Brera 2.2 remap?

[carparkno1]

Gents - former 156 owner, and have been weighing up between an older Porsche 911 or a Brera. Heart over head and decided on a Brera.

So I am looking at what's available, and, with a budget going up to 12k, am seeing a lot of the same thing. I think I want the 2.2 petrol - the big diesel doesn't sound particularly inviting and the 3.2 isn't a Busso unit so I can't see it driving me wild.

However, with the 2.2 I am hearing horror stories of 20mpg on mixed driving? I saw somebody mention that this engine lends itself well to an ECU remap...

what would the remap do as a benefit to the car? More bhp, more mpg? And how much does it cost?

Cheers

[alfa pint]

Remap is about £300-400 depending on who does it. Angel Tuning have a lot of branches around - check out their website for details. The bloke I trust down in Plymouth (who did a fantastic job setting my MGB up) reckons you'll only see about 5 bhp, and a few mpg although better torque figures and feel. Angel Tuning reckon they can give me 15 bhp, 5 mpg but I can't remember the torque improvement - it's more about feel and pull allegedly.

The Brera is a very heavy car and the 2.2 quite wheezy. If it was me, I'd buy the V6 and at least enjoy it. Even the 2.4 5 cylinder diesel sounds ok - not that clattery at all and pulls really well.

[carparkno1]

alfa pint said:

Remap is about £300-400 depending on who does it. Angel Tuning have a lot of branches around - check out their website for details. The bloke I trust down in Plymouth (who did a fantastic job setting my MGB up) reckons you'll only see about 5 bhp, and a few mpg although better torque figures and feel. Angel Tuning reckon they can give me 15 bhp, 5 mpg but I can't remember the torque improvement - it's more about feel and pull allegedly.

The Brera is a very heavy car and the 2.2 quite wheezy. If it was me, I'd buy the V6 and at least enjoy it. Even the 2.4 5 cylinder diesel sounds ok - not that clattery at all and pulls really well.

Hmmm maybe I should look at other engine options. Is the 2.2 JTS really that underpowered? I guess the remap isn't worth the fuss for 5mpg and 5bhp but if it sorts the pull in low-down revs that's a start.

Totally unsure as to which Brera to get, just know that I want a Brera!!

[T350 Al]

carparkno1 said:

Hmmm maybe I should look at other engine options. Is the 2.2 JTS really that underpowered? I guess the remap isn't worth the fuss for 5mpg and 5bhp but if it sorts the pull in low-down revs that's a start.

Totally unsure as to which Brera to get, just know that I want a Brera!!

The engine map on the 2.2 is really weird; more diesel-like than petrol! It's got a bit of torque low down and then nothing and you rev the nuts off it expecting a surge and.......not much happens! I'd love a remap on my S if nothing else than to even out the power delivery. Motorway cruising is where the engine performs reasonably well though. A quick shift to 5th and you're off!

The diesel engine is a good engine, where remaps see decent power increases but I just felt it didn't suit the look of the car.

[carparkno1]

T350 Al said:

The engine map on the 2.2 is really weird; more diesel-like than petrol! It's got a bit of torque low down and then nothing and you rev the nuts off it expecting a surge and.......not much happens! I'd love a remap on my S if nothing else than to even out the power delivery. Motorway cruising is where the engine performs reasonably well though. A quick shift to 5th and you're off!

The diesel engine is a good engine, where remaps see decent power increases but I just felt it didn't suit the look of the car.

I know what you mean - I see the Brera as a GT, and as such would have no problem with a hulking great Diesel, but by all accounts this 2.4JTDM is heavy, slow, massive lag and incredibly uneconomical. All of that makes me want a petrol - but the sweet spot is the 1750ti and I don't have the cash to go up to that. Why didn't alfa fit the 1.9 diesel or a decent petrol in it?

I guess my big concern is that with a 2.2 engine and 20mpg I am ultimately going to be bitterly dissapointed. I can forgive the car on ride and looks but the engine needs to have something and I was hoping a remap would assist with this.

[OperationAlfa]

carparkno1 said:

I know what you mean - I see the Brera as a GT, and as such would have no problem with a hulking great Diesel, but by all accounts this 2.4JTDM is heavy, slow, massive lag and incredibly uneconomical. All of that makes me want a petrol - but the sweet spot is the 1750ti and I don't have the cash to go up to that. Why didn't alfa fit the 1.9 diesel or a decent petrol in it?

I guess my big concern is that with a 2.2 engine and 20mpg I am ultimately going to be bitterly dissapointed. I can forgive the car on ride and looks but the engine needs to have something and I was hoping a remap would assist with this.

The 2.4 is the best lump in my opinion. The lag isn't that bad... have you actually driven one? It's not much different in weight to the 3.2 or the 2.2.... They are all heavy and a bit slow.

The 2.2 early cars have real issues with hesitation. A remap does fix this problem and a friend of mine had a remap and a new exhaust and now his car flies. You won't get much extra BHP and torque out of it though.

Remap the 2.4 however and remove the DPF and EGR delete and you have one hell of a car.

[carparkno1]

OperationAlfa said:

The 2.4 is the best lump in my opinion. The lag isn't that bad... have you actually driven one? It's not much different in weight to the 3.2 or the 2.2.... They are all heavy and a bit slow.

The 2.2 early cars have real issues with hesitation. A remap does fix this problem and a friend of mine had a remap and a new exhaust and now his car flies. You won't get much extra BHP and torque out of it though.

Remap the 2.4 however and remove the DPF and EGR delete and you have one hell of a car.

Hmmm been in a 159 2.4 diesel and it seemed heavy and slow.

So my otpions really sit at

1) 2.2 with remap - sorts out throttle but no real power increase
2) 2.4 diesel - added power!

I will test both - maybe the diesel is the answer! Chelmsford Alfa is getting a visit!

[yellow inno]

i have a 2007 brera spider, got it 2 weeks ago and man am I disappointed. Its slow and scarily thirsty, i can get 22 to the gallon on average if i drive like an old woman

would a remap help. everyone says an alfa is great to drive,the old spider (gtv twin spark) was lovely and sounded great, this one is ok sounds dull unless you you cane it but then its 10 to the gallon.

im seriously thin king of getting rid if it cant be improved on.

[AlfaRSpider]

I really don't see the mpg in the low twenties... Ever. I have an '07 brera spider 2.2 and I get about 29mpg driving around town and 35mpg on motorway driving. I'll agree it's slow though, but it gives me a lot of enjoyment as a low-rev cruiser.

[strangehighways]

I wouldn't go near a 2.2. I went to a rolling road session with a guy who put his 2.2 JTS on the dyno and it was well short of the factory stated figure (should be 185 bhp, 161 recorded!). Others on the Alfaowner forum mention that the 2.2 regularly puts out less than the stated power figure.

[Yamatrix850]

strangehighways said:

I wouldn't go near a 2.2. I went to a rolling road session with a guy who put his 2.2 JTS on the dyno and it was well short of the factory stated figure (should be 185 bhp, 161 recorded!). Others on the Alfaowner forum mention that the 2.2 regularly puts out less than the stated power figure.

The Alfa figure will be at the crank... the rolling road will be measured at the wheels and then a 'finger in the wind' calculation applied to guesstimate crank power.

Useful for back to back comparisons of pre and post remap, but not a lot else.

[strangehighways]

Yamatrix850 said:

The Alfa figure will be at the crank... the rolling road will be measured at the wheels and then a 'finger in the wind' calculation applied to guesstimate crank power.

Useful for back to back comparisons of pre and post remap, but not a lot else.

Though I agree with you that rolling roads vary, most of the cars which had not been remapped were putting out similar figures to factory (within 5hp or so). The JTS was 24 below.

[Andy665]

carparkno1 said:

Why didn't alfa fit the 1.9 diesel .

They did - not many around but Brera 2.0 JDTm with 170bhp do exist

[MervynJoe]

There are at least 3 reasons to go for a re-map. (Hope this doesn't appear condescending !)

1. When cars come out of the factory most manufacturers fit them with an all purpose, one size fits all, map. This is so they comply with the myriad of emission regulations from country to country. It also means they can save money on tailoring cars to each countries rules !
Therefore there will be some pretty wide tolerances in place. Re-mapping tightens up thee tolerances so the engine is working much better efficiency. Even if a re-map doesn't give any more MPG (which it usually will) or extra BHP (which it also usually will) it is worth doing so the engine is working at maximum efficiency.
Remember you may have a £20/30 or 40,000 + so whats a measly 1% or so spent on ensuring the vehicle is oin top condition.

2. re-mapping WILL give more MPG and if you stress economy over power then you will get even more MPG. (My 1.9 diesel GT arrived with about 36 MPG extra urban, after a remap this went to 44MPG. My 2.4 JDTm Brera was even better going from 35MPG to 46 on long runs.

3. re-mapping WILL also give more BHP although the more you want the less MPG will improve. My 2.4 JDTm Brera went from a 'factory' 210 BHP to 245.BHP and the mid range acceleration saw off many a Golf GTi Boy racer with ease.
I have just got a 2.2.JTS Brera and had it remapped. This is supposed to come out of the factory at 185 BHP however the readouts before being tweaked showed it really as 149 BHP and I am sure I am not the only person to be delusional about the supposed BHP of their 'performance' vehicle.
Re-mapped to 200BHP, an additional 4 MPG and so much smoother through the gears with greater mid range boost, well worth £300.

i can only speak locally but Paul Killingworth at PK Automotive Lincoln is a genius. Ex F1 Renault he must have just about every piece of electrical/computerised diagnostic kit there is. Last time I was in he was working on a TVR Cerebra (?), Ferrari 450, a £60 grand Audi SUV and a Range Rover where the MPG had gone fro 18 to 29 MPG . People with those sort of vehicles dont trust them to any old Honest John under the railway arches.

Go for it. You may take some time to get your £300 back but in the meantime you will have a more efficient and probably longer lasting vehicle.

[DkVelo]

OperationAlfa said:

The 2.4 is the best lump in my opinion. The lag isn't that bad... have you actually driven one? It's not much different in weight to the 3.2 or the 2.2.... They are all heavy and a bit slow.

The 2.2 early cars have real issues with hesitation. A remap does fix this problem and a friend of mine had a remap and a new exhaust and now his car flies. You won't get much extra BHP and torque out of it though.

Remap the 2.4 however and remove the DPF and EGR delete and you have one hell of a car.

I have a 2.4 210 in my 159, it is mapped a little bit, and have boost from 1.400 rpm. But it moves the best above 2.000 rpm.
The sound is, for a diesel, acctually quite good. And with a turbo upgrade. The powerpotentiel is acctually quite impressive.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1ANyBxxYyBk
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H8VjaE3-u6E
(Quite good guides on Aflaowner as well.)

This is the sound from inside my 159 SW with Novitec end mufflers. (Watch the last bit)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jLDV1HSK6CM (I should get some rear bumper photage...)
And this is the best sounding 2.4 I have come across so far.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AoCi3F76ziw

The 159, Spider and Brera are not sprinters from a stand still.
But the massive torque (I have 500 NM) makes overtaking and cruising easy and Entertaining.

Edited by DkVelo on Sunday 3rd April 21:59

[DeltonaS]

strangehighways said:

I wouldn't go near a 2.2. I went to a rolling road session with a guy who put his 2.2 JTS on the dyno and it was well short of the factory stated figure (should be 185 bhp, 161 recorded!). Others on the Alfaowner forum mention that the 2.2 regularly puts out less than the stated power figure.

The 2.0 jts in the 156 was well known for not delivering it's power, never heard that with the 159. My 2.2 159 felt like it had 185, top speed was accordingly.

The only problem with it is the ackward electronic gaspedal behaviour on low rpm's in 1st and 2nd gear. A remap almost solves that and gives some extra power, comparable with driving on a cold morning, just that little bit extra. Torque curve in general is really flat, you never have to go above 2500 RPM. The 159 2.2 even has the same spec. as the 166 2.5 V6 (power, torque and weight), lacking the V6's soundtrack and more rev. happy nature ofcourse, but with 20% to 25% better fuel economy.

Other thing I always noticed is the engine's sensitivity on high octane fuel, 100RON and 102RON really gave some extra, remap like, punch.

Had 236 km/h (or 147MPH) once on the speedo on 102RON on the Autobahn, a 161bhp'car with the bad CW value of the 159 doesn't achieve that.

[Pooh]

I had a 2.2 Brera S, it had a modified inlet with a cone filter and a fuelling mod (Mangoletsi Mod 4). It was a very good engine, smooth, free revving and decently powerful, I did about 95k miles in mine, seldom felt the need for more power and averaged about 28mpg. They need a regular thrashing and V power fuel to give their best, I believe that the ECU learns how you drive and adjusts itself accordingly so if you pootle for a while it can get a bit sluggish until you drive like an Italian for a few miles.
The later Breras are not as heavy as people think, Alfa did a lot of work to lighten them including but not limited to, thinner high strength steel panels, hollow anti roll bars and aluminium uprights, from memory my S was around 1450kg which is not too bad considering the size and solidity of it. The 2.2 is a lot lighter than the diesel or V6, the reduced nose weight is good for the handling and the V6 is hampered by very long gearing so in my opinion, a tweaked 2.2 is probably the best engine for a Brera.

[marios-ahalu]

Hi all

Interesting stuff.
I just sold a Porsche 996 C4, it was an amazing car and had it for 3 years. Just sold it for 15k

Now I'm the owner of a brera 2.2 and love it.
Yes it's not that quick and yes it does not sound that great.

I want to remap the engine and add a wizzard exhaust to boost the sound experience.

I think once that's done I will love the car,

I find that the driving experience of the brera is enough to put a smile on my face. Speed isn't eveything. In fact having to over rev it to make it go is adding to the fun. When I did it in the Porsche it just went to fast for the road in the uk,

Now I can have the same fun at 40 -50 mph.

Question, has anyone done both the remap and the exhaust change. I hear they work well together.


Please advise

[Pooh]

Is you car standard or an S? My S had the standard Prodrive exhaust which sounded quite good but the intake noise from the filter change sounded superb. A lot of people commented on how great it sounded from inside and outside and this was almost entirely due to the intake. Having said that the Prodrive exhaust is quite quiet so an after market one may be different.

[marios-ahalu]

Yeh that's what I thought

I think an after market wizzard would have more grunt. I was told it would sound like a v6

I'm testing driving tomorrow the V6 and a standard 2.2 with a wizard


Mine is the standard 2.2 not an S