Apple... is it going rotten..?
Discussion
Trommel said:
I'm still not sure how an organisation like Apple could ever let a problem like the antenna issue (if that is what is being experienced) even come into existence. It's inconceivable that it would not be noted as a problem at the ideas stage, let alone once they had started thinking about how it would work and look.
How? Because Steve Jobs is a lover of form over virtually everything else. With his history of wanting everything to look right at the expense of potential technical issues, its quite surprising its taken this long to happen. Its his love of getting everything looking so right that has been part of the success of Apple in the last few years, but equally it could turn out to be his downfall. But Apple have reached critical mass, and I think they'd need something considerably more major to happen to break their grip on the market.TuxRacer said:
I wouldn't use the same password for sites with different levels of importance. If Pistonheads gets hacked I don't want them getting into my email and then internet banking.
Yes,sorry, I was not quite accurate with my statement, important stuff has a variation of the same password. Additional characters. The 2 websites themselves, and the email account linked to them. Basically, the prob with wildly varying passwords, is that you either write them down, or, forget them. I speak from considerable experience, in forgetting them. Plus of course writing them down is the biggest risk of all.
I've been using this practise for near 10 yrs now...and had no probs at all.As long as the password follows certain criteria , your only real danger is as stated, a site you use being hacked.
As for Apple, I've been astounded as to how dictatorial they are...My daughter gave me an ipod, and I was amazed at how much control Apple exercises on its operation. Its left me with the thought, that I will never willingly buy an Apple product.
Incidentally, speaking of the ipod. I run XP, and I've experience of itunes, not letting IE run. In several cases , I've tried to open an IE screen, and nothings happened....I close itunes, and up pops the IE browser....anyone else had that?
tinman0 said:
off_again said:
Users need to know that a good strong password is essential.
I find the sanctimony about passwords to be nauseating at best.If you deal with IT security, the last thing you want is someone getting in to your stuff. Doesn't help your kudos really...
Cheese Mechanic said:
Plus of course writing them down is the biggest risk of all.
I disagree. Even if you don't leave the paper somewhere 'secure' but just a post-it note on your desk, well, if someone can get to the post-it they can probably get hold of your password anyway. Whereas for security across the wires it's more important that you have a 'strong' password.As I've said, I'm actually encouraged to write down my passwords at work (which isn't in a travel agency). Although admittedly not to leave them on the desk.
TuxRacer said:
Cheese Mechanic said:
Plus of course writing them down is the biggest risk of all.
I disagree. Even if you don't leave the paper somewhere 'secure' but just a post-it note on your desk, well, if someone can get to the post-it they can probably get hold of your password anyway. Whereas for security across the wires it's more important that you have a 'strong' password.As I've said, I'm actually encouraged to write down my passwords at work (which isn't in a travel agency). Although admittedly not to leave them on the desk.
As for writing down passwords, that's just asking for trouble. You can have all the security you want, but if people have your password, you're still going to let them in.
clonmult said:
How? Because Steve Jobs is a lover of form over virtually everything else. With his history of wanting everything to look right at the expense of potential technical issues, its quite surprising its taken this long to happen. Its his love of getting everything looking so right that has been part of the success of Apple in the last few years, but equally it could turn out to be his downfall
Not buying that. The alleged issue is far too basic never to have been flagged.off_again said:
tinman0 said:
off_again said:
Users need to know that a good strong password is essential.
I find the sanctimony about passwords to be nauseating at best.People should have strong passwords, and I agree. Let me just change my PH one, back in one moment.
My point is that it is unrealistic to expect 70 year olds who you are desperate to get onto internet banking (cause it saves the bank money) to remember umpteen passwords, expecting them to change it every 3 months, and not write the passwords down.
Same with PIN numbers - it is largely unrealistic to ask people to remember one for each card of their 12 cards. Simply isn't going to happen. People are going to write it down.
clonmult said:
Trommel said:
I'm still not sure how an organisation like Apple could ever let a problem like the antenna issue (if that is what is being experienced) even come into existence. It's inconceivable that it would not be noted as a problem at the ideas stage, let alone once they had started thinking about how it would work and look.
How? Because Steve Jobs is a lover of form over virtually everything else. With his history of wanting everything to look right at the expense of potential technical issues, its quite surprising its taken this long to happen. Its his love of getting everything looking so right that has been part of the success of Apple in the last few years, but equally it could turn out to be his downfall. But Apple have reached critical mass, and I think they'd need something considerably more major to happen to break their grip on the market.http://www.theregister.co.uk/2010/07/07/apple_itun...
article said:
Apple has confirmed that iTunes accounts were compromised to make fraudulent purchases, and has banned the developer at the centre of the scam.
Thuat Nguyen managed to briefly push 42 of his releases into the top 50 book apps in the US iTunes Store last week, triggering suspicions of foul play. After earlier suspending the Vietnamese developer's account, Apple has brought the ban-hammer down on Nguyen for violations of its Developer Program License Agreement, TechRadar reports.
In a statement, Apple said the 400 accounts were compromised to make fraudulent purchases. "If your credit card or iTunes password is stolen and used on iTunes we recommend that you contact your financial institution and inquire about cancelling the card and issuing a chargeback for any unauthorised transactions," Apple said.
Security firms reckon the scam bears the hallmarks of a phishing attack, where victims are tricked into handing over login credentials.
Apple, meanwhile, is keen to stress that it was individual accounts, rather than the iTunes Store itself, that were affected by the breach. Even so Apple has promised to review the security of its servers and to tighten controls, the BBC reports. ®
Thuat Nguyen managed to briefly push 42 of his releases into the top 50 book apps in the US iTunes Store last week, triggering suspicions of foul play. After earlier suspending the Vietnamese developer's account, Apple has brought the ban-hammer down on Nguyen for violations of its Developer Program License Agreement, TechRadar reports.
In a statement, Apple said the 400 accounts were compromised to make fraudulent purchases. "If your credit card or iTunes password is stolen and used on iTunes we recommend that you contact your financial institution and inquire about cancelling the card and issuing a chargeback for any unauthorised transactions," Apple said.
Security firms reckon the scam bears the hallmarks of a phishing attack, where victims are tricked into handing over login credentials.
Apple, meanwhile, is keen to stress that it was individual accounts, rather than the iTunes Store itself, that were affected by the breach. Even so Apple has promised to review the security of its servers and to tighten controls, the BBC reports. ®
tinman0 said:
off_again said:
tinman0 said:
off_again said:
Users need to know that a good strong password is essential.
I find the sanctimony about passwords to be nauseating at best.People should have strong passwords, and I agree. Let me just change my PH one, back in one moment.
My point is that it is unrealistic to expect 70 year olds who you are desperate to get onto internet banking (cause it saves the bank money) to remember umpteen passwords, expecting them to change it every 3 months, and not write the passwords down.
Same with PIN numbers - it is largely unrealistic to ask people to remember one for each card of their 12 cards. Simply isn't going to happen. People are going to write it down.
The key is educating users rather than trying to force them into it, as this will just cause them to write passwords on post-its, use their DOB, etc, causing a net loss of security.
We also need to be aware that very few passwords are cracked these days. The vast majority are acquired via phishing and other similar means, where the strongest password in the world will not help. Users need to know not to share passwords between important sites. Internet Banking, Email, Etc, must always have their own password so that if one is compromised then it will not allow access to the others. I do think that in addition to these a single shared password is acceptable for low risk sites (e.g. forums, news sites, etc) that you only visit occasionally.
Mr Will said:
The key is educating users rather than trying to force them into it, as this will just cause them to write passwords on post-its, use their DOB, etc, causing a net loss of security.
We also need to be aware that very few passwords are cracked these days. The vast majority are acquired via phishing and other similar means, where the strongest password in the world will not help. Users need to know not to share passwords between important sites. Internet Banking, Email, Etc, must always have their own password so that if one is compromised then it will not allow access to the others. I do think that in addition to these a single shared password is acceptable for low risk sites (e.g. forums, news sites, etc) that you only visit occasionally.
Educating, yeah. Good luck with that. I have zero faith in users ever being expected to remember a schema for their passwords. The bright ones will, the dumbs will continue to write them underneath the keyboard.We also need to be aware that very few passwords are cracked these days. The vast majority are acquired via phishing and other similar means, where the strongest password in the world will not help. Users need to know not to share passwords between important sites. Internet Banking, Email, Etc, must always have their own password so that if one is compromised then it will not allow access to the others. I do think that in addition to these a single shared password is acceptable for low risk sites (e.g. forums, news sites, etc) that you only visit occasionally.
Totally agree with you about passwords being cracked. My PH password until yesterday was "password" lol. That's because my general password is 9 letters long and originally PH was limited to 8 letters.
Phishing is a whole different thing. I've seen first had at people responding to phishing scams. Worked with Surrey Police many years ago on some of it. When we got a take down on a website, it went down immediately depriving the scammers of the information people were keying in. They were keying in from a page in their email that was hosted elsewhere or maybe in the email (I dunno, assuming it was an Outlook thing), but the cgi was executed on our server.
Disable the server and the scammer doesn't get the info.
Didn't stop us tailing the main error log file for the whole server though (only i could watch that of course). Watched it one Saturday afternoon for entertainment.
IIRC, someone responded every 10 seconds (usually with a profanity). Every 30seconds we would get a full credit card number, every 45 seconds we would get the full credit card and expiry and the number on the back, and every 90 seconds we got a full credit card, expiry, number on back, address, and best of all - the PIN number. We watched that log for 4 hours.
Some users are as dumb as a house brick.
tinman0 said:
IIRC, someone responded every 10 seconds (usually with a profanity)
Ooops, that will be me then. Not every time, but when I get the chance I do like to respond to phishing emails with a string of profanity and humourous-in-my-head comments. It does nothing in reality, but maybe its sufficient to screw up the system somehow. You never know I suppose. Oddly though I get virtually no phishing any more - either personal or work email. Though got a convincing one the other day about my Microsoft LiveID - which I never use, so its obvious. Still, getting better, more targetted and specific in nature. Scammers are being VERY targetted these days.tinman0 said:
Every 30seconds we would get a full credit card number, every 45 seconds we would get the full credit card and expiry and the number on the back, and every 90 seconds we got a full credit card, expiry, number on back, address, and best of all - the PIN number. We watched that log for 4 hours.
Some users are as dumb as a house brick.
Yep - completely agree. The figures make for shocking reading these days. Something like 1 in 4 will be a victim of some sort of bank / credit card / online system fraud. Of that most will be via phishing, skimming or cloning. All of which depend on a certain degree of ignorance or lack of awareness on behalf of the consumer / customer. Some users are as dumb as a house brick.
off_again said:
tinman0 said:
Every 30seconds we would get a full credit card number, every 45 seconds we would get the full credit card and expiry and the number on the back, and every 90 seconds we got a full credit card, expiry, number on back, address, and best of all - the PIN number. We watched that log for 4 hours.
Some users are as dumb as a house brick.
Yep - completely agree. The figures make for shocking reading these days. Something like 1 in 4 will be a victim of some sort of bank / credit card / online system fraud. Of that most will be via phishing, skimming or cloning. All of which depend on a certain degree of ignorance or lack of awareness on behalf of the consumer / customer. Some users are as dumb as a house brick.
And I have to admit, that when you are sitting there watching people send you their PINs, there was always that temptation " | mail tinman@somewhere", buy a card writer, and some blanks and spend the next couple of months visiting cash machines all over the world.
Cheese Mechanic said:
Password discipline is very, very easy. You use the same password for everything.
You ensure it contains one number at least. You change that number every month, for everything.
Just in case you forget your number....You have a number on your phone...You change the end number along with the others.
Its all about using you head. It works, I assure you.
As for Apple, others can use them, I never will. They use a business model from the computing 70's and 80's...it was s
t then , its still a rip off now.
That's a rubbish system!You ensure it contains one number at least. You change that number every month, for everything.
Just in case you forget your number....You have a number on your phone...You change the end number along with the others.
Its all about using you head. It works, I assure you.
As for Apple, others can use them, I never will. They use a business model from the computing 70's and 80's...it was s
t then , its still a rip off now. Edited by Tonsko on Thursday 8th July 12:11
Oakey said:
My biggest issue with Apple is their pricing, I just can't see the justification in price differences between 16, 32 and 64Gb models. nearly £200 more for a 64Gb iPad over 16Gb iPad? Really?
I think it stems from the fact that a lot of their stuff is in house built and designed unlike most other mainstream companies so costs more to develope. they recoup that cost by charging more by memory.Tallbut Buxomly said:
Oakey said:
My biggest issue with Apple is their pricing, I just can't see the justification in price differences between 16, 32 and 64Gb models. nearly £200 more for a 64Gb iPad over 16Gb iPad? Really?
I think it stems from the fact that a lot of their stuff is in house built and designed unlike most other mainstream companies so costs more to develope. they recoup that cost by charging more by memory.People with brains could buy a Sandisk one, the sheep could buy an Apple branded one...
Podie said:
Tallbut Buxomly said:
Oakey said:
My biggest issue with Apple is their pricing, I just can't see the justification in price differences between 16, 32 and 64Gb models. nearly £200 more for a 64Gb iPad over 16Gb iPad? Really?
I think it stems from the fact that a lot of their stuff is in house built and designed unlike most other mainstream companies so costs more to develope. they recoup that cost by charging more by memory.People with brains could buy a Sandisk one, the sheep could buy an Apple branded one...
But, take a look at what is possible with Symbian and Windows Mobile for a start - both platforms can be uniformly hacked, abused and totalled using memory cards and Apple wouldnt want to risk that. Its not a security thing, its a usability and consistency thing. This way Apple can ensure that the same model for management, media, files and applications is maintained and that everything operates consistently.
Oh, and they don't like holes in the case!
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