RE: New Head of Alfa design

[Snoggledog]

Los Angeles said:

Snoggledog said:

Frank Stephenson came up with this!

NO.
He has only just joined Alfa, formerly at Ferrari. But he might well take a stab at cancelling something like that. In their early days Lancia were a progressive company engineering-wise, but like Saab today there's no particular reason to choose a new one unless you enjoy being perverse.

GAGA said:

Sorry, you all talk just bs... Frank designed nothing at Lancia since 2005. The Thesis was launched in 2002...playing around with two-tone colours has nothing to do with "design" (Hell, even Ferrari sold some 612's with two-tone colours). Lancia played around with different colours and interior designs/materials, 'cos they had nothing new to offer (beside of the new Ypsilon in 2003) and no really new car since then (the Lancia Musa is just a tarted up Fiat Idea). The only design genius at Lancia, who designed the Lancia Fulvia concept car in 2003, left Lancia one or two years ago and is now working for Volkswagen.
Hell, Frank even didn't design the new Lancia HPE/Delta (will come in 2008/2009). The new HPE/Delta was even sent (some weeks/month ago) back to drawing board,'cos his "Fiatness" Sergio Marchionne, wasn't happy with it...


I know it will shock you, but you don't have to be italian in order to make beautiful cars.... just guess who designed the Alfa Romeo 8C. His name is "Wolfgang Egger", yes a German guy who was Alfa Romeos chief designer and he was also responsible for the Alfa 156 and not "Walter de Silva" (yes, de Silva was back then chief-designer at Alfa Romeo, but he didn't design the AR 156)...
And who designed the DeTomaso Pantera...? Yes, it was Tom Tjaarda, a bloke from the USA...( by the way, he designed also the first Ford Fiesta (1976))

Please stop talking about "design", when you talk about the new MINI. BMWs order was just : "How would the Mini look like, if it had gone through some steps of design evolution in all the years till today, like the Porsche 911 ?" Frank just fulfilled their wish with the the best result...nothing really special... This has nothing to do with designing from scratch a complete new car.

Consider me suitably flamed then

LA..I grew up on Lancias (Fulvia, Flavia Coupe, Prisma, Thema, Y10) So I know that the older ones were engineering marvels. I still have a hankering for a 1.6 HF. Given the choice between a happy wife next to me in a reliable BMW Cooper S and an unhappy wife in a not quite so reliable Fulvia I sadly plumped for the Mini. Given the choice again I think I'd go for the Fulvia.

GAGA.. You're right. Stlye isn't just something the Italians do. The Brits (Austin Healey, Jaguar, Aston Martin etc etc...) do a good job too. Plenty of other countries have done a good job as well. It's just that when the Italians pull out all the stops they tend to do something truly amazing. Sadly they haven't pulled out all the stops for many years.

[planetdave]

GAGA said:

planetdave said:

Snoggledog said:

Is it the bastard lovechild of a Rover 75 and a Granada Scorpio?

I bet it hides under kids beds and makes moaning sounds after lights out.

Sorry, you all talk just bs... Frank designed nothing at Lancia since 2005. The Thesis was launched in 2002...playing around with two-tone colours has nothing to do with "design" (Hell, even Ferrari sold some 612's with two-tone colours). Lancia played around with different colours and interior designs/materials, 'cos they had nothing new to offer (beside of the new Ypsilon in 2003) and no really new car since then (the Lancia Musa is just a tarted up Fiat Idea). The only design genius at Lancia, who designed the Lancia Fulvia concept car in 2003, left Lancia one or two years ago and is now working for Volkswagen.
Hell, Frank even didn't design the new Lancia HPE/Delta (will come in 2008/2009). The new HPE/Delta was even sent (some weeks/month ago) back to drawing board,'cos his "Fiatness" Sergio Marchionne, wasn't happy with it...


I know it will shock you, but you don't have to be italian in order to make beautiful cars.... just guess who designed the Alfa Romeo 8C. His name is "Wolfgang Egger", yes a German guy who was Alfa Romeos chief designer and he was also responsible for the Alfa 156 and not "Walter de Silva" (yes, de Silva was back then chief-designer at Alfa Romeo, but he didn't design the AR 156)...
And who designed the DeTomaso Pantera...? Yes, it was Tom Tjaarda, a bloke from the USA...( by the way, he designed also the first Ford Fiesta (1976))

Please stop talking about "design", when you talk about the new MINI. BMWs order was just : "How would the Mini look like, if it had gone through some steps of design evolution in all the years till today, like the Porsche 911 ?" Frank just fulfilled their wish with the the best result...nothing really special... This has nothing to do with designing from scratch a complete new car.

I think you will find my contribution to be

planetdave said:

Is it the bastard lovechild of a Rover 75 and a Granada Scorpio?

I bet it hides under kids beds and makes moaning sounds after lights out.

Point that spleen elsewhere.

[errek72]

Hendry said:

errek72 said:

Oh dear, isn't this the guy that designed the 'new' mini and the F430?
Back off, buddy.

He STYLED the MINI, he didn't design it. He is 'only' a stylist - he has to wrap something around hard points that the designers put together. The two roles are quite different: Gordon Murray designed the McLaren F1, Peter Stephens styled it. I am hoping people here are just careless with language rather than not knowing the difference.

You are quite right. I must apologise, English is only my third language and sometimes I use the wrong wording.

Los Angeles said:

Snoggledog said:

With this chap in charge Alfas styling will be truly hideous.

Why? His Mini is a very acceptable modern interpretation of the original.

That is just the problem : "very acceptable" just will not do for the person in charge of the styling (ahum) of Alfa. He should move to Germany and work for Opel or Volkswagen or something. Something tells me his personal stylist already lives there anyway.

[errek72]

Los Angeles said:

Tell us the style direction you think Alfa should go.

The one they are on now.
The Ital Design input is fantastic (Brera, 159, Visconti). Felippo Perrini's more curvy 8C competizione is a classic already. They are different but very Alfa : really balanced, not overdone at all. Historically, Alfa's throughout the range differed quite a lot with each other, but the brand DNA remains instantly recognisable without overdone cues.

Looking at at the BMW X5, the Mini or the F430, they look like a bombardement of styling cues and details. I can see how this works for the mini (almost bought one myself), but the BMW (arguably) and Ferrari (certainly) had been better off without. IMHO.