Alfa 75 (or maaaaaybe GTV6)
Discussion
Hi,
Am I mad to consider an Alfa 75? - bloody top gear's Alfa owning comments again last night! I have to be honest I don't know a huge ammount about them, but RWD and an alfa V6 sound like a good starting point. So can anyone tell me a bit about them? Things like....
1) What to watch out for - should I expect to put my fingers through the bodywork by now (my dad had an Alfetta which disintergrated in a few short years from new!)? Will it overheat 3 miles down the road? Stereotypes aside - what goes wrong with them? Are spares a complete nightmare if they do go wrong?
2) What's the handling like?
3) Slightly odd question - how big are they - I know they're not small, but are we talking 3 series size or 5 series and up? Does that mean they tend to come with plenty of kit?
4) Was originally tempted by the even rarer and even more fragile(?) GTV6 - can anyone tell me how they compare in terms of performance, handling, reliability etc.
Would ask about the twin spark, but to be honest, I don't think I could own an alfa without that 'mini V12' in the front
Am I mad to consider an Alfa 75? - bloody top gear's Alfa owning comments again last night! I have to be honest I don't know a huge ammount about them, but RWD and an alfa V6 sound like a good starting point. So can anyone tell me a bit about them? Things like....
1) What to watch out for - should I expect to put my fingers through the bodywork by now (my dad had an Alfetta which disintergrated in a few short years from new!)? Will it overheat 3 miles down the road? Stereotypes aside - what goes wrong with them? Are spares a complete nightmare if they do go wrong?
2) What's the handling like?
3) Slightly odd question - how big are they - I know they're not small, but are we talking 3 series size or 5 series and up? Does that mean they tend to come with plenty of kit?
4) Was originally tempted by the even rarer and even more fragile(?) GTV6 - can anyone tell me how they compare in terms of performance, handling, reliability etc.
Would ask about the twin spark, but to be honest, I don't think I could own an alfa without that 'mini V12' in the front
I have a GTV6. If you are above average height, get one for the great driving position (although consider strengthening the seat mounts - my slightly heavier friend sat in mine & broke it) and of course the fabulous engine note.
Rust is always going to be a problem
Mine's shot. But still, if you find one that's pretty unrusty, you have a winner.
Perennial problems include faulty speedo sender units (speedo & odo don't work intermittently), fragile gearchange linkages, poor quality window motors (apparently the Jetta/Golf ones fit in quite nicely though) and in my experience, poor air con. Other than that, you'll find yourself cruising at about 5500 rpm in top just to hear the engine at its sweetest, loving the details like inboard rear brakes, and the sure-fottedness on the road. Oh, the boot is fairly small, and the backseats pretty worthless too ;-) But enormous fun.
Rust is always going to be a problem
Mine's shot. But still, if you find one that's pretty unrusty, you have a winner. Perennial problems include faulty speedo sender units (speedo & odo don't work intermittently), fragile gearchange linkages, poor quality window motors (apparently the Jetta/Golf ones fit in quite nicely though) and in my experience, poor air con. Other than that, you'll find yourself cruising at about 5500 rpm in top just to hear the engine at its sweetest, loving the details like inboard rear brakes, and the sure-fottedness on the road. Oh, the boot is fairly small, and the backseats pretty worthless too ;-) But enormous fun.
Really? I just read a review that said 'the rust which plagued the alfetta had also magically disapeared with the introduction of the V6' maybe he was being ironic certainly, my parents 4 cylinder one had major problems with tin-worm. I was only about 4 at the time and it must be one of my earliest automotive memories - maybe if they'd had a knackered escort instead I wouldn't be lusting after cars these days.....
Looking it seems the main problems are poor, but not necesarily faulty gearchange and front brakes, coupled with niggling electrical faults. Seem to be surprisingly few which have catually left people stood at the side of the road (this comment will of course come back to haunt me if I ever get one)
Think I've seen this one in the PH classifieds before www.pistonheads.com/sales/52106.htm - seems to be the going rate for a decent example. The 75's are cheaper still and have the added advantage of an extra 500cc on some cars.
It does always remind me a tiny bit of a skoda rapide tho
certainly, my parents 4 cylinder one had major problems with tin-worm. I was only about 4 at the time and it must be one of my earliest automotive memories - maybe if they'd had a knackered escort instead I wouldn't be lusting after cars these days..... Looking it seems the main problems are poor, but not necesarily faulty gearchange and front brakes, coupled with niggling electrical faults. Seem to be surprisingly few which have catually left people stood at the side of the road (this comment will of course come back to haunt me if I ever get one)
Think I've seen this one in the PH classifieds before www.pistonheads.com/sales/52106.htm - seems to be the going rate for a decent example. The 75's are cheaper still and have the added advantage of an extra 500cc on some cars.
It does always remind me a tiny bit of a skoda rapide tho
75s -
Electric woes with the Alfa control stuff in the middle of the dash (bear in mind some of the faults with it can be an MOT failure)
Driveshaft donuts wear nastily
Gear linkage
Trim wears very easily
Bigger than you think about 3 series id say
They dont seem to suffer too badly from rust mind. Id love to have a twin spark one to hoon about in (at the right price ie. very little!)
Electric woes with the Alfa control stuff in the middle of the dash (bear in mind some of the faults with it can be an MOT failure)
Driveshaft donuts wear nastily
Gear linkage
Trim wears very easily
Bigger than you think
about 3 series id say They dont seem to suffer too badly from rust mind. Id love to have a twin spark one to hoon about in (at the right price ie. very little!)
Edited by shouldbworking on Thursday 8th February 08:49
If I were in the UK that one in the classifieds would be sold!
Trust me on the rust - I live where there is no snow, no salt on the roads and we're about 400 miles inland as the crow flies. My baby is rotted
As for size, here are a 75 V6, GTV6, E30 325i and E90 325i for comparison:
www.carfolio.com/specifications/models/comp/?id=28314&id=28336&id=31163&id=125488
HTH
Ciao
Zak
Trust me on the rust - I live where there is no snow, no salt on the roads and we're about 400 miles inland as the crow flies. My baby is rotted
As for size, here are a 75 V6, GTV6, E30 325i and E90 325i for comparison:
www.carfolio.com/specifications/models/comp/?id=28314&id=28336&id=31163&id=125488
HTH
Ciao
Zak
Don't worry - having heard my dad's horror stories I can believe you! Did see a south african GTV6 in an old copy of Retro Cars (or practical performance car maybe) that I dug out the other day with the caption to the effect of 'local weather allows GTVs to stay as clean as this' again, I wonder if they were being a little ironic!
Interesting to see the GTV is shorter than an E30 3 series. I have one of those sat on my drive at the moment (£100 to anyone who wants one BTW!) and I assumed the alfa would be quite a lot bigger. It is a substantial drop in power (and claimed performance figures) to the 3 litre '75 though. Has anyone here driven both?
Ideally what I want is something with reasonable handling, yet far more power than it has road holding! As far as I can see massive grip is almost a disadvantage from the point of having fun on the roads, yet you need a certain ammount of grunt to get past the Sunday drivers. 1970s suspension design, but with a nice V6 in the front might just be the answer, especially clothed in giugiaro bodywork!
Interesting to see the GTV is shorter than an E30 3 series. I have one of those sat on my drive at the moment (£100 to anyone who wants one BTW!) and I assumed the alfa would be quite a lot bigger. It is a substantial drop in power (and claimed performance figures) to the 3 litre '75 though. Has anyone here driven both?
Ideally what I want is something with reasonable handling, yet far more power than it has road holding! As far as I can see massive grip is almost a disadvantage from the point of having fun on the roads, yet you need a certain ammount of grunt to get past the Sunday drivers. 1970s suspension design, but with a nice V6 in the front might just be the answer, especially clothed in giugiaro bodywork!
Couple of boring GTV questions too.... any problems with leaks? do they have a hatchback of some description at the back and whats the luggage space like? Erm, at the risk of sounding like a bit of a girl - what's the reversing visibility like?
Oh - that's a point, I presume the other Alfa saloons (155, 45, 33 etc are all FWD?)
Still really interested to hear from anyone who's driven both a 75 and GTV.....
Oh - that's a point, I presume the other Alfa saloons (155, 45, 33 etc are all FWD?)
Still really interested to hear from anyone who's driven both a 75 and GTV.....
The GTV should be good for boot space - except that the seats dont fold down! doh!
In other news - a 75 i missed out on yesterday. Set myself a very very low limit to stop myself getting a 4th car. Amazing amount of car for the money!
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Alfa-Romeo-75-3
Edit - yes,146, 145, 155, 33 are all FWD
Although owning an alfa boxer engine should be a must on any petrolheads list so dont dismiss the 33
In other news - a 75 i missed out on yesterday. Set myself a very very low limit to stop myself getting a 4th car. Amazing amount of car for the money!
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Alfa-Romeo-75-3
Edit - yes,146, 145, 155, 33 are all FWD
Although owning an alfa boxer engine should be a must on any petrolheads list so dont dismiss the 33
Edited by shouldbworking on Tuesday 6th February 12:31
Jesus - that is a lot of car for the money! Makes £500 volvo 360 GLTs look distinctly overpriced!
The only down side I can see is that it does have a particularly nasty dash!! The GTV definitely scores higher on that point Slightly worried about any car that's had welding done though as the new MOT regs have led to some of the testers being very jumpy about any cars with repairs - I speak from bitter experience after a friend of mine who's structural engineer for a car company and a skilled fabircator repaired a subframe on our Czechwrecks car in 3mm thick steel plate (stronger than the original) and the guy refused to accept a repaired subframe. I supose the lesson is 'grin it flat and paint over it'.....
The only down side I can see is that it does have a particularly nasty dash!! The GTV definitely scores higher on that point
Slightly worried about any car that's had welding done though as the new MOT regs have led to some of the testers being very jumpy about any cars with repairs - I speak from bitter experience after a friend of mine who's structural engineer for a car company and a skilled fabircator repaired a subframe on our Czechwrecks car in 3mm thick steel plate (stronger than the original) and the guy refused to accept a repaired subframe. I supose the lesson is 'grin it flat and paint over it'.....I used to have a 75 Twin Spark. I did over 100000 miles in it and it was a fantastic car which I still miss. Needed careful looking after but if you can find a good one I would not hesitate. This one looks pretty nice:
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ALFA-ROMEO-75-3
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ALFA-ROMEO-75-3
chris71 said:
Hi,
Am I mad to consider an Alfa 75? - bloody top gear's Alfa owning comments again last night! I have to be honest I don't know a huge ammount about them, but RWD and an alfa V6 sound like a good starting point. So can anyone tell me a bit about them? Things like....
1) What to watch out for - should I expect to put my fingers through the bodywork by now (my dad had an Alfetta which disintergrated in a few short years from new!)? Will it overheat 3 miles down the road? Stereotypes aside - what goes wrong with them? Are spares a complete nightmare if they do go wrong?
2) What's the handling like?
3) Slightly odd question - how big are they - I know they're not small, but are we talking 3 series size or 5 series and up? Does that mean they tend to come with plenty of kit?
4) Was originally tempted by the even rarer and even more fragile(?) GTV6 - can anyone tell me how they compare in terms of performance, handling, reliability etc.
Would ask about the twin spark, but to be honest, I don't think I could own an alfa without that 'mini V12' in the front
Am I mad to consider an Alfa 75? - bloody top gear's Alfa owning comments again last night! I have to be honest I don't know a huge ammount about them, but RWD and an alfa V6 sound like a good starting point. So can anyone tell me a bit about them? Things like....
1) What to watch out for - should I expect to put my fingers through the bodywork by now (my dad had an Alfetta which disintergrated in a few short years from new!)? Will it overheat 3 miles down the road? Stereotypes aside - what goes wrong with them? Are spares a complete nightmare if they do go wrong?
2) What's the handling like?
3) Slightly odd question - how big are they - I know they're not small, but are we talking 3 series size or 5 series and up? Does that mean they tend to come with plenty of kit?
4) Was originally tempted by the even rarer and even more fragile(?) GTV6 - can anyone tell me how they compare in terms of performance, handling, reliability etc.
Would ask about the twin spark, but to be honest, I don't think I could own an alfa without that 'mini V12' in the front
I ran a 75 LE 2 litre from 57K miles to 111K as my main driver.
1. They don't rust, they absolutely dripped with waxoyl type stuff so any rust will be as a result of accident damage.
2. Handling is brilliant, great for peeing off 3 series drivers who think their wunderwagon is the worlds best
3. They are bigger than you think, a true 4 seater. Certainly bigger than the equivalent 3 series. Kit varies, in the UK air was an option, very rare although a few late 3 litres have it. But standard fit on the US Milano (75 in yank land). But you'll get leccy windows & roof.
4. GTV6 is older design & build than a 75 so more rust prone & slightly less reliable. GTV6 is Alfetta equivalent, 75 came after. A lot of GTV6 have been updated using 75 bits, better brakes, gear change etc.
Overall
The gear change is quite good, if it isn't then it's worn which isn't a fortune to put right.
Brakes should be very good, they are slightly prone to seized rear callipers which being inboard isn't a 5 minute fix.
The V6 suffers hugely less belt failures than say a 16V Twin Spark, in fact I've never heard of one in a 75. The Twin Spark is chain.
Electrical faults vary, mine had none, I know of others who've had a few. The Alfa Check panel can get schizoid but most people ignore it. Flashing brake pad light is because it has had non-alfa pads fitted.
One issue is that the transaxle can kill it's pinion bearing, drive at about 50-60 on a straight road & accelerate & lift. If you hear a whine that dissapears on the over run it's knackered. Also prone to failure of rear wheel brearings but not too many £££'s to fix.
Bloody good car, very underated & I miss mine dearly & wish I hadn't sold it.
Edited by tr7v8 on Thursday 8th February 09:44
Thanks Jim.
Gee - just had a look at your profile, that's quite a garage! I used to have an MO30 924S and I'm tempted by a 944 (probably an S2) at the moment, also considered a V8 powered TR7 though as I have a thing for open motoring.
However, top gears comments haunt me "you're not a true car enthusiast until you've owned an alfa"!! A characterful engine and rear wheel drive are both huge plus points as far as I'm concerned.
That 75 on Ebay does look nice! Find the idea of lowering one end only a little strange though (I'm sure it looks good, but what about the handling, now he's jacked the roll axis upwards!) and I have to use London 'pavement parking' zones so ground clearance is an issue anyway.
I get the impression the 75 is probably ultimately a better car, but the GTV just looks so good!!
I'm told by a colleague who used to own one that the 3 litre 75 has a different fuel tank location, which combined with the fixed rear seats means I could no longer get the all important mountain bike frame in
It is tempting though with that example on ebay currently going for less than my insurance premium for last year.
Gee - just had a look at your profile, that's quite a garage! I used to have an MO30 924S and I'm tempted by a 944 (probably an S2) at the moment, also considered a V8 powered TR7 though as I have a thing for open motoring.
However, top gears comments haunt me "you're not a true car enthusiast until you've owned an alfa"!! A characterful engine and rear wheel drive are both huge plus points as far as I'm concerned.
That 75 on Ebay does look nice! Find the idea of lowering one end only a little strange though (I'm sure it looks good, but what about the handling, now he's jacked the roll axis upwards!) and I have to use London 'pavement parking' zones so ground clearance is an issue anyway.
I get the impression the 75 is probably ultimately a better car, but the GTV just looks so good!!
I'm told by a colleague who used to own one that the 3 litre 75 has a different fuel tank location, which combined with the fixed rear seats means I could no longer get the all important mountain bike frame in
It is tempting though with that example on ebay currently going for less than my insurance premium for last year.
Yup 75 3Litre has a bigger tank aka smaller boot, which can be an issue for some. Standard 75 2 litre boot isn't bad but a small 'ole to put things in limits it a bit.
My expensively restored TR7V8 is for sale, have a look at www.pbase.com/tr7v8/rover_v8 for a few pics.
Car list needs time, but now added links for pics & some updates.
My expensively restored TR7V8 is for sale, have a look at www.pbase.com/tr7v8/rover_v8 for a few pics.
Car list needs time, but now added links for pics & some updates.
Edited by tr7v8 on Friday 9th February 12:24
tr7v8 said:
Yup 75 3Litre has a bigger tank aka smaller boot, which can be an issue for some. Standard 75 2 litre boot isn't bad but a small 'ole to put things in limits it a bit.
My expensively restored TR7V8 is for sale, have a look at www.pbase.com/tr7v8/rover_v8 for a few pics.
Car list needs time, but now added links for pics & some updates.
My expensively restored TR7V8 is for sale, have a look at www.pbase.com/tr7v8/rover_v8 for a few pics.
Car list needs time, but now added links for pics & some updates.
Edited by tr7v8 on Friday 9th February 12:24
Out of interest, how much are you looking to get for your TR?
I'm guessing I could get my bike frame (bagged up!) on the rear seats of a 75.
Anyone know if the seats fold on the GTV? Folding seats, hatchback, RWD and an alfa V6 would be
Pretty sure the seats do fold on the GTV.
For the TR7, looking at around £7K ono. It's a complete rebuild on a California shell, rebuilt mildly tuned Rover, with 4 barrell Webber, recon box. All new interior & tan mohair hood, proper paint with etch primer & lots of waxoyl.
Fully poly bushed, Spax adjustables all round etc. etc. It cost around £18K to build 2.5 years ago.
It could do with a rolling road session & a boot trim kit, but otherwise 110%.
I just don't use it any more & it's sad to see it left standing!
For the TR7, looking at around £7K ono. It's a complete rebuild on a California shell, rebuilt mildly tuned Rover, with 4 barrell Webber, recon box. All new interior & tan mohair hood, proper paint with etch primer & lots of waxoyl.
Fully poly bushed, Spax adjustables all round etc. etc. It cost around £18K to build 2.5 years ago.
It could do with a rolling road session & a boot trim kit, but otherwise 110%.
I just don't use it any more & it's sad to see it left standing!
Edited by tr7v8 on Friday 9th February 14:07
As the others have said, they are a cracking car. I had one from new for 4.5 years as a company car. The fact that I kept it well beyond it's replacement date and only gave it up when I switched companies says it all. In 65000 miles the only problems were replacement gearbox shims under warranty and some new front disks and wheel bearings at 60,000 miles. Cracking drive only surpassed by my current Elise.
Cheers
Cheers
Hmm, what's the boot like on the GTV? Ideally I want to be able to carry a mountain bike frame.
I know it's a bad way of looking at it, but if I get an alfa it has to be red with atleast 6 cylinders!! 156 V6 Veloce might be a possibility. A colleague has a 156 GTA (sadly out of my budget) and that seems to be quite entertaining. Would really prefer RWD though which is where the 75 comes in and at £1500 for a good one, even I could afford a spare for when the first one breaks down!!
I know it's a bad way of looking at it, but if I get an alfa it has to be red with atleast 6 cylinders!! 156 V6 Veloce might be a possibility. A colleague has a 156 GTA (sadly out of my budget) and that seems to be quite entertaining. Would really prefer RWD though which is where the 75 comes in and at £1500 for a good one, even I could afford a spare for when the first one breaks down!!
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