Potential new daily driver: RS4 B8 vs C63 AMG? Opinions?
Discussion
Audi drivers will probably post/read more in the Audi forum and Mercedes driver in the other...so I posted the thread in the two sections to get a more mixed opinions. I had been reading buying advice and some road test about both vehicles…seeking more opinions from owners and other petrol heads.
Some background info on my recent cars...and their purpose. My daily driver for the last eleven years is a BMW 325i estate (e46) from 2004 (full M-technic with a recently fitted Bilstein B-12). I also have a Z4M roadster from 2006 as a second fun & sun car. My Z4M is modified with CSL wheels, AP racing brakes and Bilstein PSS-10 suspension for my monthly visit to the Nurburgring and occasional trackday. It's a great street and track car with a perfect dual purpose. Like you see; I tend to keep my cars for a really long time and the next one I will buy will also stay for many years to come.
I wanted to buy a 3the car; and I was thinking of buying something that was more exotic then my Z4M and more at home on track straight from the box.... I was thinking of a Cayman GT4, Boxster Spyder when the were still available and a used Lotus Exige V6 S as a cheaper alternative. But recently the plans changed again; I need to replace my daily driver estate first… Buying an extra track & fun car is getting moved back and the Z4M is also staying for the moment.
So another daily driver...? At the end of last year I wanted to replace my 325i estate (e46) with a e91 335i (N55) estate and started the search. But it was almost impossible to find a recent e91 335i with N55 engine, manual transmission, NO X-drive, M-pack, Pro GPS, Audio upgrade, etc... X-drive on a BMW is stupid in my opinion and I hated the automatic transmission on the 335i. So after a long search with almost 0 result I was thinking; I'm keeping my old 325i as a daily for some extra years and I will buy an extra sports car that's more hardcore then my Z4M. But like I said; do to circumstances that plan changed also recently…and it got me thinking of getting a rather more special daily driver.
To replace my daily driver I now have a bigger budget then last year. I'm now thinking of replacing my old 325i with a used Audi RS4 Avant B8 or a used Mercedes C63 AMG estate (facelift model from mid 2011 with the newer MCT transmission and updated interior). I never use the rear seats of my 325i touring...the rear seats are always folded down...so they have no purpose for me. I only need the booth space of an estate and I love the look of an estate/wagon. The older RS4 B7 also crossed my mind…but it has some engine and suspension issues and I don't know if it is a safe and reliable bet for a daily driver?
The RS4 or C63 AMG will be transformed to light utility vehicle...don't know the exact name in English or that this feature exists in the UK? It means the rears seats of an estate will be removed permanently and there is a big flat floor in the booth with no rear seats. It also means there is almost zero roadtax to pay on the vehicle, my company can reclaim al the VAT and every car expense is deductible in my company expenses. These financial and tax benefits compensate for the higher price of the car and the bigger gasoline budget. In my "car"live I always wanted to own a V8 with no turbo's...so if I want to do this then I can not wait for to many years to buy one. These engines are a dying breed
My daily work vehicle does around 11.000miles a year with 50% slow city traffic and 50% highways. But which car would you choose and why? Which one is the most reliable, most fun, better drivers car and better all round daily vehicle. Yes; I know....I should testdrive both of them
What is the realistic MPG of the RS4, C63 AMG...? Somewhat the same as a e90 M3 V8 I presume? I lived with a borrowed e90 M3 for a week and the MPG of the car is something I could live with. The e90 M3 is a nice and fun car...but it's not an estate and I did not like the M-DKG transmission in city traffic. I also found that the M3 V8 was only enjoyable when driving fast.
Costs?
Any idea about the estimated annual maintenance cost of the RS4 and C63 AMG (without insurance and tax)?
RS4 B8
Last week I did a testdrive with a RS4 B8... I rather liked the car. Without RS logo's it looked rather understated and low profile. I think the RS4 B8 looks awesome from outside and inside. I love the look! The optional blacked-out sport exhaust also sounds rather nice. Normally I don't like auto gearboxes; but the S-tronic box was feeling rather good...it was nice in auto mode and nice when shifting the gears myself. The shifts are fast enough and felt really good on public road. This car will be my daily driver and not a track car so it does not have to be the fastest shifter and it also will be my first car with an automated transmission... There is no other choice with the RS4 B8 and C63 AMG. If they had a manual version I would look for that one.
Suspension and dynamic steering?
The RS4 suspension felt ok in comfort mode (the other settings are to hard for the street). The dynamic steering was the biggest disappointment of the complete car. In comfort it was to soft and slow, automatic was not great and in dynamic it was to artificial heavy. I don't know if it's something you need to get used to...but the steering feel was the baddest thing of the RS4. Also almost every used RS4 I have found on the market has the dynamic steering option...and even so...who says the standard RS4 steering has a better steering feel? Opinions?
Handling?
The quattro handling was like the car was on rails and grip levels were awesome on a typical autumn day. This also means the car is a little boring and does not give you that many driver thrills or involvement when driving at normal speeds... My Z4M and 325i are more fun and lively when driving at the same speeds and they are slower cars then the RS4.
C63AMG estate
Normally I'm not a big fan of Mercedes. The only cars they have that I like or maybe consider owing (if I had the money) are SLS black series, AMG GTS and the previous C63 AMG estate (the model I'm now looking at). Honestly; a couple of years a go I could never think I would even consider buying a Mercedes. For me; a Mercedes was something for really old people
I never liked them and I always found them boring to drive and to look at... Personal opinion! But the set-up of this model of C63 AMG has something that somewhat appeals me and I like the look more then any other generation of "normal" Mercedes model.
Price
Another point the C63 AMG has over the Audi RS4 B8 is that the used C63 AMG estate car's are cheaper on the used car market then a similar Audi RS4 B8. Prices of C63 AMG are lower because the engine is a real tax killer and less people want to buy them these days. The all new C63 AMG model is already available on the market where that the new RS4 will probably be launched in 2017. I live in Belgium so I will probably one in my country or pay a visit to Germany to find the car I want.
Look
From a visual point of view I think the C63 estate looks good and I can live with it. It's a typical Mercedes image with a more sporty look. It's certainly not ugly, but IMO the RS4 B8 looks better and is more understated for my eyes. The RS4 looks awesome, the C63 looks good. The facelift interior of the 2012 model also looks ok. But there is more then looks and numbers that define a lovely car for me. That M156 6.2L engine is awesome, the sound it makes and the idea of that big engine in a daily car is amazing and out of this world. I also love the simplicity of the total C63 AMG package. But how does a C63 feel in normal traffic...is it an entertaining car at every speed? On paper it sound great and looks like a way less complex car then the RS4 with al his setting that never hit a real 100% sweet spot.
Transmission?
Biggest question I ask myself and also the biggest downside in online reviews is the transmission... How is this MCT 7-speed transmission from the facelift C63 (modelyear 2012)...? How is it in auto mode and how fast and intuitive is it when shifting the gears yourself?
Brakes?
Is there a big difference in braking power between the normal C63 brakes and the red colored brakes from the optional performance package? What is exactly the difference between those two brake set-ups and is it worth looking for a car with the PP for the brake difference? If I would buy a C63 AMG I would definitely want the optional LSD or if not on the car I will get an aftermarket quaife LSD. The Performance Package also increases the power…but 336 kW (457 hp) on a daily street car is already more then enough for me… More power from the PP is nice, but it does not sound as a must have to me.
Options?
Are there any must have options on the C63 AMG facelift model? For me personally it seems that I would like; Harman Kardon surround sound, front and rear parking sensors, auto lifting trunk, 19" wheels (looks nicer), full leather, COMAND system with Media interface, LSD (or aftermarket Quaife).
Is there an option to get the chrome window surrounds and front grill in black and not chrome? Some kind of shadowline package? The AMG Performance Suspension seems only useful on track so not for my street usage. It seems that both suspension have the same ride height?
Yes; I need to testdrive a C63 AMG to find some things out for myself and I will do that...but opinions and thought of other owners and/or petrolheads are already welcome
Some background info on my recent cars...and their purpose. My daily driver for the last eleven years is a BMW 325i estate (e46) from 2004 (full M-technic with a recently fitted Bilstein B-12). I also have a Z4M roadster from 2006 as a second fun & sun car. My Z4M is modified with CSL wheels, AP racing brakes and Bilstein PSS-10 suspension for my monthly visit to the Nurburgring and occasional trackday. It's a great street and track car with a perfect dual purpose. Like you see; I tend to keep my cars for a really long time and the next one I will buy will also stay for many years to come.
I wanted to buy a 3the car; and I was thinking of buying something that was more exotic then my Z4M and more at home on track straight from the box.... I was thinking of a Cayman GT4, Boxster Spyder when the were still available and a used Lotus Exige V6 S as a cheaper alternative. But recently the plans changed again; I need to replace my daily driver estate first… Buying an extra track & fun car is getting moved back and the Z4M is also staying for the moment.
So another daily driver...? At the end of last year I wanted to replace my 325i estate (e46) with a e91 335i (N55) estate and started the search. But it was almost impossible to find a recent e91 335i with N55 engine, manual transmission, NO X-drive, M-pack, Pro GPS, Audio upgrade, etc... X-drive on a BMW is stupid in my opinion and I hated the automatic transmission on the 335i. So after a long search with almost 0 result I was thinking; I'm keeping my old 325i as a daily for some extra years and I will buy an extra sports car that's more hardcore then my Z4M. But like I said; do to circumstances that plan changed also recently…and it got me thinking of getting a rather more special daily driver.
To replace my daily driver I now have a bigger budget then last year. I'm now thinking of replacing my old 325i with a used Audi RS4 Avant B8 or a used Mercedes C63 AMG estate (facelift model from mid 2011 with the newer MCT transmission and updated interior). I never use the rear seats of my 325i touring...the rear seats are always folded down...so they have no purpose for me. I only need the booth space of an estate and I love the look of an estate/wagon. The older RS4 B7 also crossed my mind…but it has some engine and suspension issues and I don't know if it is a safe and reliable bet for a daily driver?
The RS4 or C63 AMG will be transformed to light utility vehicle...don't know the exact name in English or that this feature exists in the UK? It means the rears seats of an estate will be removed permanently and there is a big flat floor in the booth with no rear seats. It also means there is almost zero roadtax to pay on the vehicle, my company can reclaim al the VAT and every car expense is deductible in my company expenses. These financial and tax benefits compensate for the higher price of the car and the bigger gasoline budget. In my "car"live I always wanted to own a V8 with no turbo's...so if I want to do this then I can not wait for to many years to buy one. These engines are a dying breed
My daily work vehicle does around 11.000miles a year with 50% slow city traffic and 50% highways. But which car would you choose and why? Which one is the most reliable, most fun, better drivers car and better all round daily vehicle. Yes; I know....I should testdrive both of them
What is the realistic MPG of the RS4, C63 AMG...? Somewhat the same as a e90 M3 V8 I presume? I lived with a borrowed e90 M3 for a week and the MPG of the car is something I could live with. The e90 M3 is a nice and fun car...but it's not an estate and I did not like the M-DKG transmission in city traffic. I also found that the M3 V8 was only enjoyable when driving fast.
Costs?
Any idea about the estimated annual maintenance cost of the RS4 and C63 AMG (without insurance and tax)?
RS4 B8
Last week I did a testdrive with a RS4 B8... I rather liked the car. Without RS logo's it looked rather understated and low profile. I think the RS4 B8 looks awesome from outside and inside. I love the look! The optional blacked-out sport exhaust also sounds rather nice. Normally I don't like auto gearboxes; but the S-tronic box was feeling rather good...it was nice in auto mode and nice when shifting the gears myself. The shifts are fast enough and felt really good on public road. This car will be my daily driver and not a track car so it does not have to be the fastest shifter and it also will be my first car with an automated transmission... There is no other choice with the RS4 B8 and C63 AMG. If they had a manual version I would look for that one.
Suspension and dynamic steering?
The RS4 suspension felt ok in comfort mode (the other settings are to hard for the street). The dynamic steering was the biggest disappointment of the complete car. In comfort it was to soft and slow, automatic was not great and in dynamic it was to artificial heavy. I don't know if it's something you need to get used to...but the steering feel was the baddest thing of the RS4. Also almost every used RS4 I have found on the market has the dynamic steering option...and even so...who says the standard RS4 steering has a better steering feel? Opinions?
Handling?
The quattro handling was like the car was on rails and grip levels were awesome on a typical autumn day. This also means the car is a little boring and does not give you that many driver thrills or involvement when driving at normal speeds... My Z4M and 325i are more fun and lively when driving at the same speeds and they are slower cars then the RS4.
C63AMG estate
Normally I'm not a big fan of Mercedes. The only cars they have that I like or maybe consider owing (if I had the money) are SLS black series, AMG GTS and the previous C63 AMG estate (the model I'm now looking at). Honestly; a couple of years a go I could never think I would even consider buying a Mercedes. For me; a Mercedes was something for really old people
I never liked them and I always found them boring to drive and to look at... Personal opinion! But the set-up of this model of C63 AMG has something that somewhat appeals me and I like the look more then any other generation of "normal" Mercedes model.
Price
Another point the C63 AMG has over the Audi RS4 B8 is that the used C63 AMG estate car's are cheaper on the used car market then a similar Audi RS4 B8. Prices of C63 AMG are lower because the engine is a real tax killer and less people want to buy them these days. The all new C63 AMG model is already available on the market where that the new RS4 will probably be launched in 2017. I live in Belgium so I will probably one in my country or pay a visit to Germany to find the car I want.
Look
From a visual point of view I think the C63 estate looks good and I can live with it. It's a typical Mercedes image with a more sporty look. It's certainly not ugly, but IMO the RS4 B8 looks better and is more understated for my eyes. The RS4 looks awesome, the C63 looks good. The facelift interior of the 2012 model also looks ok. But there is more then looks and numbers that define a lovely car for me. That M156 6.2L engine is awesome, the sound it makes and the idea of that big engine in a daily car is amazing and out of this world. I also love the simplicity of the total C63 AMG package. But how does a C63 feel in normal traffic...is it an entertaining car at every speed? On paper it sound great and looks like a way less complex car then the RS4 with al his setting that never hit a real 100% sweet spot.
Transmission?
Biggest question I ask myself and also the biggest downside in online reviews is the transmission... How is this MCT 7-speed transmission from the facelift C63 (modelyear 2012)...? How is it in auto mode and how fast and intuitive is it when shifting the gears yourself?
Brakes?
Is there a big difference in braking power between the normal C63 brakes and the red colored brakes from the optional performance package? What is exactly the difference between those two brake set-ups and is it worth looking for a car with the PP for the brake difference? If I would buy a C63 AMG I would definitely want the optional LSD or if not on the car I will get an aftermarket quaife LSD. The Performance Package also increases the power…but 336 kW (457 hp) on a daily street car is already more then enough for me… More power from the PP is nice, but it does not sound as a must have to me.
Options?
Are there any must have options on the C63 AMG facelift model? For me personally it seems that I would like; Harman Kardon surround sound, front and rear parking sensors, auto lifting trunk, 19" wheels (looks nicer), full leather, COMAND system with Media interface, LSD (or aftermarket Quaife).
Is there an option to get the chrome window surrounds and front grill in black and not chrome? Some kind of shadowline package? The AMG Performance Suspension seems only useful on track so not for my street usage. It seems that both suspension have the same ride height?
Yes; I need to testdrive a C63 AMG to find some things out for myself and I will do that...but opinions and thought of other owners and/or petrolheads are already welcome
Edited by Franzino on Tuesday 17th November 14:11
olliete said:
How about a BMW E60 M5 touring?
I thought about that car…and the idea of a V10 in a daily car just sounds awesome and the M5 V10 is a really great piece of motorcar But i rather have a smaller 3-series, A4, C, and for me personally a 5 serie, A6, E class are to big (I don't need the space).Their are also some problems/issues with the M5 V10. The SMG gearbox is really awful in city traffic (in manual and auto) and is only enjoyable when driving fast on the highways or county roads. My daily car sees 50% city traffic (with traffic jams) and 50% highways. Their are also a lot of reliability issues with the SMG gearbox, the clutch and the V10 engine itself that can quickly turn into a big money pit… With my Z4M I'm also registered on a couple of dedicated BMW forums and almost every M5 V10 owner has sold his car do to the big and unforeseen expenses. Most ex-owners don't recommend buying, owning this car as a daily driven vehicle. The MPG in a C63 AMG and RS4 is not the best and I can live with that, but in a M5 V10 the MPG is even worse and a bit to much (in combination with the costs of keeping this car trouble free).
But when you see this video and you can drive on these roads then you think; hell yeah lovely car: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tXeIsHIejD0#t=217
It sounds like you've already formed your own opinion of the current RS4, what about the special edition 507 version of the previous C63 AMG? You will certainly get a lot more oversteer and general involvement than an "on rails" 4wd Audi.
Another leftfield choice, the Vauxhall VXR8 tourer...I would imagine that would be right up your street, with big v8, RWD..manual (I think)....
Just a thought. In truth there aren't many compact estate cars are there, that fit the brief now that BMW has shelved its glorious 6 cylinder cars. I myself am looking for an upgrade soon and with my modest budget, a second hand 330i sits high on the list! :-)
Franzino said:
What is the realistic MPG of the C63 AMG...?
About 17mpg around town, 23-24mpg on a 70-85mph motorway drive with some stop-start traffic.Franzino said:
Costs?
Any idea about the estimated annual maintenance cost of the C63 AMG (without insurance and tax)?
Not sure about your country but in the UK a service plan is around £40 per month covering regular servicing and is currently thrown in for two years at a Merc dealerAny idea about the estimated annual maintenance cost of the C63 AMG (without insurance and tax)?
Franzino said:
Transmission?
Biggest question I ask myself and also the biggest downside in online reviews is the transmission... How is this MCT 7-speed transmission from the facelift C63 (modelyear 2012)...? How is it in auto mode and how fast and intuitive is it when shifting the gears yourself?
In C auto mode it's smooth and relaxing in stop-start traffic. In the S/S+ modes it's quick to change, revs out to the line and blips on down changes. In manual mode it won't drop two gears straight away, relatively quick to drop one but it's not as sharp as a manual.Biggest question I ask myself and also the biggest downside in online reviews is the transmission... How is this MCT 7-speed transmission from the facelift C63 (modelyear 2012)...? How is it in auto mode and how fast and intuitive is it when shifting the gears yourself?
Franzino said:
Brakes?
Is there a big difference in braking power between the normal C63 brakes and the red colored brakes from the optional performance package? What is exactly the difference between those two brake set-ups and is it worth looking for a car with the PP for the brake difference?
The red PP brakes are composite discs which I believe don't have better power but are more resistant to fade on track for example. They just cost a lot more.Is there a big difference in braking power between the normal C63 brakes and the red colored brakes from the optional performance package? What is exactly the difference between those two brake set-ups and is it worth looking for a car with the PP for the brake difference?
Franzino said:
Options?
Are there any must have options on the C63 AMG facelift model? For me personally it seems that I would like; Harman Kardon surround sound, front and rear parking sensors, auto lifting trunk, 19" wheels (looks nicer), full leather, COMAND system with Media interface, LSD (or aftermarket Quaife).
For me I wanted the list that you have apart from the auto lifting trunk, mine has it and I wondered how I ever lived without one. Mine doesn't have the HK sound system and it sounds good. Have never heard the HK so not sure how much better it is.Are there any must have options on the C63 AMG facelift model? For me personally it seems that I would like; Harman Kardon surround sound, front and rear parking sensors, auto lifting trunk, 19" wheels (looks nicer), full leather, COMAND system with Media interface, LSD (or aftermarket Quaife).
Hangcheck said:
The red PP brakes are composite discs which I believe don't have better power but are more resistant to fade on track for example. They just cost a lot more.
I don't think "composite" brake discs make any difference to stopping power - the name comes from the fact that they're usually a steel disc with a spoked aluminium bell. The main reason for this is that it reduces heat soak for the wheel bearings when running at high temperatures. It also more than doubles the price of the discs...You mentioned a B7 in your post, I ran one as a daily for 12 months with no issue and loved it. However it's an older platform (2005 launch if memory serves me correctly), so the cars you are looking at have a more modern interior and better toys...if that bothers you. My choice would be the C63 as I think it will be an all time great, and now part of a dying breed.
jdwoodbury said:
You mentioned a B7 in your post, I ran one as a daily for 12 months with no issue and loved it. However it's an older platform (2005 launch if memory serves me correctly), so the cars you are looking at have a more modern interior and better toys...if that bothers you. My choice would be the C63 as I think it will be an all time great, and now part of a dying breed.
My outgoing car (BMW 325i) is from 2004/2005…so I prefer something a little more modern as my daily… I will still have my lovely old school manual Z4M when I want to drive something from de mid years 2000. Also; I'm not in the mood to hassle with car…and the B7 has some issues with the carbon build up, the brakes, the leaking suspension… I'm worried it will be a time consuming thing to keep a B7 running perfectly (as a daily car).W8aMinute said:
I don't think "composite" brake discs make any difference to stopping power - the name comes from the fact that they're usually a steel disc with a spoked aluminium bell. The main reason for this is that it reduces heat soak for the wheel bearings when running at high temperatures. It also more than doubles the price of the discs...
If I buy a C63 AMG it will be my daily-street car and it will not see any track. There is probably not a lot of purpose in to having the brake upgrade…so IMO it's not a must have option for me.coyft said:
Get the RS4 without the dynamic steering. IMO the C63 suspension is too hard for a daily.
It's almost impossible to find a recent RS4 B8 without the horrible dynamic steering…. I thought the normal C63 suspension was pretty ok and the one from the Performance Package is to hard…. I'm going to drive one with the PP this month and I will find out.coyft said:
Get the RS4 without the dynamic steering. IMO the C63 suspension is too hard for a daily.
I don't think so. The ride is pretty well-judged (as usual for Merc.) and if it's really too much, Merc themselves say that you can adjust tire pressure to below the half-load recommendation by .3 bar for comfort. This should be more than enough. Franzino said:
Options?
Are there any must have options on the C63 AMG facelift model? For me personally it seems that I would like; Harman Kardon surround sound, front and rear parking sensors, auto lifting trunk, 19" wheels (looks nicer), full leather, COMAND system with Media interface, LSD (or aftermarket Quaife).
Hi franzino, great choice of cars! Are there any must have options on the C63 AMG facelift model? For me personally it seems that I would like; Harman Kardon surround sound, front and rear parking sensors, auto lifting trunk, 19" wheels (looks nicer), full leather, COMAND system with Media interface, LSD (or aftermarket Quaife).
I looked at a C63 quite closey previously (bought a Jaguar XFR instead), however just something to remember, might not be so important for you but was a deal-breaker for my wife was that the Saloon, and Estate C63's didn't have DAB as standard (the coupes did). This was what I was told by the dealer.
Now Im hopefully back in the market for a C63 so I have to check for DAB. Im currently running an 2015 E-Class (E220CDI unfortunately
)and one thing I've got really used to is the Bluetooth audio. When I looked at the 63's I did notice a difference between the HK sound, and I wouldn't consider a C63 without but it does depend on how much you're into the music as the best soundtrack is the engine RS4's I'm lusting after too, but then in the UK, the prices of a lets say 2013 C63 facelift , low miles from a main dealer isn't a massive amount off a F10 M5! (albeit M5 is a little older and more miles to get it into the same price bracket!)
good luck with your search!!
VX0075 said:
Hi franzino, great choice of cars!
I looked at a C63 quite closey previously (bought a Jaguar XFR instead), however just something to remember, might not be so important for you but was a deal-breaker for my wife was that the Saloon, and Estate C63's didn't have DAB as standard (the coupes did). This was what I was told by the dealer.
Good to know; but DAB is not something I need or want...I looked at a C63 quite closey previously (bought a Jaguar XFR instead), however just something to remember, might not be so important for you but was a deal-breaker for my wife was that the Saloon, and Estate C63's didn't have DAB as standard (the coupes did). This was what I was told by the dealer.
VX0075 said:
Now Im hopefully back in the market for a C63 so I have to check for DAB. Im currently running an 2015 E-Class (E220CDI unfortunately )and one thing I've got really used to is the Bluetooth audio. When I looked at the 63's I did notice a difference between the HK sound, and I wouldn't consider a C63 without but it does depend on how much you're into the music as the best soundtrack is the engine
HK sound is a must have for me )and one thing I've got really used to is the Bluetooth audio. When I looked at the 63's I did notice a difference between the HK sound, and I wouldn't consider a C63 without but it does depend on how much you're into the music as the best soundtrack is the engine VX0075 said:
RS4's I'm lusting after too, but then in the UK, the prices of a lets say 2013 C63 facelift , low miles from a main dealer isn't a massive amount off a F10 M5! (albeit M5 is a little older and more miles to get it into the same price bracket!)
Correct; but an M5, RS6 is to big for me...and a F10 M5 does not exict in tourin/avant/wagon... The perfect car form would be a manual M3 touring V8... A used RS4 is more expensive then a C63 AMG facelift.'
VX0075 said:
Hi franzino, great choice of cars!
I looked at a C63 quite closey previously (bought a Jaguar XFR instead), however just something to remember, might not be so important for you but was a deal-breaker for my wife was that the Saloon, and Estate C63's didn't have DAB as standard (the coupes did). This was what I was told by the dealer.
Good to know; but DAB is not something I need or want...I looked at a C63 quite closey previously (bought a Jaguar XFR instead), however just something to remember, might not be so important for you but was a deal-breaker for my wife was that the Saloon, and Estate C63's didn't have DAB as standard (the coupes did). This was what I was told by the dealer.
VX0075 said:
Now Im hopefully back in the market for a C63 so I have to check for DAB. Im currently running an 2015 E-Class (E220CDI unfortunately )and one thing I've got really used to is the Bluetooth audio. When I looked at the 63's I did notice a difference between the HK sound, and I wouldn't consider a C63 without but it does depend on how much you're into the music as the best soundtrack is the engine
HK sound is a must have for me )and one thing I've got really used to is the Bluetooth audio. When I looked at the 63's I did notice a difference between the HK sound, and I wouldn't consider a C63 without but it does depend on how much you're into the music as the best soundtrack is the engine VX0075 said:
RS4's I'm lusting after too, but then in the UK, the prices of a lets say 2013 C63 facelift , low miles from a main dealer isn't a massive amount off a F10 M5! (albeit M5 is a little older and more miles to get it into the same price bracket!)
Correct; but an M5, RS6 is to big for me...and a F10 M5 does not exict in touring/avant/wagon... The perfect car form would be a manual M3 touring V8...Edited by Franzino on Sunday 13th December 12:59
I recently test drove a C63 AMG Estate (2012 model with 19" wheels and performance pack)… I really liked the way it drives and the way it steers. The steering feel is so much better in the C63 then in the RS4 B8. The steering feel is absolutely 100% perfect for my taste. The C63 AMG feels smaller, lighter and more nimble then a RS4 B8. The C63 feels more fun at lower speeds. It feels more a live! You will have to go really fast and drive like a nutter to get the same sense of speed and/or sensation in a RS4 B8. The RS4 drives as on rails, the grip is awesome and the car is really safe… This makes the car for me a little boring and also more difficult to know when exactly you are reaching the end of that endless RS4 grip.
In real live and in wet, slippery conditions the RS4 will always be faster then a C63. The grip levels are way up there…but honestly I don’t really care that the C63 will be slower or needs to be driven slower in these conditions. The engine in the RS4 is great, but the 6.2 engine in the C63 is awesome…! The C63 feels like a mini supercar and all that torque is great to have on the street. Probably not so on track, because you will have issues when going on the power early and you will lose traction really fast in certain corners. But this is a street car for me and my Z4M is there for track fun, fast times and old school manual driving pleasure. I would never buy an AMG or even a RS4 for track work…this is where a BMW M shines or even better with Porsche GT cars.
You will need to learn how to fully exploit and behave with this car…the C63 challenges you. For me personally a full black (no chrome / no grey) RS4 B8 Avant with 20” wheels looks awesome from the outside. I really love the look! The inside of the cabin also looks better then the interior of the C63 (facelift). For me the outside of the C63 looks like something of a granddad car in combination with a boy racer tuning look. I’m not a big fan of all that chrome and I hope there is a way to get it replaced or to get it blacked out like the shadowline of BMW M-models. No chrome will improve the look and lower the granddad image for me…
In my opinion a Mercedes is for older people (+50) and I’m not even 40. As said before; the RS4 B8 looks awesome, the C63 AMG looks ok and I can live with it… It’s not that it’s ugly. It’s just doesn’t make my hear beat faster when looking at it. On the other hand; starting that engine and driving it will make your heart beat overtime!
Besides the known high gasoline bills and the small gas tank the only real downside is the seven-speed MCT-7 gearbox. In auto mode it’s ok and rather good, but in manual mode and shifting gears yourself it’s slower then all the modern dual clutch systems and slower then the S-tronic of the RS4. The S-tronic gearbox of the RS4 B8 is in my opinion the best of both worlds… In manual mode it’s better/faster/more involving then the MCT-7 from the C63 and almost the same as the fast M-DKG (BMW e90 M3). When driving in city traffic in auto mode the S-tronic is better then the M-DKG (I don’t like the auto mode of the M-DKG in traffic). The MCT-7 gearbox is also better in auto mode in city traffic then the M-DKG.
The big difference is when shifting manually and then the C63 is the worst of the 3 above gearboxes (S-tronic and M-DKG)… It’s a pity and if there existed a C63 AMG manual I would buy that one…but on the other hand if there was a e91 BMW M3 Wagon then I would buy that one instead. You can’t have it all to be perfect, but you can try to get close to what you like best. Between the C63 Wagon and RS4 B8 my preference goes to the C63 AMG… If the C63 AMG had a S-tronic gearbox, no chrome and a little nicer interior and exterior it would be 100% perfect…on the other hand; are there cars that are 100% perfect? My Z4M is certainly not 100% perfect, but I love it…..and it has no chrome!
In real live and in wet, slippery conditions the RS4 will always be faster then a C63. The grip levels are way up there…but honestly I don’t really care that the C63 will be slower or needs to be driven slower in these conditions. The engine in the RS4 is great, but the 6.2 engine in the C63 is awesome…! The C63 feels like a mini supercar and all that torque is great to have on the street. Probably not so on track, because you will have issues when going on the power early and you will lose traction really fast in certain corners. But this is a street car for me and my Z4M is there for track fun, fast times and old school manual driving pleasure. I would never buy an AMG or even a RS4 for track work…this is where a BMW M shines or even better with Porsche GT cars.
You will need to learn how to fully exploit and behave with this car…the C63 challenges you. For me personally a full black (no chrome / no grey) RS4 B8 Avant with 20” wheels looks awesome from the outside. I really love the look! The inside of the cabin also looks better then the interior of the C63 (facelift). For me the outside of the C63 looks like something of a granddad car in combination with a boy racer tuning look. I’m not a big fan of all that chrome and I hope there is a way to get it replaced or to get it blacked out like the shadowline of BMW M-models. No chrome will improve the look and lower the granddad image for me…
In my opinion a Mercedes is for older people (+50) and I’m not even 40. As said before; the RS4 B8 looks awesome, the C63 AMG looks ok and I can live with it… It’s not that it’s ugly. It’s just doesn’t make my hear beat faster when looking at it. On the other hand; starting that engine and driving it will make your heart beat overtime!
Besides the known high gasoline bills and the small gas tank the only real downside is the seven-speed MCT-7 gearbox. In auto mode it’s ok and rather good, but in manual mode and shifting gears yourself it’s slower then all the modern dual clutch systems and slower then the S-tronic of the RS4. The S-tronic gearbox of the RS4 B8 is in my opinion the best of both worlds… In manual mode it’s better/faster/more involving then the MCT-7 from the C63 and almost the same as the fast M-DKG (BMW e90 M3). When driving in city traffic in auto mode the S-tronic is better then the M-DKG (I don’t like the auto mode of the M-DKG in traffic). The MCT-7 gearbox is also better in auto mode in city traffic then the M-DKG.
The big difference is when shifting manually and then the C63 is the worst of the 3 above gearboxes (S-tronic and M-DKG)… It’s a pity and if there existed a C63 AMG manual I would buy that one…but on the other hand if there was a e91 BMW M3 Wagon then I would buy that one instead. You can’t have it all to be perfect, but you can try to get close to what you like best. Between the C63 Wagon and RS4 B8 my preference goes to the C63 AMG… If the C63 AMG had a S-tronic gearbox, no chrome and a little nicer interior and exterior it would be 100% perfect…on the other hand; are there cars that are 100% perfect? My Z4M is certainly not 100% perfect, but I love it…..and it has no chrome!
Edited by Franzino on Tuesday 22 December 01:32
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