New ultrabook - but which one?

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Discussion

Pulse

Original Poster:

10,922 posts

217 months

Wednesday 22nd March 2017
quotequote all
I really need to replace my MacBook Air at some point. It's been going for 6.5 years, and done well, but it doesn't do a few things I'd like. The good thing is, anything after the MBA will be an upgrade (spec-wise, anyway)!

I've looked at the usual suspects, starting with the MacBook Pro. Considerations are:

MacBook Pro - Familiar, fantastic build, but 6th gen and not VFM - top model coming in at £2800!
Lenovo X1 Carbon - Just been updated with 7th gen, but expensive and perhaps has things I don't need, like the LTE and security elements.
Microsoft Surface Book - Book 2 is due in April I'm led to believe, and it doesn't necessarily float my boat, but build is lovely.
HP Spectre 13 (not the X360, I worry about those hinges!) - Looks good value, and I may be able to get a further discount. Very slim, too. Reviews say it's noisy though?
Dell XPS 13 - Lovely form factor, and pretty good VFM - the top model comes in at £1560 for me.

My three concerns with moving away from Apple are:

- Will I get the same build quality somewhere else? Also, whilst something like the XPS 13 looks great, I don't fancy worn out keyboards/trackpads/wrist area, where my MBA still looks brand new due to the all aluminium body.
- Whilst the specs of the Apple machines are much lower, is there an argument to say they perform better due to optimisation of the OS? (This is a question, not a suggestion) But also I understand they may perform far better in other ways - battery life for example.
- Will I miss the OS? Well, only time will tell on that front, but I'm no Apple fanboy, and Win10 looks good.

In order of price (roughly, anyway), starting with cheapest first: HP, Dell, Microsoft, Lenovo, Apple.

I'd love to hear others' views. I don't want to lumber myself with something rubbish, and would ideally like something to last the same amount of time my MBA has (but an aim of 4+ would be fine).

Bullett

10,873 posts

183 months

Wednesday 22nd March 2017
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What do you need it to do?


mickytruelove

420 posts

110 months

Wednesday 22nd March 2017
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I bought a XPS 13 over a year ago and its still looks like new.

The only thing is the screen in a finger print magnet with have the touch screen. I thought i wouldn't use the touch screen and really just wanted the higher resolution but it seems i used it all the time as i tried to use a different laptop the other day and wondered what was wrong with it.

If you get the top spec i7 i think it would be good for long time. I used solidworks on it and it doesnt struggle. Doesnt like playing battlefield though. not one bit lol.

IanJ9375

1,467 posts

215 months

Wednesday 22nd March 2017
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I jumped at a work offer to buy HP Spectre Pro 13" (non-360 type) for £700 at that price it was a bargain! (Cheapest I'd found it for was £1200ish at Costco). This was a replacement to a Dell XPS L501X 15"

It's got a lovely feel to it, the backlit keyboard is pretty nice to use (not always the case on devices as thin as this).
The RAM being fused on the board might not appeal to some but it didn't bother me.

The gold rear end is a bit marmite, does show fingerprints easily etc

Decided to get the matching HP Spectre mouse to go with it


RE Noisy, it isn't in general but it seems to have the odd moment where it goes in to some sort of cooldown overdrive - when it does that it does grab attention.

Edited by IanJ9375 on Wednesday 22 March 15:52


Edited by IanJ9375 on Wednesday 22 March 15:55

zippy3x

1,308 posts

266 months

Wednesday 22nd March 2017
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Pulse said:
Microsoft Surface Book - Book 2 is due in April I'm led to believe, and it doesn't necessarily float my boat, but build is lovely.
The other Surface Book 2 rumour is that it's going to be a traditional clamshell type laptop. I.e. not detachable.

Another extrapolation of a rumour (aka probably totally made up smile) is that the new Surface Pro 5 may have a proper laptop keyboard as well as / instead of the type cover they have now. That might explain why they went traditional laptop with the Book 2 (if they do).

IMHO the Surface Book is the most premium of the Windows laptops. In your shoes I would definitely be waiting to see if there are new Surface devices out in April.

Edited by zippy3x on Wednesday 22 March 16:44

bloomen

6,852 posts

158 months

Wednesday 22nd March 2017
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I've had a couple of Asus UX305 type things. All metal and considerably cheaper.

AJB88

12,265 posts

170 months

Wednesday 22nd March 2017
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Pulse said:
but it doesn't do a few things I'd like.
You need to let us know what these are!

daemon

35,724 posts

196 months

Wednesday 22nd March 2017
quotequote all
Pulse said:
I really need to replace my MacBook Air at some point. It's been going for 6.5 years, and done well, but it doesn't do a few things I'd like. The good thing is, anything after the MBA will be an upgrade (spec-wise, anyway)!

I've looked at the usual suspects, starting with the MacBook Pro. Considerations are:

MacBook Pro - Familiar, fantastic build, but 6th gen and not VFM - top model coming in at £2800!
Lenovo X1 Carbon - Just been updated with 7th gen, but expensive and perhaps has things I don't need, like the LTE and security elements.
Microsoft Surface Book - Book 2 is due in April I'm led to believe, and it doesn't necessarily float my boat, but build is lovely.
HP Spectre 13 (not the X360, I worry about those hinges!) - Looks good value, and I may be able to get a further discount. Very slim, too. Reviews say it's noisy though?
Dell XPS 13 - Lovely form factor, and pretty good VFM - the top model comes in at £1560 for me.

My three concerns with moving away from Apple are:

- Will I get the same build quality somewhere else? Also, whilst something like the XPS 13 looks great, I don't fancy worn out keyboards/trackpads/wrist area, where my MBA still looks brand new due to the all aluminium body.
- Whilst the specs of the Apple machines are much lower, is there an argument to say they perform better due to optimisation of the OS? (This is a question, not a suggestion) But also I understand they may perform far better in other ways - battery life for example.
- Will I miss the OS? Well, only time will tell on that front, but I'm no Apple fanboy, and Win10 looks good.

In order of price (roughly, anyway), starting with cheapest first: HP, Dell, Microsoft, Lenovo, Apple.

I'd love to hear others' views. I don't want to lumber myself with something rubbish, and would ideally like something to last the same amount of time my MBA has (but an aim of 4+ would be fine).
Try www.dell.co.uk/outlet and search for the XPS 13 there. You can usually save 30% over list price which makes the price of them a lot more palatable.

anonymous-user

53 months

Wednesday 22nd March 2017
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Pulse

Original Poster:

10,922 posts

217 months

Wednesday 22nd March 2017
quotequote all
AJB88 said:
Pulse said:
but it doesn't do a few things I'd like.
You need to let us know what these are!
Noted. But by this, I meant it's really old/slow now.

- Decent battery life - over 6 hours certainly, but the more the better. Currently I get... nothing (over 1000 cycles).
- Able to edit my GoPro footage (1080). My MBA won't even run the videos, let alone edit them.
- Less likely, but I'd like to go back to messing around in Photoshop. Not even tried, as it's not worth it.
- Able to run a decent resolution monitor (ideally two, but not essential). I'm thinking of either 2x27s or an ultrawide. My MBA can maybe run a CRT from the 90s.
- Basically, just be a whole lot more powerful, so it lasts a decent few years.


Pulse

Original Poster:

10,922 posts

217 months

Wednesday 22nd March 2017
quotequote all
daemon said:
Try www.dell.co.uk/outlet and search for the XPS 13 there. You can usually save 30% over list price which makes the price of them a lot more palatable.
They have one there, brand new (albeit last year's model - 6th gen, no QHD+) for under £800. That doesn't sound too bad. I wonder if I'd miss the extra power and the nice screen though.

Vaud

50,289 posts

154 months

Wednesday 22nd March 2017
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I'm a massive Apple fan... 6 year old MacBook Pro, iMac, etc. However, my wife has a new X1 and I'm seriously impressed. Light, nice keyboard, good screen. Feels right for long term use, a nice product.

daemon

35,724 posts

196 months

Wednesday 22nd March 2017
quotequote all
Pulse said:
daemon said:
Try www.dell.co.uk/outlet and search for the XPS 13 there. You can usually save 30% over list price which makes the price of them a lot more palatable.
They have one there, brand new (albeit last year's model - 6th gen, no QHD+) for under £800. That doesn't sound too bad. I wonder if I'd miss the extra power and the nice screen though.
I would keep checking the site several times a day. They add new stock periodically. I'd wait on the spec you want - they will come up

mikef

4,826 posts

250 months

Wednesday 22nd March 2017
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I have a Dell XPS13 9350, which is the best Windows ultra book I've used. Fully loaded came to £1,800. I also have a 2016 MacBook Pro, the £2,800 model mentioned earlier. I'd say the Mac is worth the difference in price; the build quality is a world apart, for a start.

Murph7355

37,651 posts

255 months

Wednesday 22nd March 2017
quotequote all
Pulse said:
...
Dell XPS 13 - Lovely form factor, and pretty good VFM - the top model comes in at £1560 for me.
Presumably you're spec'ing a 1Tb SSD?

I bought a 512Gb, 16Gb RAM, top spec i7 they offer and QHD+ touchscreen (and 3yr on site warranty) for around 1,300 in November, having deliberated as you are.

Pulse said:
...
- Will I get the same build quality somewhere else? Also, whilst something like the XPS 13 looks great, I don't fancy worn out keyboards/trackpads/wrist area, where my MBA still looks brand new due to the all aluminium body....
Only had mine for 5mths or so, but so far so good. It feels like it will survive just fine.

My last Macbook (a 2011 Air) actually suffered from worn out keys. First Mac I had that did this. It had 2x power supplies in the 6yrs I had it due to fraying cables - something that has happened on every Mac laptop I've owned! I've been noticing Apple quality slide for a few years now.

Pulse said:
...
- Whilst the specs of the Apple machines are much lower, is there an argument to say they perform better due to optimisation of the OS? (This is a question, not a suggestion) But also I understand they may perform far better in other ways - battery life for example.
...
To an extent that argument works, but not enough to counter the comprehensive spec improvements of the Dell.

And to bash Apple a little more, I've also found s (swear filter. Really! It's not racist, at east not in this context!) in the armour of OS X lately. Software updates are at least as frequent as Windows 10 and found myself regularly needing to repair permissions etc etc.

Battery life on the Dell is fine for my use, but I'm rarely too far from an outlet so rarely need to test it. These things always depend usage mode anyway. I would say the 7hr tested figure is probably about right. Maybe more.

Pulse said:
...
- Will I miss the OS? Well, only time will tell on that front, but I'm no Apple fanboy, and Win10 looks good.
There are elements that I miss. Gesture support isn't as polished on Windows, which I think is mostly software related. And you may find you need to buy some software or look for alternatives due to the change in OS. But IME this can be done relatively cheaply. The inbuilt/free a/v software and firewall seem to be doing their jobs very unobtrusively.

The days of either OS being an absolute dog are over IME.

The QHD screen is awesome. I think it's a match for the Macbook line up. The touchscreen facility is surprisingly handy at times (and gestures work much more smoothly on it than on the trackpad).

The keyboard is better than the latest generation Macbooks, but not as nice to use as the old generation Apples. The keys are a little small and made out of a textured material that's a bit like a blackboard in feel so catch that wrong and it grates smile The action is also a bit stiff - I find myself with more typos on it, mainly down to key size and the need to properly tap a key. But that might loosen up. Backlighting is as good as Apple's.

The trackpad is a similar story - as good as the fake click Apples but not as good as earlier ones. It's a bit stiff to click (may loosen up). It's also a bit smaller than Apple's, but that's restricted by the footprint.

Connectivity beats the Macbook line up.

Overall I'm very happy with it. It's not without it's foibles, BUT you have a Macbook Pro performance bracket machine in an 11" Macbook Air footprint but with a 13" touchscreen. All for half the price of an equivalent Macbook Pro.

Unless money is zero consideration or you use software not available on Windows I can't really see why anyone would buy a new Macbook Pro. If Apple had kept the old style keyboards, if they'd gone full touch rather than faff with touchbar, if they'd put the latest spec internals in them and charge at least 33% less then they would have a much more compelling machine.

As it stands, the Dell is a good replacement that I doubt will disappoint you.

daemon

35,724 posts

196 months

Wednesday 22nd March 2017
quotequote all
Murph7355 said:
Presumably you're spec'ing a 1Tb SSD?

I bought a 512Gb, 16Gb RAM, top spec i7 they offer and QHD+ touchscreen (and 3yr on site warranty) for around 1,300 in November, having deliberated as you are.
I think prices of consumer electronics has went up generally since the tail end of last year, plus i'm not seeing a 1TB SSD XPS 13 available?

daemon

35,724 posts

196 months

Wednesday 22nd March 2017
quotequote all
Pulse said:
daemon said:
Try www.dell.co.uk/outlet and search for the XPS 13 there. You can usually save 30% over list price which makes the price of them a lot more palatable.
They have one there, brand new (albeit last year's model - 6th gen, no QHD+) for under £800. That doesn't sound too bad. I wonder if I'd miss the extra power and the nice screen though.
Some resellers selling outlet stock on ebay - i7, kaby lake, 16GB, QHD+, Win10 Pro from around £1200 ish...

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Dell-XPS-13-9360-3-5-i7-...

daemon

35,724 posts

196 months

Wednesday 22nd March 2017
quotequote all
mikef said:
I have a Dell XPS13 9350, which is the best Windows ultra book I've used. Fully loaded came to £1,800. I also have a 2016 MacBook Pro, the £2,800 model mentioned earlier. I'd say the Mac is worth the difference in price; the build quality is a world apart, for a start.
Thats a serious amount of money for a laptop. I'm a bit of a techno geek and an IT contractor using my laptop daily on client site and i struggle to justify breaking £1,000 for a laptop. I've a 2016 HP Envy i7, SSD, B&O sound, etc, which was the top model in its time and it cost me around £750 from memory.

I'll probably upgrade it to a XPS13 with a spec of i7, 16GB, QHD+ and 512GB SSD and am expecting to pay maybe £1000 ish on outlet for one.


mikeiow

5,287 posts

129 months

Thursday 23rd March 2017
quotequote all
daemon said:
Thats a serious amount of money for a laptop. I'm a bit of a techno geek and an IT contractor using my laptop daily on client site and i struggle to justify breaking £1,000 for a laptop. I've a 2016 HP Envy i7, SSD, B&O sound, etc, which was the top model in its time and it cost me around £750 from memory.

I'll probably upgrade it to a XPS13 with a spec of i7, 16GB, QHD+ and 512GB SSD and am expecting to pay maybe £1000 ish on outlet for one.
I became a mac fan (not fanboi...still many things irritate me about Apple!) a few years ago based mostly on the quality of Mac v the work Lenovo, Fujitsu or IBM..... I feel it is slipping a bit nowadays, & windows boxes do look a bit better, but still the hours I spend (many each day!) on it serve to remind me why I moved!
Had a problem last year that meant I was back to my lenovo....it was like night and day! I suspect moving back now would leave me missing things.....

Boylston

144 posts

190 months

Thursday 23rd March 2017
quotequote all
I have a new Carbon X1 (basic spec - core i5) from work and a new Dell XPS 13 (full spec'd, 4k screen, core i7, pci ssd) for personal usage.

Both are excellent, but they feel quite different.

XPS 13 is great and very rich in features speed and capability. 4k screen is amazing. But feels heavy.

The Carbon X1 feels more plain, but is feels lighter and I prefer the keyboard.

Either are excellent.

Simon