Discussion
kapiteinlangzaam said:
Isnt expecting a 4-banger Alfa to sound better than a v8 or v10 Audi somewhat 'optimistic' ??
There's a bit of a price difference in there as well I'd say. Possibly that could account for the gap in refinement.Then again saw someone on another forum trade in his Gallardo and he is not looking back either.
Just comes down to what you like and unless you are used to Alfa's and are totally convinced, having a test drive is certainly the intelligent thing to do.
limpsfield said:
Pete - what did you think of it compared to your old Elise and Boxster?
to me it is closer to an Exige than a boxster.... Thanks for the comment about me being a bit thick (duh) regarding the noise.When I had an Elise (with a sports exhaust) that sounded much better (in my opinion) thant the 4c.
There was no need to be rude, I was only stating what I thought of it!!!!
- Pete
Thanks for the advice about toughening up a bit....hahaha
Anyway I think 4 cylinder cars can sound good (my Lotus Elise did) I know it wasn't a turbo but still. I had a Lancia Delta HF Turbo Martini and that sounded fab as well... To me the 4c just sounded like an unpleasant noise when in Dynamic mode so much so that I felt I had to change up earlier rather than listen to it.
Here are some of the 4 cylinder cars that I think sound good.....
Honda S2000
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v-ZHB_HCwjc
Lotus Elise
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n0K2KeOVqlw
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HtWdeXe5vNc
Lancia Delta
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jjdCQjVnpgA
- Pete
Anyway I think 4 cylinder cars can sound good (my Lotus Elise did) I know it wasn't a turbo but still. I had a Lancia Delta HF Turbo Martini and that sounded fab as well... To me the 4c just sounded like an unpleasant noise when in Dynamic mode so much so that I felt I had to change up earlier rather than listen to it.
Here are some of the 4 cylinder cars that I think sound good.....
Honda S2000
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v-ZHB_HCwjc
Lotus Elise
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n0K2KeOVqlw
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HtWdeXe5vNc
Lancia Delta
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jjdCQjVnpgA
- Pete
I've had my 4C for a couple of weeks now and love it more with each journey I make in it. The gearchange in Dynamic mode is not jerky if you lift off ever so slightly. If driven like this it shifts up smoothly. It's been engineered to replicate the thump in the back shifts of a Ferrari F1 or Lamborghini E gear gearbox if you keep your foot planted. That is what many owners like and why some are criticising Ferrari for removing it from their DCT shift patterns in the 458 and California, something they've subsequently addressed with the shift action in the 458 Speciale.
The little Alfa provides so much feedback at lower speeds which can make it either brilliant or terrible depending upon your point of view. That experience will undoubtedly put off many potential buyers on a test drive. It demands concentration at speeds at which you could simply admire the scenery, adjust your seat, change music tracks etc in most modern humdrum hatchbacks that are now so anesthetized from lifeless steering, over engineered NVH etc that they are transport conveyances rather than cars. That's great if you are commuting but not much fun if you want to "drive" and that is the whole point of cars like the 4C. I've owned an R8 and whilst it was a good car it is fairly uninvolving unless you are really pressing on.
I can imagine that a test drive of an hour or two will not reveal the true nature of this car. It takes a longer drive to recalibrate your approach to inputs with it to get the best out of it. The suspension is certainly firm but not uncomfortably so unless you are regularly driving over very bad surfaces.
I think Alfa have done a tremendous job with the car in such a short development lead time. Without the huge budget and greater depth of engineering talent amongst their competitors they have given us a carbon tub and composite body to provide a real light weight car and shown up some of the established names in the process with this approach. I find it a much more fun car to drive on familiar challenging roads than the 458s I've owned due to it's smaller size and lighter weight. It's larger cousins are much more dynamically competent but part of the appeal of the 4C to me is learning how to get the best from it. It is an old school type of driving experience in that regard.
By cabin quality I suspect you mean the choice of materials used in it. I thought it may be an issue but I actually like the honest functionality of the interior. There is no unnecessary window dressing of it as there is in the US version which gets a leather clad dash and doors. It's just not the type of car to need this IMHO.
To me it is true to the Italian spirit of Alfa and is not trying to be all things to all drivers which is worth celebrating in my book.
The little Alfa provides so much feedback at lower speeds which can make it either brilliant or terrible depending upon your point of view. That experience will undoubtedly put off many potential buyers on a test drive. It demands concentration at speeds at which you could simply admire the scenery, adjust your seat, change music tracks etc in most modern humdrum hatchbacks that are now so anesthetized from lifeless steering, over engineered NVH etc that they are transport conveyances rather than cars. That's great if you are commuting but not much fun if you want to "drive" and that is the whole point of cars like the 4C. I've owned an R8 and whilst it was a good car it is fairly uninvolving unless you are really pressing on.
I can imagine that a test drive of an hour or two will not reveal the true nature of this car. It takes a longer drive to recalibrate your approach to inputs with it to get the best out of it. The suspension is certainly firm but not uncomfortably so unless you are regularly driving over very bad surfaces.
I think Alfa have done a tremendous job with the car in such a short development lead time. Without the huge budget and greater depth of engineering talent amongst their competitors they have given us a carbon tub and composite body to provide a real light weight car and shown up some of the established names in the process with this approach. I find it a much more fun car to drive on familiar challenging roads than the 458s I've owned due to it's smaller size and lighter weight. It's larger cousins are much more dynamically competent but part of the appeal of the 4C to me is learning how to get the best from it. It is an old school type of driving experience in that regard.
By cabin quality I suspect you mean the choice of materials used in it. I thought it may be an issue but I actually like the honest functionality of the interior. There is no unnecessary window dressing of it as there is in the US version which gets a leather clad dash and doors. It's just not the type of car to need this IMHO.
To me it is true to the Italian spirit of Alfa and is not trying to be all things to all drivers which is worth celebrating in my book.
isuk said:
I've had my 4C for a couple of weeks now and love it more with each journey I make in it. The gearchange in Dynamic mode is not jerky if you lift off ever so slightly. If driven like this it shifts up smoothly. It's been engineered to replicate the thump in the back shifts of a Ferrari F1 or Lamborghini E gear gearbox if you keep your foot planted. That is what many owners like and why some are criticising Ferrari for removing it from their DCT shift patterns in the 458 and California, something they've subsequently addressed with the shift action in the 458 Speciale.
The little Alfa provides so much feedback at lower speeds which can make it either brilliant or terrible depending upon your point of view. That experience will undoubtedly put off many potential buyers on a test drive. It demands concentration at speeds at which you could simply admire the scenery, adjust your seat, change music tracks etc in most modern humdrum hatchbacks that are now so anesthetized from lifeless steering, over engineered NVH etc that they are transport conveyances rather than cars. That's great if you are commuting but not much fun if you want to "drive" and that is the whole point of cars like the 4C. I've owned an R8 and whilst it was a good car it is fairly uninvolving unless you are really pressing on.
I can imagine that a test drive of an hour or two will not reveal the true nature of this car. It takes a longer drive to recalibrate your approach to inputs with it to get the best out of it. The suspension is certainly firm but not uncomfortably so unless you are regularly driving over very bad surfaces.
I think Alfa have done a tremendous job with the car in such a short development lead time. Without the huge budget and greater depth of engineering talent amongst their competitors they have given us a carbon tub and composite body to provide a real light weight car and shown up some of the established names in the process with this approach. I find it a much more fun car to drive on familiar challenging roads than the 458s I've owned due to it's smaller size and lighter weight. It's larger cousins are much more dynamically competent but part of the appeal of the 4C to me is learning how to get the best from it. It is an old school type of driving experience in that regard.
By cabin quality I suspect you mean the choice of materials used in it. I thought it may be an issue but I actually like the honest functionality of the interior. There is no unnecessary window dressing of it as there is in the US version which gets a leather clad dash and doors. It's just not the type of car to need this IMHO.
To me it is true to the Italian spirit of Alfa and is not trying to be all things to all drivers which is worth celebrating in my book.
Great post, I am glad you like your 4c.... If we all liked the same cars it would be very boring.The little Alfa provides so much feedback at lower speeds which can make it either brilliant or terrible depending upon your point of view. That experience will undoubtedly put off many potential buyers on a test drive. It demands concentration at speeds at which you could simply admire the scenery, adjust your seat, change music tracks etc in most modern humdrum hatchbacks that are now so anesthetized from lifeless steering, over engineered NVH etc that they are transport conveyances rather than cars. That's great if you are commuting but not much fun if you want to "drive" and that is the whole point of cars like the 4C. I've owned an R8 and whilst it was a good car it is fairly uninvolving unless you are really pressing on.
I can imagine that a test drive of an hour or two will not reveal the true nature of this car. It takes a longer drive to recalibrate your approach to inputs with it to get the best out of it. The suspension is certainly firm but not uncomfortably so unless you are regularly driving over very bad surfaces.
I think Alfa have done a tremendous job with the car in such a short development lead time. Without the huge budget and greater depth of engineering talent amongst their competitors they have given us a carbon tub and composite body to provide a real light weight car and shown up some of the established names in the process with this approach. I find it a much more fun car to drive on familiar challenging roads than the 458s I've owned due to it's smaller size and lighter weight. It's larger cousins are much more dynamically competent but part of the appeal of the 4C to me is learning how to get the best from it. It is an old school type of driving experience in that regard.
By cabin quality I suspect you mean the choice of materials used in it. I thought it may be an issue but I actually like the honest functionality of the interior. There is no unnecessary window dressing of it as there is in the US version which gets a leather clad dash and doors. It's just not the type of car to need this IMHO.
To me it is true to the Italian spirit of Alfa and is not trying to be all things to all drivers which is worth celebrating in my book.
The car I test drove was a launch edition one with the sports suspension and exhaust with the larger wheels. I am assuming it would sound/ride a little better with the standard setup (for the road anyway).
Can't you get the same thril/experience in a Lotus Exige for less money?
BTW - The dealer said they were going to sell the launch edition one they had for circa 60K.....
- Pete
The Exige is more hardcore than the 4C with much more difficult entry/egress and an even more functional/stark cabin. A friend owns one and loves it but I've never warmed to it all. The Alfa falls neatly into the mid ground between it and the Cayman. It's also the closest thing to a modern day Dino 246 we are ever likely to see unless Maserati decide to use the carbon tub and add their V6 to create their own sports car from it.
The standard 4C will undoubtedly have a more forgiving ride quality as it forgoes the optional race suspension set up fitted to the Launch Edition cars. It all depends upon what you are used to in terms of suspension firmness as to whether or not you'll like or loathe the ride quality in the 4C.
Your original list of potential choices is quite diverse and based primarily upon the look of the car I would guess as each is in a very different segment so not at all comparable in terms of the drive/comfort levels/practicality etc. The Ghibli has a ride I'm sure you'll find harsh if you don't test drive one with the optional Skyhook adaptive damper system. It's cabin has also been built down to a cost due to the low production volumes and the intent to maximise sales by competing at the lower end of it's pricing point. It is likely to disappoint next to a volume manufacturer like Audi that is able to fund higher quality materials across the vast output they make. The Ghibli needs the full leather option and alcantara headlining to look and feel like a premium car IMHO. It also lags behind in terms of the media unit even though it was developed with Tom Tom. It's a great looking car on the road though IMHO especially from the front and the build quality of cars I've driven appears to be very good.
The standard 4C will undoubtedly have a more forgiving ride quality as it forgoes the optional race suspension set up fitted to the Launch Edition cars. It all depends upon what you are used to in terms of suspension firmness as to whether or not you'll like or loathe the ride quality in the 4C.
Your original list of potential choices is quite diverse and based primarily upon the look of the car I would guess as each is in a very different segment so not at all comparable in terms of the drive/comfort levels/practicality etc. The Ghibli has a ride I'm sure you'll find harsh if you don't test drive one with the optional Skyhook adaptive damper system. It's cabin has also been built down to a cost due to the low production volumes and the intent to maximise sales by competing at the lower end of it's pricing point. It is likely to disappoint next to a volume manufacturer like Audi that is able to fund higher quality materials across the vast output they make. The Ghibli needs the full leather option and alcantara headlining to look and feel like a premium car IMHO. It also lags behind in terms of the media unit even though it was developed with Tom Tom. It's a great looking car on the road though IMHO especially from the front and the build quality of cars I've driven appears to be very good.
So what would you be looking at for a replacement for my R8? my maximum budget is around £65K or at stretch £70K ?
my requirements are:-
1. fun to drive
2. looks gorgeous
3. sounds good
4. Handles well
5. Not too harsh to drive
I'm not bothered wether its a saloon, coupe, convertible/spider
- Pete
my requirements are:-
1. fun to drive
2. looks gorgeous
3. sounds good
4. Handles well
5. Not too harsh to drive
I'm not bothered wether its a saloon, coupe, convertible/spider
- Pete
errek72 said:
crostonian said:
But unfortunately the real world mpg is less than 40
Real world for a 4C is between 7l/100km (slow) and 10l/100km (hooning), according to google that would be between 30 and 20 mpg - is that right?No idea what an R8 does in reality.
- Pete
Lotus Exige V6/Evora. They meet all your criteria and more...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XcjnpJofT_k
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XcjnpJofT_k
prg123 said:
So what would you be looking at for a replacement for my R8? my maximum budget is around £65K or at stretch £70K ?
my requirements are:-
1. fun to drive
2. looks gorgeous
3. sounds good
4. Handles well
5. Not too harsh to drive
I'm not bothered wether its a saloon, coupe, convertible/spider
- Pete
my requirements are:-
1. fun to drive
2. looks gorgeous
3. sounds good
4. Handles well
5. Not too harsh to drive
I'm not bothered wether its a saloon, coupe, convertible/spider
- Pete
Edited by Oilchange on Monday 30th June 01:14
Oilchange said:
Lotus Exige V6/Evora. They meet all your criteria and more...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XcjnpJofT_k
Are the v6 exiges meant to be easier to live with than the previous s2s? I know they got heavier but haven't read up on them regarding comfort etc.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XcjnpJofT_k
prg123 said:
So what would you be looking at for a replacement for my R8? my maximum budget is around £65K or at stretch £70K ?
my requirements are:-
1. fun to drive
2. looks gorgeous
3. sounds good
4. Handles well
5. Not too harsh to drive
I'm not bothered wether its a saloon, coupe, convertible/spider
- Pete
my requirements are:-
1. fun to drive
2. looks gorgeous
3. sounds good
4. Handles well
5. Not too harsh to drive
I'm not bothered wether its a saloon, coupe, convertible/spider
- Pete
Edited by Oilchange on Monday 30th June 01:14
prg123 said:
So what would you be looking at for a replacement for my R8? my maximum budget is around £65K or at stretch £70K ?
my requirements are:-
1. fun to drive
2. looks gorgeous
3. sounds good
4. Handles well
5. Not too harsh to drive
I'm not bothered wether its a saloon, coupe, convertible/spider
- Pete
A 4.7 Maserati GranTurismo would fit all those requirements, I drove mine over the A93 Glenshee road yesterday morning and it was great fun but also comfortable and refined, it sounds fantastic if you press the sport button to open up the exhaust valves.my requirements are:-
1. fun to drive
2. looks gorgeous
3. sounds good
4. Handles well
5. Not too harsh to drive
I'm not bothered wether its a saloon, coupe, convertible/spider
- Pete
I haven't driven a new one (V6 Exige) but by all accounts they are fine to live with. All the video reviews I've seen have elevated them to Godlike status, they're that good drivers cars.
Have you seen the Harris vid? It's somewhere around here
Have you seen the Harris vid? It's somewhere around here
Fantuzzi said:
Oilchange said:
Lotus Exige V6/Evora. They meet all your criteria and more...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XcjnpJofT_k
Are the v6 exiges meant to be easier to live with than the previous s2s? I know they got heavier but haven't read up on them regarding comfort etc.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XcjnpJofT_k
prg123 said:
So what would you be looking at for a replacement for my R8? my maximum budget is around £65K or at stretch £70K ?
my requirements are:-
1. fun to drive
2. looks gorgeous
3. sounds good
4. Handles well
5. Not too harsh to drive
I'm not bothered wether its a saloon, coupe, convertible/spider
- Pete
my requirements are:-
1. fun to drive
2. looks gorgeous
3. sounds good
4. Handles well
5. Not too harsh to drive
I'm not bothered wether its a saloon, coupe, convertible/spider
- Pete
Edited by Oilchange on Monday 30th June 01:14
Oilchange said:
I haven't driven a new one (V6 Exige) but by all accounts they are fine to live with. All the video reviews I've seen have elevated them to Godlike status, they're that good drivers cars.
Have you seen the Harris vid? It's somewhere around here
Yeah I saw it when it came out, cant remember much of it though. Will have to give it another watch.Have you seen the Harris vid? It's somewhere around here
Fantuzzi said:
Oilchange said:
Lotus Exige V6/Evora. They meet all your criteria and more...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XcjnpJofT_k
Are the v6 exiges meant to be easier to live with than the previous s2s? I know they got heavier but haven't read up on them regarding comfort etc.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XcjnpJofT_k
prg123 said:
So what would you be looking at for a replacement for my R8? my maximum budget is around £65K or at stretch £70K ?
my requirements are:-
1. fun to drive
2. looks gorgeous
3. sounds good
4. Handles well
5. Not too harsh to drive
I'm not bothered wether its a saloon, coupe, convertible/spider
- Pete
my requirements are:-
1. fun to drive
2. looks gorgeous
3. sounds good
4. Handles well
5. Not too harsh to drive
I'm not bothered wether its a saloon, coupe, convertible/spider
- Pete
Edited by Oilchange on Monday 30th June 01:14
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