Huge mistake Nokia
Discussion
Pr1964 said:
I'm certain a huge number of old Nokia owners "PH special members excluded" would buy a well built classic mobile with a big screen "e-paper" and long battery life simple low consumption OS.
A huge number, eh?A "huge" number? Yeah, probably. I reckon the only reason no-one's gone after this particular "huge" market is because it's only your unique vision that could possibly realise a product that would obviously make giant buckets of cash.
Well, there's that, or there isn't actually a "huge" number of people who want such a thing, and existing products service their markets well enough.
Some bloke with an axe to grind on PH, or every phone manufacturer in the world?
Who could be more informed on what will sell?
I dunno. It's a tricky one.
Look, if you're certain, then you're only a few short steps away from wealth beyond your wildest dreams. Make a kickstarter, hire some technology people, and make it happen.
If course, if by "certain", you actually mean "it sounded totes convincing in the pub after five pints", you may want to reconsider committing anything more than a fiver to it.
Pr1964 said:
I've said it before it's akin to Coca Cola stopping making Coke and making Cherry Berry INSANE!!!!!
As for profitability and making a margin well now they have become just another smart phone maker we can all see that hasn’t exactly been a money spinner.
Drink Cherry Berry ……
I’m happy to stick with Coca Cola….
No. It's akin to Pepsi coming out with this new drink that takes the world by storm and eats a HUGE amount of Coca Cola's market share. Cola decide to try and do the smart thing and get that market share back by following the market.As for profitability and making a margin well now they have become just another smart phone maker we can all see that hasn’t exactly been a money spinner.
Drink Cherry Berry ……
I’m happy to stick with Coca Cola….
In reality there isn't much of a "business phone market" any more. People generally don't want one phone for work and carry around a second phone for personal use, they just want one phone. Which is why many people are getting a business phone any more, they just get a subsidy and then use their personal phone for business too. That way they can get the latest phone and a phone they actually want, instead of being lumped with a crappy Blackberry. So there is little point in a company making a phone just for the business market. Apple and Android have shown that you can build a phone for the general consumer and still take a share of the business market.
jammy_basturd said:
No. It's akin to Pepsi coming out with this new drink that takes the world by storm and eats a HUGE amount of Coca Cola's market share. Cola decide to try and do the smart thing and get that market share back by following the market.
In reality there isn't much of a "business phone market" any more. People generally don't want one phone for work and carry around a second phone for personal use, they just want one phone. Which is why many people are getting a business phone any more, they just get a subsidy and then use their personal phone for business too. That way they can get the latest phone and a phone they actually want, instead of being lumped with a crappy Blackberry. So there is little point in a company making a phone just for the business market. Apple and Android have shown that you can build a phone for the general consumer and still take a share of the business market.
"Crappy blackberry"? In fact they're so crappy that the majority of my colleagues who - when given the choice - went for an iPhone or SGS3 - are impatiently waiting for the day when we can change phones and go back to the Blackberry.In reality there isn't much of a "business phone market" any more. People generally don't want one phone for work and carry around a second phone for personal use, they just want one phone. Which is why many people are getting a business phone any more, they just get a subsidy and then use their personal phone for business too. That way they can get the latest phone and a phone they actually want, instead of being lumped with a crappy Blackberry. So there is little point in a company making a phone just for the business market. Apple and Android have shown that you can build a phone for the general consumer and still take a share of the business market.
Crappy device for some, but the battery life on my old BB was about 5x better than my 4S, it handled mail a lot better, voice quality was better. Things that I took for granted on the BB (total control over font size in mails) are not possible on iOS (without jailbreaking). Replying to a mail when 40% of your screen is taken up with a (naff) virtual keyboard is a pain.
And the really important fact - the old BB devices we used were nowhere near as fragile as the iPhone 4S or SGS3 that we're tending to use now. Seems like every other day I hear of someone else who's iPhone or SGS3 had the screen crack. Never seemed to be a problem on the BBs.
Pr1964 said:
CommanderJameson said:
A huge number, eh?
A "huge" number? Yeah, probably. I reckon the only reason no-one's gone after this particular "huge" market is because it's only your unique vision that could possibly realise a product that would obviously make giant buckets of cash.
Well, there's that, or there isn't actually a "huge" number of people who want such a thing, and existing products service their markets well enough.
Some bloke with an axe to grind on PH, or every phone manufacturer in the world?
Who could be more informed on what will sell?
I dunno. It's a tricky one.
Look, if you're certain, then you're only a few short steps away from wealth beyond your wildest dreams. Make a kickstarter, hire some technology people, and make it happen.
If course, if by "certain", you actually mean "it sounded totes convincing in the pub after five pints", you may want to reconsider committing anything more than a fiver to it.
If a Smart phone works for you then GREAT A "huge" number? Yeah, probably. I reckon the only reason no-one's gone after this particular "huge" market is because it's only your unique vision that could possibly realise a product that would obviously make giant buckets of cash.
Well, there's that, or there isn't actually a "huge" number of people who want such a thing, and existing products service their markets well enough.
Some bloke with an axe to grind on PH, or every phone manufacturer in the world?
Who could be more informed on what will sell?
I dunno. It's a tricky one.
Look, if you're certain, then you're only a few short steps away from wealth beyond your wildest dreams. Make a kickstarter, hire some technology people, and make it happen.
If course, if by "certain", you actually mean "it sounded totes convincing in the pub after five pints", you may want to reconsider committing anything more than a fiver to it.
But for me they’re amazing but frustration personified ….
Until a product “X phone” exists WE will never know.....
It's not going to be done by me it would take NOKIA.
The weird thing is the insanity at NOKIA has resulted in everything else BUT a Business focused numeric keyboard phone I thing they built the E52 which was a complete heap of junk and every one who bought one sent them back that made them decide the Numeric keypad mobile market was dead .
If Apple had done that then we wouldn't have the IPhone today .....
Key thing in any business is to know what you are good at
Nokia were good at numeric key pad mobile phones they should still make quality numeric mobile phones even if they run the win8 OS.
Nokia have left business users with little option either to buy an iPhone or continue using their old Nokia candy bar phones.
I see lots and lots of people still using old Nokia mobiles many who are in the same boat as me they’ve tried a touch smart which has died cracked or just frustrated them.
I find in incredible that there are no replacement handsets..
Totally counter to what we would expect “as all manufacturers are like sheep” or “maybe it’s a Macho thing?”
Nokia just Stopped!!! Making what they were the best at making.
I've said it before it's akin to Coca Cola stopping making Coke and making Cherry Berry INSANE!!!!!
As for profitability and making a margin well now they have become just another smart phone maker we can all see that hasn’t exactly been a money spinner.
Drink Cherry Berry ……
I’m happy to stick with Coca Cola….
fido said:
Pr1964 said:
I have the Nexus 4 too it's battery lasts 1/2 a day so becomes a paper weight from 1-3 onwards I then swap out the sim pure comedy....
So you went for a processor-hungry CrPrDroid phone, instead of an iPhone or Lumia 9xx? Whose fault is that? 
Pr1964,
To answer your original comment regarding the business pages on nokia.com, I actually got a reply from someone who manages business marketing. Without giving you precise details (which would be inappropriate) nokia.com is under continuous improvement and you can see some new-look stuff here which hasn't come across to the UK site yet: http://www.nokia.com/global/
In response to your sentiments about the devices you've used. These are my personal opinions and please treat them as such, but..
The Lumia series is a different kettle of fish, with a full-blown smartphone OS and very different hardware/software specifications and expectations from users. User expectation is an important point - it is quite typical to be charging a smartphone after 1-2 days use, depending on your usage patterns and I think most smartphone users expect this, even before Lumia was launched. It's part of what allows the great features that define smart phones.
However, that's not to say battery life isn't a consideration for us; on the contrary. Even at the application development level where I work, we monitor and test what impact our app has on battery life. Nokia are also innovating with things like wireless charging, to help mitigate the inconvenience of not having the week-long battery life that simpler phones have. A Lumia with a week of battery life while getting used would be nice, but as always we have to work within the limitations of the tech available.
Hopefully that covers your points.
Cheers,
Simon
To answer your original comment regarding the business pages on nokia.com, I actually got a reply from someone who manages business marketing. Without giving you precise details (which would be inappropriate) nokia.com is under continuous improvement and you can see some new-look stuff here which hasn't come across to the UK site yet: http://www.nokia.com/global/
In response to your sentiments about the devices you've used. These are my personal opinions and please treat them as such, but..
Pr1964 said:
I've tried many many nokia mobiles
6700 E51 which was pretty good. E52 rubbish etc etc etc
then ....
N8
Various Lumia all had such poor battery life I returned them all.
Asha 302 which is cheap and nasty plastic and qwerty .
So I'm now left with my trusty C5 and nothing currently available does what the C5 does ...
Battery life is an undoubtedly complex issue but comparing a C5 to a Lumia is a bit unfair, I think. They're a different class of device. A more accurate comparison would be the Asha 300, or the Asha 311 if you want a full touchscreen. They both have the same long battery life but better capabilities.6700 E51 which was pretty good. E52 rubbish etc etc etc
then ....
N8
Various Lumia all had such poor battery life I returned them all.
Asha 302 which is cheap and nasty plastic and qwerty .
So I'm now left with my trusty C5 and nothing currently available does what the C5 does ...
The Lumia series is a different kettle of fish, with a full-blown smartphone OS and very different hardware/software specifications and expectations from users. User expectation is an important point - it is quite typical to be charging a smartphone after 1-2 days use, depending on your usage patterns and I think most smartphone users expect this, even before Lumia was launched. It's part of what allows the great features that define smart phones.
However, that's not to say battery life isn't a consideration for us; on the contrary. Even at the application development level where I work, we monitor and test what impact our app has on battery life. Nokia are also innovating with things like wireless charging, to help mitigate the inconvenience of not having the week-long battery life that simpler phones have. A Lumia with a week of battery life while getting used would be nice, but as always we have to work within the limitations of the tech available.
Pr1964 said:
Would it be such a risk to make a handset with a numeric key pad
With a high res screen at say 3 inches and a big battery ?
This would depend on a lot of things. Developing a device is all down to whether it would generate the sales volume for a return on the investment. A device like this wouldn't be a Lumia device. If it was an S40 device, then the target market expects low-cost hardware, below the cost of the cheapest Lumias. a 3", high-res screen is at odds with that low cost, and the gap between Lumia and Asha is already narrowing. I think it would be too niche to justify, especially when the market trend is towards full touchscreen devices. That said, I don't know what the future holds for Nokia's hardware!With a high res screen at say 3 inches and a big battery ?
Pr1964 said:
How about an app which would ape the old S40 OS to keep it simple and fast to use?
S40 still runs on a lot of devices. See the Asha series, which is designed to meet the joint requirements of smartphone-like features, battery life, simplicity, and offer lower cost.Pr1964 said:
How about an e-paper screen giving a week + battery life ?
I think an e-paper screen would be too hard a compromise on other screen priorities; brightness, colour accuracy, responsiveness, refresh rate. Can you imagine playing Angry Birds on an e-paper screen? I doubt it would look good.Hopefully that covers your points.
Cheers,
Simon
Good post Simbu.
"A device like this wouldn't be a Lumia device. If it was an S40 device, then the target market expects low-cost hardware, below the cost of the cheapest Lumias. a 3", high-res screen is at odds with that low cost, and the gap between Lumia and Asha is already narrowing. I think it would be too niche to justify, especially when the market trend is towards full touchscreen devices."
This is the key point that Pr can't seem to process. The outlay of his ideal phone wouldn't bring a return.
"A device like this wouldn't be a Lumia device. If it was an S40 device, then the target market expects low-cost hardware, below the cost of the cheapest Lumias. a 3", high-res screen is at odds with that low cost, and the gap between Lumia and Asha is already narrowing. I think it would be too niche to justify, especially when the market trend is towards full touchscreen devices."
This is the key point that Pr can't seem to process. The outlay of his ideal phone wouldn't bring a return.
clonmult said:
simonrockman said:
I'm turning into a Nokia fan boy. I like my 925
Could you imagine what people would think of the 925 if they put a decent camera in there as well? They could start to become popular again ....Wait until the 11th
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