Best ALFA 105 GTV spec
Discussion
Hi All,
I'm about to buy a 105 GTV and have a choice of models.
I'd always assumed the 2000 was the ultimate incarnation of the car, however, I'm hearing whispers that the 1750 might actually be the one to have...
I know that condition is all important and should really be the deciding factor, however, assuming the two cars are identical, is the 1750 or 2000 king?
I personally prefer the 1750 interior, smaller rear lights and overall slightly more "dainty" feel, however, the car has to be an investment to a certain extent, and I'd be more than happy with either model at the end of the day.
Which should I go for and what are the desirable bits to keep an eye out for, such as wheels, bumper styles, seats, etc.?
Any links will be much appreciated.
Thanks
I'm about to buy a 105 GTV and have a choice of models.
I'd always assumed the 2000 was the ultimate incarnation of the car, however, I'm hearing whispers that the 1750 might actually be the one to have...
I know that condition is all important and should really be the deciding factor, however, assuming the two cars are identical, is the 1750 or 2000 king?
I personally prefer the 1750 interior, smaller rear lights and overall slightly more "dainty" feel, however, the car has to be an investment to a certain extent, and I'd be more than happy with either model at the end of the day.
Which should I go for and what are the desirable bits to keep an eye out for, such as wheels, bumper styles, seats, etc.?
Any links will be much appreciated.
Thanks
1750 GTV looks neater - as you say smaller lights, simpler grille treatment, classic interior. The 1750 is also smoother and revier than the 2000, although the torque of the 2000 makes it great in everyday driving.
For others a step front/scalino 1600 is the one to have although many seem to have been turned into GTA reps.
For others a step front/scalino 1600 is the one to have although many seem to have been turned into GTA reps.
I've got one of each... 
But I 'will' have to sell one probably next year and it will almost certainly be the 2000GTV, there is only one thing about a 2000GTV that is better than a (lightly modified 1750) and that is the extra grunt of the engine. My 2000 engine feels much stronger right through the rev range than the 1750 and contrary to popular opinion revs just as high and just as willingly. As standard the 1750 didn't get the LSD (hence why I said lightly modified), which is well worth having. I originality isn't an issue as 1750 with a 2000 Motor would perhaps be my ideal.
Both the detailing of the exterior and the whole design of the interior of the 1750 is much much nicer than a 2000, it feels better made too. The 1750 Mk1, which has the cleaner bumpers without overiders and the Flying Buttress seats are the ones to go for if you can find them, but I would say those seats are not as comfortable to sit in as the 1750 Mk2, or the 2000 GTV ones. The Mk1 got single circuit Brakes too, which makes life much easier and cheaper when servicing the brakes, the Mk2 and 2000GTV has the twin servo, dual circuit system, which can be a bugger to bleed and has an eye watering price to replace the Master cylinder if it fails. There is slightly more room in the back of a 2000, allegedly they moved the bulkhead back slightly, but you wouldn't notice and rear space isn't usually a priority for most.
But... and this is a big but too, condition is still everything, if you came across a cleaner better kept example of a 2000 GTV, I'd be inclined to go for that over a scruffy 1750 which needs work. The 1750's tend to be more expensive too, so your budget (which is?) may get a better one.
But I 'will' have to sell one probably next year and it will almost certainly be the 2000GTV, there is only one thing about a 2000GTV that is better than a (lightly modified 1750) and that is the extra grunt of the engine. My 2000 engine feels much stronger right through the rev range than the 1750 and contrary to popular opinion revs just as high and just as willingly. As standard the 1750 didn't get the LSD (hence why I said lightly modified), which is well worth having. I originality isn't an issue as 1750 with a 2000 Motor would perhaps be my ideal.
Both the detailing of the exterior and the whole design of the interior of the 1750 is much much nicer than a 2000, it feels better made too. The 1750 Mk1, which has the cleaner bumpers without overiders and the Flying Buttress seats are the ones to go for if you can find them, but I would say those seats are not as comfortable to sit in as the 1750 Mk2, or the 2000 GTV ones. The Mk1 got single circuit Brakes too, which makes life much easier and cheaper when servicing the brakes, the Mk2 and 2000GTV has the twin servo, dual circuit system, which can be a bugger to bleed and has an eye watering price to replace the Master cylinder if it fails. There is slightly more room in the back of a 2000, allegedly they moved the bulkhead back slightly, but you wouldn't notice and rear space isn't usually a priority for most.
But... and this is a big but too, condition is still everything, if you came across a cleaner better kept example of a 2000 GTV, I'd be inclined to go for that over a scruffy 1750 which needs work. The 1750's tend to be more expensive too, so your budget (which is?) may get a better one.
Hi Mitch, thanks very much for the information, it is very interesting to hear from someone who has good experience of both.
I've got the choice from a couple of Condition 1 2000s or a 1750 Mk2 for the same price.
I prefer the purity of the 1750; the quarter light openers, internal door handles, centre console, dashboard, rear lights and grille all jump out to me. The gold cloverleaf badges also look great!
The 1750 has an LSD fitted and I think I could have a choice of final drive ratio, if you've got a recommendation?
I've driven a 1600 and 2000 back-to-back and noticed the difference in power and torque, I got both up to about 70mph and they cruised equally well, so I think I could easily live with somewhere in between for the kind of driving I'd do.
I'll drive the 1750 and a 2000 to make my final decision, but I think I can go with my heart and head on this!
Thanks,
Alex
I've got the choice from a couple of Condition 1 2000s or a 1750 Mk2 for the same price.
I prefer the purity of the 1750; the quarter light openers, internal door handles, centre console, dashboard, rear lights and grille all jump out to me. The gold cloverleaf badges also look great!
The 1750 has an LSD fitted and I think I could have a choice of final drive ratio, if you've got a recommendation?
I've driven a 1600 and 2000 back-to-back and noticed the difference in power and torque, I got both up to about 70mph and they cruised equally well, so I think I could easily live with somewhere in between for the kind of driving I'd do.
I'll drive the 1750 and a 2000 to make my final decision, but I think I can go with my heart and head on this!
Thanks,
Alex
I've always found the standard final drive ratio to be ideal. I drove a friends 2000GTV, which had the higher final drive, can't remember the ratio, but felt it didn't help acceleration enough to live with the compromise on long distance cruising. it also ran out of revs too quickly in first and second while he was thrashing it around a load of Berwickshire farm yards on the rally we were on.
It's going to come down to what you want to use the Car for, a track day car could probably benefit from the slight extra punch, but if you plan on using it as a fast road car for long journeys, keep the standard ratio.
It's going to come down to what you want to use the Car for, a track day car could probably benefit from the slight extra punch, but if you plan on using it as a fast road car for long journeys, keep the standard ratio.
I really like the simplicity of the Juniors as I feel it shows off the lines of the car best, especially the Scalino.
Saying that, the interior is just a little bit too simple for me and, although plenty have been converted (even 'in period') to 1750 and 2000 engines, I personally prefer things to be as standard as possible.
As I've got to keep one eye on this as an investment, something stock with matching numbers makes that a bit easier.
Saying that, the interior is just a little bit too simple for me and, although plenty have been converted (even 'in period') to 1750 and 2000 engines, I personally prefer things to be as standard as possible.
As I've got to keep one eye on this as an investment, something stock with matching numbers makes that a bit easier.
You won't go wrong with buying an original unmolested 105 coupe - fewer left every day.
I would not get too hung up on the matching numbers topic - of the four step nose 105's I have owned/currently own the factory have been unable to confirm the engine number used at original build - only a range of numbers (thousands in the range).
Enjoy, lovely cars all round.
I would not get too hung up on the matching numbers topic - of the four step nose 105's I have owned/currently own the factory have been unable to confirm the engine number used at original build - only a range of numbers (thousands in the range).
Enjoy, lovely cars all round.
The one that has documented proof that the rust was repaired correctly 
Then, for me, it's a 1600 Scaliano, 1750 GTV, 1600 GT Junior last would be the 2000GTV. I don't like front and rear light treatment on the 2000, too busy. But the one with the best body wins always!
Found a twinspark donor yet
No such thing as matching numbers for these Alfas just engine type. ie. *00536*xxxxx is any 1600 GT Junior or Duetto.
Then, for me, it's a 1600 Scaliano, 1750 GTV, 1600 GT Junior last would be the 2000GTV. I don't like front and rear light treatment on the 2000, too busy. But the one with the best body wins always!
Found a twinspark donor yet
No such thing as matching numbers for these Alfas just engine type. ie. *00536*xxxxx is any 1600 GT Junior or Duetto.
Edited by craig_m67 on Wednesday 13th August 08:47
The 1750 is rust free; I've been under it on a lift and it looks like new. It has now been lightly undersealed but there are pictures to back up the original condition.
Apparently the engine number is listed alongside the VIN in the original bill of sale, which matches the numbers on the car.
This can is too original and I love the Nord engine too much to swap it for a TS. I had a TS in a 156 and really rate it, but I just want a late '60s car to drive like one, and this includes pumping the throttle to prime the Webers as far as I'm concerned!
Apparently the engine number is listed alongside the VIN in the original bill of sale, which matches the numbers on the car.
This can is too original and I love the Nord engine too much to swap it for a TS. I had a TS in a 156 and really rate it, but I just want a late '60s car to drive like one, and this includes pumping the throttle to prime the Webers as far as I'm concerned!
I may be off but the TS in the 156 was a Fiat unit I think. The nords are limited to the 155 phase I and were switched to the iron Fiat lumps in phase II. Still it made a good job of feeling and sounding like a nord. From what I hear the nords from a 75 are plug&play.
Oh and 1750 Giallo, Grigio or Verde Oliva please.
Oh and 1750 Giallo, Grigio or Verde Oliva please.
I didn't realise the last of the TS in the 156 wasn't the same as the unit in the 75. I loved my 156 and realised that the JTS wasn't an improvement when I drove my mate's later car.
I'm not ruling out some reversible mods such as a different exhaust system, induction kit and electronic ignition, however I know the car in standard form is more capable than me, so why make it faster when I can only utilise it in a straight line?!
I'm pretty sure I've found the car for me and I think I can probably have so input into the details of how it's finished, so it'll be damn near perfect in my eyes.
What oil pressure should I be getting at a warm (just below 80) idle, and is a bit of blue oily smoke on over-run a big issue? I've not seen this car running yet but the others I drove sat at about (if I remember correctly) the top of the lowest major division on the gauge, (20psi?) idling warn and gave a bit of a puff on over-run.
I'll put some pics up in a few weeks when I hopefully have the car.
I'm not ruling out some reversible mods such as a different exhaust system, induction kit and electronic ignition, however I know the car in standard form is more capable than me, so why make it faster when I can only utilise it in a straight line?!
I'm pretty sure I've found the car for me and I think I can probably have so input into the details of how it's finished, so it'll be damn near perfect in my eyes.
What oil pressure should I be getting at a warm (just below 80) idle, and is a bit of blue oily smoke on over-run a big issue? I've not seen this car running yet but the others I drove sat at about (if I remember correctly) the top of the lowest major division on the gauge, (20psi?) idling warn and gave a bit of a puff on over-run.
I'll put some pics up in a few weeks when I hopefully have the car.
If you want to be sure perhaps lend a compression tester and do a quick compression check from cold via the plug opening? Not hard to do -disconnect distributor though- and at least gives a good status - compression should be similar for all cylinders (youtube).
1750's were popular because they had the best compromise of sound, power and flexibility. Also the gearing is nice and short.
At least that is what I've been told.
1750's were popular because they had the best compromise of sound, power and flexibility. Also the gearing is nice and short.
At least that is what I've been told.
The gearing on a 1750 is the same as a 2000, except you don't get the LSD on a standard 1750. But we've been through the pro's and Cons already.
oil pressure sounds about right, but the gauges are notoriously vague so in reality the only thing they are good for is too see if it rises and falls when it should and to watch for a sudden drop. shouldn't.t really be blue smoke to be honest, though it may just a minor wear issue on the valve guides or piston rings. a compression test is never a bad thing, done with an open throttle.
oil pressure sounds about right, but the gauges are notoriously vague so in reality the only thing they are good for is too see if it rises and falls when it should and to watch for a sudden drop. shouldn't.t really be blue smoke to be honest, though it may just a minor wear issue on the valve guides or piston rings. a compression test is never a bad thing, done with an open throttle.
The gearing on a 1750 is the same as a 2000, except you don't get the LSD on a standard 1750. But we've been through the pro's and Cons already.
oil pressure sounds about right, but the gauges are notoriously vague so in reality the only thing they are good for is too see if it rises and falls when it should and to watch for a sudden drop. shouldn't.t really be blue smoke to be honest, though it may just a minor wear issue on the valve guides or piston rings. a compression test is never a bad thing, done with an open throttle.
oil pressure sounds about right, but the gauges are notoriously vague so in reality the only thing they are good for is too see if it rises and falls when it should and to watch for a sudden drop. shouldn't.t really be blue smoke to be honest, though it may just a minor wear issue on the valve guides or piston rings. a compression test is never a bad thing, done with an open throttle.
Thanks again Mitch, it looked like worn valve guides to me, or possibly sticky control rings.
Good news on the oil pressure, gives me an idea of what to look for.
To be honest, the car will do less than 3k miles a year and I'll always check the level before using it (I used to have a FIAT Coupe 20VT so this is a near religious devotion for me!), so if it burns a bit more than usual it isn't the end of the world.
Good news on the oil pressure, gives me an idea of what to look for.
To be honest, the car will do less than 3k miles a year and I'll always check the level before using it (I used to have a FIAT Coupe 20VT so this is a near religious devotion for me!), so if it burns a bit more than usual it isn't the end of the world.
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