any cash left in the piggy bank, I can recommend this Dell Hub: https://www.businessdirect.bt.com/products/dell-ad... for your Ethernet and HDMI needs and a USB-3 adapter or 2: https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B01EL4PVFE
If you miss the MagSafe connector, this is the Snapnator kickstarter project I mentioned in an earlier post: https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/436147229/sna...
Dint even think about getting a USB 3 adapter from amazon. Just got the apple one. Might return it and get the one from Amazon
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