Lancia Integrale
Discussion
You know how you drive along on auto-pilot, and sometime s don't remember bits of a journey?
I never had that in the integrale. You are always fully alert. So yes, a Quattro would be much better for a long journey, the Lancia was tiring.
I really hope Lancia build the new Fulvia and bring it to the UK.
Simon
I never had that in the integrale. You are always fully alert. So yes, a Quattro would be much better for a long journey, the Lancia was tiring.
I really hope Lancia build the new Fulvia and bring it to the UK.
Simon
Shame it's based on the Barchetta 
www.whalley-integrale.uk.com is useful. John Whalley knows Integrales inside out.
It's been said already but worth emphasising the importance of the suspension bushes and dampers being in good order, and the alignment correct. Good ones are magical, but if the first one you drive is a neglected one with tired suspension you'll never want to drive another!
It's been said already but worth emphasising the importance of the suspension bushes and dampers being in good order, and the alignment correct. Good ones are magical, but if the first one you drive is a neglected one with tired suspension you'll never want to drive another!
AC79xxx said:
lanciachris said:
Nice thought, but no. They are different. Read evocorner and learn.
However well intentioned the guy at evocorner is I'm quite sure the guy I spoke to at Fiat in Italy (who incidentaly homolgated each modification of the road cars) knows a thing or two more. He also got incredibly pissed off when I mentioned the words Evo II, he kept muttering that no such thing exists...
>> Edited by AC79xxx on Monday 4th October 11:18
Your bloke at Fiat is wrong - simple as that. The Evo III does not exist. The Evo 2 does. I can't be arsed to go into detail but it's a fact.
edited to say : that sounds very arrogant but there are some proper experts on the evoforum (I don't use the term "expert" often) - Paul Baker pretty much knows everything there is to know.
dan
>> Edited by danhf on Tuesday 5th October 00:05
danhf said:
Your bloke at Fiat is wrong - simple as that. The Evo III does not exist. The Evo 2 does. I can't be arsed to go into detail but it's a fact.
edited to say : that sounds very arrogant but there are some proper experts on the evoforum (I don't use the term "expert" often) - Paul Baker pretty much knows everything there is to know.
dan
Dan's right, see here:
whalley integrale said:
October 1991 -Debut of a new phase in the career of the HF Integrale :
Evolution. Wider wheel arches because of the wider tracks. New front suspension and several improvements to the rear suspension as well. More robust braking system and steering box. The power output was up to 210 bhp and performance achieved a major leap forward in terms of driveability, roadholding and active safety.
June 1993 - Debut of the catalysed Delta HF Integrale 16v (Evolution II) with power output raised to 215 bhp. This was to be the last of the range with a number of Special Edition cars to celebrate the success of the vehicle; Gialla, Blue Lagos, Pearl White, Dealer Edition and the Final Edition. Production ceased in November 1994 and the series thus became finite.
danhf said:
Your bloke at Fiat is wrong - simple as that. The Evo III does not exist. The Evo 2 does. I can't be arsed to go into detail but it's a fact.
edited to say : that sounds very arrogant but there are some proper experts on the evoforum (I don't use the term "expert" often) - Paul Baker pretty much knows everything there is to know.
dan
Before you go off in a strop make sure you read the posts first, I have never said that the Evo III exists. I've only heard people incorrectly discussing them.
If it makes you happy to believe that whatever you read on the internet is correct, well, that's your call. It's simply a case of popular myth being spread by people believing the written (or in this case posted) word is true. For example if every Porsche 3.4 996 owner did that they'd all be shitting themselves that their RMS will fail every year or as soon as a BMW S14 engine reaches 100k miles the cam chain will snap. Which, in this instance, is the same as saying that there are Evo I and Evo II cars.
I'm quite happy to take with a liberal pinch of salt what's posted on these websites and draw my own conclusions. Trying to obtain from Turin SVA papers to register in the UK Swiss 8v car proved to be an absoulute joke, simply because the factory don't distinguish the cars as such.
I'll leave you with one thing to think about. Have you ever noticed how in the domestic and German markets very few dealers distiguish the cars using the monikas Evo I and II and co-incidentally their prices are much lower than in the UK or the Netherlands? The last time I was in Italy I looked at a pearlescent white edition with just under 100k kms on the clock, it was up for the equivalent of £7.5k in euros at the time, the same car in the UK would be at least £14/5k. Is it me just being cynical or has their been some very subtle manipulation by people such as John Whaley, Walkers, Kankku, Zagato et al to inflate prices of the cat equiped later cars which sit (for a considerable time) shining on their forecourts?
"If it makes you happy to believe that whatever you read on the internet is correct, well, that's your call"
Yes, that's right, even though I've bought every book going, hankered after one since the mid 80's (S4) and owned one for two years after looking at about 30 over 4 years I just read some shite from a webpage and spout it as the truth.
Paul Baker is pretty much regarded as the "oracle" on all things Integrale and has written more than a few words on the subject. The Lancia Motor Club refer to them as Evo II. I think the parts CD refers to them as Evo II. Every dealer in the UK refers to them as Evo II.
Just because the notoriously shabby Italian equivalent of the DVLA don't recognise it doesn't mean it doesn't exist.
Read the evoforum and tell me there aren't some genuine experts on there....
dan
Yes, that's right, even though I've bought every book going, hankered after one since the mid 80's (S4) and owned one for two years after looking at about 30 over 4 years I just read some shite from a webpage and spout it as the truth.
Paul Baker is pretty much regarded as the "oracle" on all things Integrale and has written more than a few words on the subject. The Lancia Motor Club refer to them as Evo II. I think the parts CD refers to them as Evo II. Every dealer in the UK refers to them as Evo II.
Just because the notoriously shabby Italian equivalent of the DVLA don't recognise it doesn't mean it doesn't exist.
Read the evoforum and tell me there aren't some genuine experts on there....
dan
There were loads and loads of weird dealer editions of the evo. Just going to be one of those...
https://www.uksecureserver.co.uk/request/walkers_shop.htm
That page has a brochure for sale on the montecarlo edition.
https://www.uksecureserver.co.uk/request/walkers_shop.htm
That page has a brochure for sale on the montecarlo edition.
The Montecarlo was just a name used on the Evo,It was no different to any other ,just a badge.Mine is from germany and is badged sedici giallo,I think.There is no such thing as an EvoIII but mine is registerd Delta EvoIII , Why? Well in Germany they had the integrale 8v ,then it evolved into the(evo) 16v,then 16v with wider(evoII) track spoiler etc ,then 16v wider track and Kat,The Last (in germany) were called EvoIII,I have seen it called EvoII Kat or G-Kat too.But we all know 8v,16v,EvoI,EvoI8vKat,And EvoII with a Kat and Highback seats.
NEVER buy a RHD version they have ALL been modified ,with a regata diesel rack in them,they are worth less.Rust is a myth,these cars have there problems ,front and rear screens at the bottom,and along the edge of the roof.Other than that enjoy.As for values i paid 10800 for my modified one 4 and a half years ago and its probably worth 12-13000 now look after it and it will hold its money.
Regards
Ellis
NEVER buy a RHD version they have ALL been modified ,with a regata diesel rack in them,they are worth less.Rust is a myth,these cars have there problems ,front and rear screens at the bottom,and along the edge of the roof.Other than that enjoy.As for values i paid 10800 for my modified one 4 and a half years ago and its probably worth 12-13000 now look after it and it will hold its money.
Regards
Ellis
ellis is correct.
fantastic cars, ive never driven anything else thats felt so 'right'
i couldnt reccomend getting one without a LOT of research.
there are some hugely overpriced ones about, and some real dogs.
prices seem to have been fairly steady for the past couple of years, £3k-£7k for an 8/16v rangine from ok to spotless with tiny miles.
ive seen ok evos go for £5k, up to 10-11k for a very good one.
evo2s seem to go for between £8k and £15k. occasionally you hear of them going for silly money, but spending lots doesnt always mean youll get the best car.
yes, they rust, but no more so than most cars of a similar age. get a good one and look after it.
evos are always the ones to have, but you can get a top end 16v for the price of a bottom end evo. same engine bar 5-10bhp from a different exhaust, but 50kg lighter. i initially bought my 16v as a stepping stone from normal car to integrale, but i love it, and will hang onto it for a few more years.
evo1 v evo2?
apparently evo2s are better made, and being newer youre less likely to find a roten / abused one. the small turbo runs out of puff quite early, but it starts making boost lower. personally, id take the bigger turbo.
16in evo 2 wheels fill the arches better, and all have lovely highback recaro seats. unfortunatly youll need the cat for mots (unless you have a friendly tester) which makes tuning a bit more awkward.
all have the potential for huge bills, and while you may hear horror stories, there are plenty of people who use theirs everyday with very few problems.
fantastic cars, ive never driven anything else thats felt so 'right'
i couldnt reccomend getting one without a LOT of research.
there are some hugely overpriced ones about, and some real dogs.
prices seem to have been fairly steady for the past couple of years, £3k-£7k for an 8/16v rangine from ok to spotless with tiny miles.
ive seen ok evos go for £5k, up to 10-11k for a very good one.
evo2s seem to go for between £8k and £15k. occasionally you hear of them going for silly money, but spending lots doesnt always mean youll get the best car.
yes, they rust, but no more so than most cars of a similar age. get a good one and look after it.
evos are always the ones to have, but you can get a top end 16v for the price of a bottom end evo. same engine bar 5-10bhp from a different exhaust, but 50kg lighter. i initially bought my 16v as a stepping stone from normal car to integrale, but i love it, and will hang onto it for a few more years.
evo1 v evo2?
apparently evo2s are better made, and being newer youre less likely to find a roten / abused one. the small turbo runs out of puff quite early, but it starts making boost lower. personally, id take the bigger turbo.
16in evo 2 wheels fill the arches better, and all have lovely highback recaro seats. unfortunatly youll need the cat for mots (unless you have a friendly tester) which makes tuning a bit more awkward.
all have the potential for huge bills, and while you may hear horror stories, there are plenty of people who use theirs everyday with very few problems.
integrale said:
ellis is correct.
fantastic cars, ive never driven anything else thats felt so 'right'
etc
Which is why i've just bought an Evo1, having sold my TVR350i. In terms of driving experience, the two are chalk and cheese.
I now can't wait for the Spring and the chance to do few track days and hillclimbs/sptints.
John
If we want to get really pedantic, then we can consider that the "Evoluzione" never existed, forget 1 and 2 (or even the controversial 3). FIAT's marketing literature never mentioned anything about the Evo. It has always been the Lancia Delta HF integrale (with lower case "i").
The Italians and the journalists referred to it as that, as the development of the 16v was a true "evolution" in the real sense, and other manufacturers were naming thier cars Evos - Merc 190evo, BMW M3evo, etc.
But Evo sounds cool, and helps us to distinguish the various stages of development over the years.
Still got mine (non-evo) after 6.5 years and it rocks!
James
The Italians and the journalists referred to it as that, as the development of the 16v was a true "evolution" in the real sense, and other manufacturers were naming thier cars Evos - Merc 190evo, BMW M3evo, etc.
But Evo sounds cool, and helps us to distinguish the various stages of development over the years.
Still got mine (non-evo) after 6.5 years and it rocks!
James
I would research the dealers you choose carefully... some of the ones mentioned on here are not great.
As for the reliability issues, I have raced mine all season, and the only problems I have had have been a puncture, trip into paddock hill gravel trap resulting from a huge lack of talent, and a stuck open dump valve.
Not bad, and very fast indeed.
Rgds
Pete
ps James you tart! going to race a proper car next year!!
As for the reliability issues, I have raced mine all season, and the only problems I have had have been a puncture, trip into paddock hill gravel trap resulting from a huge lack of talent, and a stuck open dump valve.
Not bad, and very fast indeed.
Rgds
Pete
ps James you tart! going to race a proper car next year!!
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