Fiat Coupe 16V Turbo restoration project

Fiat Coupe 16V Turbo restoration project

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Discussion

Vitorio

4,296 posts

142 months

Monday 28th November 2016
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Liquid Knight said:
Winter runner for now but plan to take my nephews to track days next season. The Spider is off the road now I have the Bravo to save her from the salt grit. Also a few Alfaisms to address ready to sell in the Spring. smile

I also plan to work on the Coupe over Winter and maybe do the MOT stuff for my Fantasia.
Ah good, nice to see the spider getting some attention and being spared the salt grit.

By the way LK, i think you are the right guy to ask this. Im mulling over getting a project italian (itll be next year before i can divert enough finances to do anything seriously, but preparation is half the fun). I want something small, light and FIRE engine powered (as those are easy and plentiful to work with/swap parts between for upgrades). Plans include lowering, stripping it out to make a B-road go-kart etc..

Options in mind are now: Cinq sporting, Punto mk1 (although i dont like how they look), lancia Ypsilon (very little specific upgrade parts, but i figure anything punto-based should fit considering the shared platform)

Any pros/cons of those cars, and any advice on which you would pick? Im leaning towards the Lancia right now, standard front and back ARBs, and somewhat unique/interesting.

And my sincere apologies for this thread hijacking

Liquid Knight

Original Poster:

15,754 posts

182 months

Monday 28th November 2016
quotequote all
Not at all.

The Lancia will give the most head and heart ache. Very few in the UK and not many parts around.

The Cinquecento/Seicento platform is the natural habitat for the FIRE series of engines but you will need an 1108cc Sporting otherwise engine mounts and bell housings are different. There isn't a lot of space under the bonnet and they are Polska FIAT so the panels are crazy glued on. If you need to cut out rust expect welding to be a smelly process.



The Punto is a better bet. You can fit a newer 1.4 SuperFIRE in there with ease (compared to the Cinquecento/Seicento it can and has been done but expect more faff) and obviously Punto GT bits bolt straight on instead of needing modification. I'd look for a clean Mk1...

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/1998-MK1-FIAT-PUNTO-SPOR...

...take the 85hp 1242cc 16V out and get a Bravo t-jet 150 donor. Aim for around the £600-800 mark for an 07-08 car and sell the bits you don't use to get most of the outlay back. You'll need to either remove and replac the entire loom or bypass the immobiliser with an after market ecu.

Avoid the Mk2 Punto as the electric power steering is as crap as it is reliable.

If you want to stick to traditional FIRE and basic upgrades. I have a Punto 60 1242 8V (narrower block than the 75) 866 cam' (from a 75) and base plate for a bike carb' conversion. That should drop into any of the above platforms. My mate has a Punto GT rear beam with calipers, discs, springs and shocks for a parts bin brake and suspension upgrade and I'm here to help. smile

Vitorio

4,296 posts

142 months

Monday 28th November 2016
quotequote all
Im not in the UK (sadly), so engine swap wise id want to be somewhat more subtle and stealthy (dont think ill do anything more drastic then dropping a cammed 1242 into a cinq sporting), as that kind of stuff is strictly not very legal here (without tons of hoop jumping). Prices here are rather meh as well, no way i can find a T-jet bravo for €1K, id be happy/lucky to find a non rusty cinq sporting below that price

Parts wise you make a good point on the Lancia, but i figured most of the mechanical bits (suspension/engine) should be entirely punto parts anyway, is this assumption wrong?

Ive tinkered with a cinq before (but ended up scrapping it due to more rust then i was willing to handle), so im familiar/comfortable with that car and SPI FIRE engines, so maybe i should stick with a cinq, 866 cam it and put a P60 bottom end in there, that should make for a decently pokey toy, just cant help running away with mad ideas while i cant yet get started.

Liquid Knight

Original Poster:

15,754 posts

182 months

Monday 28th November 2016
quotequote all
Where are you?

I might be able to send a cam' in the post or roadtrip the engine over.



hehe

Edited by Liquid Knight on Monday 28th November 22:47

Liquid Knight

Original Poster:

15,754 posts

182 months

Monday 28th November 2016
quotequote all


That's doable. smile

Vitorio

4,296 posts

142 months

Tuesday 29th November 2016
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Haha proper job LK, i actually live pretty close to Utrecht hehe

Ill keep the cam in mind (should i not be able to source one locally). An engine should be available over here i think.

Either way, first got some mortgage stuff to work out and get my garage sorted, then hopefully spring next year ill be picking up something small and italian to mess around with all summer.

Liquid Knight

Original Poster:

15,754 posts

182 months

Thursday 2nd February 2017
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I have my Fiat Coupe up on ramps to WD-40 the nuts and bolts to fit the new down pipe but it looks to be fine.

I can't feel it leaking and there are signs it isn't as old as I expected.

However none of the gaskets have ever been replaced including the manifold gasket where a crack has been previously welded.

I might just need a new exhaust to turbo, turbo to cat' gasket set or the manifold may be cracked again.

The oil leak I thought was due to the chav'd cam' cover and gasket not being replaced could be due to the filler around the hot oil feed to the sump from the turbo. Another bodge as the sump has no gasket either and what feels like tile silicone adhesive.















So as I have the old girl on ramps I may as well drain the sump, take it off, get it blasted, welded (to replace the filler) if possible or replaced with a new gasket. Take the manifold off, check for cracks repair or replace all with new gaskets, nuts and bolts. rolleyes

I'm beginning to wonder if it's worth it again.

Evoluzione

10,345 posts

242 months

Friday 3rd February 2017
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It isn't, that's why it was (hopefully) cheap to buy.
It's highly likely the sump will be rusted right through, so check for that before going much further.

Liquid Knight

Original Poster:

15,754 posts

182 months

Friday 3rd February 2017
quotequote all
Threaded pipe ends welded to the flange on the cat' and the bolts are so rusted they rounded off. The whole exhaust has to come off so I can remove the cat' and down pipe together, grind out the bolts and refit the whole system. hehe

I would have thought replacement sump pans would be available considering the lineage of the engine. No luck finding one yet.

Evoluzione

10,345 posts

242 months

Saturday 4th February 2017
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Every car the engine was used in had its own unique sump and they are all in short supply/expensive, the one you had on the yellow one would have fitted, but would have needed the pipe at the front welding on.

Liquid Knight

Original Poster:

15,754 posts

182 months

Saturday 4th February 2017
quotequote all
Evoluzione said:
Every car the engine was used in had its own unique sump and they are all in short supply/expensive, the one you had on the yellow one would have fitted, but would have needed the pipe at the front welding on.
I was thinking that...

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/fiat-coupe-16v-oil-sump-...

...the one on the yellow car had half a front, back two sides and not much bottom. It was mostly held together with paint.

Evoluzione

10,345 posts

242 months

Sunday 5th February 2017
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There is a HF Turbo one on there which could be made to fit, about 22 quid I think.

Liquid Knight

Original Poster:

15,754 posts

182 months

Sunday 5th February 2017
quotequote all
Evoluzione said:
There is a HF Turbo one on there which could be made to fit, about 22 quid I think.
Cut the belly off and weld a band around it for the stroke. I looked at it but it would be robbing a Delta Hf project.

Liquid Knight

Original Poster:

15,754 posts

182 months

Monday 6th February 2017
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Silly question.

Are the 16V N/A and Turbo heads the same?

I was told they were and kept the N/A head in case anything happened to my Turbo one (also port and clean the valves so I had basically a reconditioned head if the gasket went on mine).

Now I'm selling it to raise funds for the sump and want to make sure it is the same for listing accuracy.

The gasket sets are the same but you never know with the Italian sense of humor.

helix402

7,832 posts

181 months

Monday 6th February 2017
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You can check if the heads are the same by checking on eper.

Liquid Knight

Original Poster:

15,754 posts

182 months

Monday 6th February 2017
quotequote all
helix402 said:
You can check if the heads are the same by checking on eper.
There's a Tipo head on there with the same part number. biggrin

Liquid Knight

Original Poster:

15,754 posts

182 months

Monday 6th February 2017
quotequote all
Here's a thought. Instead of trawling the interweb and asking I have the part in my shed and the car on my driveway.

Both heads have the same 7669070 part number.

woohoo

Yep, that happened. silly

Evoluzione

10,345 posts

242 months

Monday 6th February 2017
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Heads are the same, it's just the cams and exhaust valve (material) which are different.

Liquid Knight

Original Poster:

15,754 posts

182 months

Saturday 11th February 2017
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Whoops. While making inquiries about parts for my Coupe I accidentally found a Punto GT with the 16V Turbo conversion. So the Coupe is going and the Punto is on it's way. wink

A lot less work, less faff and worth roughly the same as the Coupe when finished (considering the clocking issue).

Liquid Knight

Original Poster:

15,754 posts

182 months

Saturday 11th February 2017
quotequote all


Nice colour. Shame the steering column split and it took half an hour to get it off the street and on to my drive. hehe