New E250 - nice car, dangerous throttle delay
Discussion
Have had an E250cdi sport for the past couple of days and whilst its a great cruiser, and its clear that Mercedes have gone old skool with their build quality (at last), the car has a very disconcerting, and in the right situation downright dangerous, habit of providing no response to light throttle applications from standstill.
If you want to manouvre at parking speeds from rest, press the throttle lightly and nothing ! At least 2 seconds lag before the engine responds, so you press harder to elicit a response and of course then the car wakes up and jumps..... same if you're trying to pull out from a junction... simply unbelievably bad throttle mapping.... I haven't looked on the benz forums but is this a one off on my car or a known issue ?
Car was a 2010 with 6000 miles.... I simply can't believe Mercedes signed this off or owners are not up in arms about it... whats the story here as its unacceptable on a Daewoo let alone a £40k new car?
If you want to manouvre at parking speeds from rest, press the throttle lightly and nothing ! At least 2 seconds lag before the engine responds, so you press harder to elicit a response and of course then the car wakes up and jumps..... same if you're trying to pull out from a junction... simply unbelievably bad throttle mapping.... I haven't looked on the benz forums but is this a one off on my car or a known issue ?
Car was a 2010 with 6000 miles.... I simply can't believe Mercedes signed this off or owners are not up in arms about it... whats the story here as its unacceptable on a Daewoo let alone a £40k new car?
My 2008 E220cdi does exactly the same, and they all do that from what I've read across forums. I always make a point of knocking the gearbox into 1st in tiptronic on approach to any junction or roundabout, it ensures you pull away quicker in 1st as I belive the autobox will otherwise take off in 2nd.
ZeroH said:
If you want to manouvre at parking speeds from rest, press the throttle lightly and nothing ! At least 2 seconds lag before the engine responds, so you press harder to elicit a response and of course then the car wakes up and jumps..... same if you're trying to pull out from a junction... simply unbelievably bad throttle mapping.... I haven't looked on the benz forums but is this a one off on my car or a known issue ?
Is it the same with the autobox in S mode?
yellowbentines said:
...as I belive the autobox will otherwise take off in 2nd.
It will in C (or E or whatever it's called in your car). In S it'll drop to 1st. It should drop to 1st anyway if you boot it. I have a C270CDi and even though I drive it gently I wouldn't dream of driving it in C - it just blurs everything too much. In S my car has no delay at all, and I've driven other makes with terrible auto-box delays, so I know what it's like.
Deva Link said:
ZeroH said:
If you want to manouvre at parking speeds from rest, press the throttle lightly and nothing ! At least 2 seconds lag before the engine responds, so you press harder to elicit a response and of course then the car wakes up and jumps..... same if you're trying to pull out from a junction... simply unbelievably bad throttle mapping.... I haven't looked on the benz forums but is this a one off on my car or a known issue ?
Is it the same with the autobox in S mode?I did try it in manual but not for parking manouvres, only when on the move.
I had a CLS350cdi grand edition a few weeks back which didn't have this problem (its engine was also faaaar nicer than the 2.1 unit !)
ZeroH said:
I had a CLS350cdi grand edition a few weeks back which didn't have this problem
Well that's a bit odd as there have been loads of complaints on the MB forums about the 350 autos, which have a 7 speed box. I can't recall seeing anything on the 4cyl/5speed box.Take it to a dealer and tell 'em it's dangerous.
Deva Link said:
ZeroH said:
I had a CLS350cdi grand edition a few weeks back which didn't have this problem
Well that's a bit odd as there have been loads of complaints on the MB forums about the 350 autos, which have a 7 speed box. I can't recall seeing anything on the 4cyl/5speed box.Take it to a dealer and tell 'em it's dangerous.
ZeroH said:
Interesting. Hmm.... suprised there has not been a recall about this given its so prevelant.
You can never get a straight answer on anything Mercedes related, but what seems to be happening is that they've changed the mapping of the autoboxes to give the best possible results in emissions tests. This is a good thing in some respects as it saves money on road-tax and it reduces company car tax payers bills.That's why the cars now default to E mode, and, at least on the 7 speed box, they've fitted a clutch which disconnects at idle and then has to engage before the car can move. I'm not aware of the 5 speed box having the same clutch.
The cars also learn the way the way the owner drives and, if driven gently will tend to hold high gears and be reluctant to down-shift unless the gas pedal is fully depressed (to kick-down).
Sounds like you're just using the car, rather than having bought it? If it was your car, with 6K on it from a previous user, then the first thing to do would be to get the adaptive settings reset and also check that there aren't any software updates to apply.
I just did a quick search of one of the MB forums and there is a recent mention of the same issue on a 250CDI, but there's no conclusion in the thread. As always, some people say their cars are fine and others say their's aren't.
Why not try taking it to your local dealer and get them to check and see if there is and actual fault or not.
The dealers recieve frequent software updates from germany for engine and gearbox control units which can make a significant to the way the cars drive.
At least then you will know if there is an issue with the car or its just the way it is.
The dealers recieve frequent software updates from germany for engine and gearbox control units which can make a significant to the way the cars drive.
At least then you will know if there is an issue with the car or its just the way it is.
pist nbroke said:
Why not try taking it to your local dealer and get them to check and see if there is and actual fault or not.
The dealers recieve frequent software updates from germany for engine and gearbox control units which can make a significant to the way the cars drive.
At least then you will know if there is an issue with the car or its just the way it is.
Indeed I would if it was my car, but I just had use of it for a few days. Thought it very peculiar for a 2010 car to have such an issue tho so wondered if it was a wider-spread / commonly known about problemThe dealers recieve frequent software updates from germany for engine and gearbox control units which can make a significant to the way the cars drive.
At least then you will know if there is an issue with the car or its just the way it is.
I had the same problem on a 2002 530i Sport that I kept stalling due to the variable throttle delay. My Renault Espace can lag a full second if I back off (say running up to a roundabout) and then reapply (say I see a gap).
Neither manufacturer was interested
Good luck, but don't hold your breath...
Neither manufacturer was interested
Good luck, but don't hold your breath...
Test drove the 250 before I placed an order for a 220.
I didn't experience the problem you mention so would categorically say they don't all do it, the only thing I found was that there was a significant step between the 2 turbos which coupled with the auto change seemed a little clumsy at times. I'm hoping the 220 is a little smoother by default.
Regards, Neil
I didn't experience the problem you mention so would categorically say they don't all do it, the only thing I found was that there was a significant step between the 2 turbos which coupled with the auto change seemed a little clumsy at times. I'm hoping the 220 is a little smoother by default.
Regards, Neil
Dave J said:
there is a delay between engaging drive and moving away but mine if held on the brake
I had a Mondeo diesel auto on trial from Ford a few years ago and that was the only way to drive it at roundabouts and junctions. Then when it took off it did it in a ferocious manner - nightmare! They stopped offering that car.Deva Link said:
The cars also learn the way the way the owner drives and, if driven gently will tend to hold high gears and be reluctant to down-shift unless the gas pedal is fully depressed (to kick-down).
Sounds like you're just using the car, rather than having bought it? If it was your car, with 6K on it from a previous user, then the first thing to do would be to get the adaptive settings reset and also check that there aren't any software updates to apply.
I'd follow this advice as a starting point - the previous owner might have had a completely different driving style so asking the gearbox software to "forget" might them help.Sounds like you're just using the car, rather than having bought it? If it was your car, with 6K on it from a previous user, then the first thing to do would be to get the adaptive settings reset and also check that there aren't any software updates to apply.
Edited by steve_amv8 on Thursday 5th August 09:28
I've never noticed a delay on my 2007 E220. I always have it in "C" as it suits my job. I do notice it's a bit slow or jerky at that point in-between changing down or up, it's almost like it's not sure which way to go so kinda thinks about it first!
It's done it from new and now has 200k miles and still does it.
It's done it from new and now has 200k miles and still does it.
GTIR said:
I've never noticed a delay on my 2007 E220. I always have it in "C" as it suits my job. I do notice it's a bit slow or jerky at that point in-between changing down or up, it's almost like it's not sure which way to go so kinda thinks about it first!
It's done it from new and now has 200k miles and still does it.
It's the later cars, particularly the Blue Efficiency models, which are causing problems.It's done it from new and now has 200k miles and still does it.
Have you ever had the ATF changed in your car? It's supposed to have a one-off change at 37,500 miles (which would have been at about 6mths old if your mileage has been linear!) but there's an opinion that it's worth doing regularly.
Deva Link said:
[
It's the later cars, particularly the Blue Efficiency models, which are causing problems.
Have you ever had the ATF changed in your car? It's supposed to have a one-off change at 37,500 miles (which would have been at about 6mths old if your mileage has been linear!) but there's an opinion that it's worth doing regularly.
Yes, had it done at the correct mileage and again under warranty just before it ran out in March this year. It's the later cars, particularly the Blue Efficiency models, which are causing problems.
Have you ever had the ATF changed in your car? It's supposed to have a one-off change at 37,500 miles (which would have been at about 6mths old if your mileage has been linear!) but there's an opinion that it's worth doing regularly.
GTIR said:
Deva Link said:
[
It's the later cars, particularly the Blue Efficiency models, which are causing problems.
Have you ever had the ATF changed in your car? It's supposed to have a one-off change at 37,500 miles (which would have been at about 6mths old if your mileage has been linear!) but there's an opinion that it's worth doing regularly.
Yes, had it done at the correct mileage and again under warranty just before it ran out in March this year. It's the later cars, particularly the Blue Efficiency models, which are causing problems.
Have you ever had the ATF changed in your car? It's supposed to have a one-off change at 37,500 miles (which would have been at about 6mths old if your mileage has been linear!) but there's an opinion that it's worth doing regularly.
http://forums.mercedesclub.org.uk/showthread.php?t...
Your problem might be to do with the torque convertor lock-up clutch. If it's done 200K though it's probably best to leave well alone.
Edited by Deva Link on Thursday 5th August 18:59
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