Which R129?

[ClaphamGT3]

Hi All

Thinking of changing our summer drop-top from Mrs Clapham's old MX-5 (2002 car, owned from new) to an R129. Its going to be a purely fun car for sunny days and I dont want to spend more on it than we'll get for the MX-5 in this economy. Given our other cars, performance would be nice but is not critical, and fuel & insurance are expensed through the business so..... which model do you guys think is the best option for a £6-7k budget and what are the pros & cons of the various different engine sizes?

[r129sl]

They all cost more or less the same to insure and fuel regardless of engine size.

The 280 probably is a fine car but not a fast car. The 320 is rapid enough. Both the 280 and 320 seem slower than they are because the car is very refined. The 500 is very fast.

The 600 is faster still and is very reliable but extraordinarily expensive if things go wrong.

A lot of the running gear is w124 sourced and so cheap (by Mercedes standards). They need regular and high quality servicing and they eat brakes and tyres. They are very sensitive to wheel balance and tyre quality: buy the very best rubber and have it fitted by a proper outfit. The dealer often is cheapest and best. Also, avoid after market wheels like the plague.

If I was on a budget of, say, £6k to £9k, I would look for the best early 500 SL I could find. There are plenty of good 40 to 70k cars in this price range.

It will take some getting used to after a MX-5 but it is a very capable and satisfying car to own. I have had mine for 175,000 miles and it is still growing on me.

[XB70]

I'll have to disagree on the 600. Bragging rights of a V12 but a nightmare of a car.

A 500 would be excellent (I have the coupe) although I would not dismiss the 300SL-24 once the headgasket is done.

There is a stunning bornite (metallic purple) one on the Mercedes Benz club site - I will dig up the details...

Ok...this is his ad

Well, this is hard thing for me to do, but I've got to sell my SL.....took me ages to find the right one, which I managed to do two years ago, but sadly and not so sadly another project has come my way and I need to sell my SL to fund the new project.

Having found the right SL in the right colour and with the right specification, I set about drawing up a list of things to do to make it an A1 car.

Here's what I have done

So to date I have had the following work undertaken on the car.

New Head Gasket £670......when I purchased the car, ever so often it used to drip a drop of oil onto the exhaust manifold which stank. Although the head gasket had not blown I didn't want it to let go at some inconvenient time in the future so I bit the bullet and got it changed. Its worth noting that the original head gaskets on the 3 litre engines had a design flaw, so they all blow at some stage. The new head gaskets are re-designed and should not give any future problems.
New front discs and pads...genuine MB items
Service , I've had one done every year, despite the low mileage I have covered since owning the car
Drivers seat bolster has been professionally repaired with new leather....the drivers side seat bolster always wears on SL's as its impossible to get into and out of the car without rubbing this area.
New Michelin rear tyres which are filled with Nitrogen for extra reliability.
Replacement CD Stacker in the boot as the original failed.
In terms of specification the car comes with the following:

300-24v straight six producing 230bhp....I specifically wanted this engine as its the most powerful of the straight six engines and its also the one that sounds the best....get it past 4000 rpms and it really sounds great
Air conditioning...extra at the time
Rear Seats....extra at the time
5 Speed auto box...extra at the time....4 speed was standard
Electric Seats...extra at the time
Car also comes with
Electric Windows + Mirrors
Twin Airbags
Traction Control
Cruise Control
Stereo + Boot mounted CD Changer
Wind Guard
Hard Top

Condition wise its in very good condition, has never let me down and it drives beautifully. Never uses any coolant and rarely needs oil.

The only thing left to do on my list was to have the bumpers sprayed as they have some small scuffs on them....If i get the price I want I will get this done.

Car comes with a full service history and its a 1994 car.

Registration is available by sperate negotiation or I take it off. Car is up for £7995
Photos of car:

http://s5.photobucket.com/albums/y182/mjtray/merc%...
http://s5.photobucket.com/albums/y182/mjtray/merc%...
http://s5.photobucket.com/albums/y182/mjtray/merc%...
http://s5.photobucket.com/albums/y182/mjtray/merc%...
http://s5.photobucket.com/albums/y182/mjtray/merc%...

If you are interested in the car, please call me on 07830 321060....Martin

Car is in Caversham-Reading-Berks

[XB70]

Oh, I think it has 67,000 miles from memory.

My recommendation (having owned a 300SL) is DO NOT get a car without aircon. Don't listen to any of that "it is a convertible" nonsense - when the roof is on, it is a coupe and little airflow into the cabin.

[ClaphamGT3]

XB70 said:

Oh, I think it has 67,000 miles from memory.

My recommendation (having owned a 300SL) is DO NOT get a car without aircon. Don't listen to any of that "it is a convertible" nonsense - when the roof is on, it is a coupe and little airflow into the cabin.

Hi

Thanks for this - agree totally about the aircon and am coming round to the view that the 500 is the one to go for; perceived as juicier/more expensive to run than the 300/320 therefore cheaper, whereas the 600 looks too much like trouble & the 280s all seem to have horrible poverty specs.

Not sure about the one from the MB club site - even my limited research tells me that £8k is an utterly ludicrous price for a purple SL that, by the vendor's admission, has had engine problems & needs some paint. There are a number of significantly better cars on the market for £3k less than that!

[r129sl]

£8k gets you a very nice 1990 to 1994 pre-facelift 500 SL with reasonable mileage (i.e. less than 80k), decent spec, good condition and history.

These looked promising to me:

http://www.carandclassic.co.uk/car/C104037/
http://www.carandclassic.co.uk/car/C103411/
http://www.carandclassic.co.uk/car/C101523/
http://www.carandclassic.co.uk/car/C61285/
http://www.carandclassic.co.uk/car/C101195/
http://www.carandclassic.co.uk/car/C98735/

Personally I think the pre-facelift shape with two-tone bodywork and 8- or 15-hole alloys looks superb, especially int he common colour of Astral Silver.

[Egbert Nobacon]

http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/1124167.htm

If it helps I know the chap selling this car and it is definately worth a look.

It has extensive documented history, has been correctly maintained and everything works as it should.

It sits correctly, has no rust, all the same premium brand tyres and drives beautifully.

Edited by Egbert Nobacon on Tuesday 28th July 12:02

[XB70]

ClaphamGT3 said:

XB70 said:

Oh, I think it has 67,000 miles from memory.

My recommendation (having owned a 300SL) is DO NOT get a car without aircon. Don't listen to any of that "it is a convertible" nonsense - when the roof is on, it is a coupe and little airflow into the cabin.

Hi

Thanks for this - agree totally about the aircon and am coming round to the view that the 500 is the one to go for; perceived as juicier/more expensive to run than the 300/320 therefore cheaper, whereas the 600 looks too much like trouble & the 280s all seem to have horrible poverty specs.

Not sure about the one from the MB club site - even my limited research tells me that £8k is an utterly ludicrous price for a purple SL that, by the vendor's admission, has had engine problems & needs some paint. There are a number of significantly better cars on the market for £3k less than that!

£8000 is his asking price so no doubt room for movement, however, not really any different from the clowns that inhabit the Autotrader and the 'specialists' for Mercs with their cuckoo-land prices.

The headgasket failure is common to all inline 6 engines from the 1990's - the SL, E class, S class.....not if, but or when. If you buy a 3 litre and it has not been done, then you would have to budget for it to be done at some point. I bought mine knowing there was a risk it would go and, voila, it went. £1000 to get that done. So I would not call it an engine problem but rather a very positive selling point.

The purple is a very rare colour and they look absolutely stunning in the flesh.

I don't know the guy at all, however, if I did not need a 4 door (W140), I would be calling him myself to discuss price. Personally, I would think £5500-6000 for that car.

[XB70]

[quote=r129sl]£8k gets you a very nice 1990 to 1994 pre-facelift 500 SL with reasonable mileage (i.e. less than 80k), decent spec, good condition and history.

These looked promising to me:

http://www.carandclassic.co.uk/car/C104037/

That looks like an ok one and worth a look - front lights are not original and they did not come with parking sensors so they are aftermarket. Wheels are the early ones. Would need to check what the full history was (to me, that is a pile of receipts AND the book)

A rule of thumb with cars, especially the higher end Mercs, is never buy from the first two years of the series since that is where the gremlins are. By the third year, a lot of the faults have been worked out and addressed.

http://www.carandclassic.co.uk/car/C103411/
I stopped when I read auction. Forget it. These cars are too complex to take a risk on anything but a detailed inspection. For example the roof pump. They play up and sometimes can have just enough power to do one cycle (hardtop off, soft top up, soft top down, roof on). I would ask for multiple cycles (I did when I bought mine and insisted on showing it when I sold mine).

http://www.carandclassic.co.uk/car/C101523/

Car has sold.

http://www.carandclassic.co.uk/car/C61285/

Not a chance. First of the series, low miles - which is not a good thing on a car of this age. Give me a 1993 with 60,000 miles over this car. £9,995...*laughing*

http://www.carandclassic.co.uk/car/C101195/
This would be one of the very very first ones built. The price of that is more 1993/4 territory. Nice of them to spray clean the engine bay which is madness, especially on these.

http://www.carandclassic.co.uk/car/C98735/

Would not bother with the MM. A limited edition by some badges only and interior (awful) colour changes. Not worth any premium. I know a lot of people ooh and aah because someone famous owned it but take the Sultan of Brunei for example. Quite a number of his cars (aside from the megaexotica) have been quite badly neglected. Service history, service history, condition....not previous owner, is what to look for.

If you were going to drop £10K plus, the other silver one in the ad would be worth a look but it should come with a panoroof (did not go to his website).

Edited by XB70 on Tuesday 28th July 13:35

[r129sl]

The pearl grey car mentioned in the above post looks like exactly the kind of car you should be looking for.

I always think the tyres give away the owner's attitude: recent, branded tyres with plenty of tread are a very positive sign. Finally, I think heated seats are as important as a/c in this country.

These look tidy, too:
http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/1145576.htm
http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/1154149.htm
http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/1150659.htm

Less sure about these two (although the seller is respectable and well-established):
http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/806250.htm
http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/806260.htm

Edited by r129sl on Tuesday 28th July 14:01

[Nuisance_Value]

I would certainly go for a 500 over any other engine size, in fact I did. The difference in fuel and insurance etc is negligible and the surge from the kickdown is just magnificent and will keep going into licence losing territory. They can keep up with most modern machinery in the real world, exotica excluded. If you can stretch the budget a little I would try and get a '96 on, not only did they have the 320ish bhp M119 version of the 5 litre engine and they were cosmetically facelifted too. I much prefer the interior doors and think they look sleeker/tidier externally.

As has been said, get aircon and heated seats, they really extend the roof down season, but the other benefit of post 96 is the panoramic hardtop roof which is a fabulous addition in my opinion, coupled with a light interior colour it seems much more spacious.

Full service is a must (MD or independent), good tyres show a bit of care by the owner as does having the tools and even wheel the changing gloves! They all came with a mesh windstop which works well so make sure this is there too (it lives under a cover in the rear of the boot). A super clean engine bay should raise suspicions.

This one could be worth a look if they were open to a haggle, and also in the best colour combination imo;

http://search.autotrader.co.uk/es-uk/www/cars/MERC...

[derin100]

Nuisance_Value said:

I would certainly go for a 500 over any other engine size, in fact I did. The difference in fuel and insurance etc is negligible and the surge from the kickdown is just magnificent and will keep going into licence losing territory. They can keep up with most modern machinery in the real world, exotica excluded. If you can stretch the budget a little I would try and get a '96 on, not only did they have the 320ish bhp M119 version of the 5 litre engine and they were cosmetically facelifted too. I much prefer the interior doors and think they look sleeker/tidier externally.

As has been said, get aircon and heated seats, they really extend the roof down season, but the other benefit of post 96 is the panoramic hardtop roof which is a fabulous addition in my opinion, coupled with a light interior colour it seems much more spacious.

Full service is a must (MD or independent), good tyres show a bit of care by the owner as does having the tools and even wheel the changing gloves! They all came with a mesh windstop which works well so make sure this is there too (it lives under a cover in the rear of the boot). A super clean engine bay should raise suspicions.

This one could be worth a look if they were open to a haggle, and also in the best colour combination imo;

http://search.autotrader.co.uk/es-uk/www/cars/MERC...

Well...You won't want my one then! Because:

It's not a 500 only a 280
It has no A/C or heated seats
It's a '95 car
It's been Cat D damaged (albeit very lightly)

I don't have the service history (89K miles) because in a nutshell the previous owner who DOES still have it wanted me to pay him £350 for it and second-hand wind-deflector
It has non-premium brand tyres on it (albeit quite new all round). Again because the previous owner was a cheapskate, money-grabbing pillock.

And finally...It DOES have a super clean engine bay!


"No reasonable offer refused" then I guess?

http://www.bmwclassics.co.uk/gallery/index.php?spg...

Edited by derin100 on Wednesday 29th July 20:07

[Dick Fromage]

Get the 500 engine. It'll be practically no more thirsty than the 6 cyl engines and it's a whole lot faster. Also, why have a 6 cyl when there's plenty out there for good money? Mine is a '98 SL500 and I agree with the earlier comments about the late models' better looks. It is a super car that I adore. It's not a sports car but it wafts and gets you to your location with supreme comfort. I have mine fitted with a Becker Navigation radio thingy that has sat nav, bluetooth and an iPod connector. This updates it nicely.

[paoloh]

Look around a lot, I've just sold a 1990 SL500 with 90k miles and full history for £4500.