DSG - Love/Hate? Marmite?

[daytona600]

catso said:

daytona600 said:

1) You can never have full manual control - even selecting sport and then engaging the paddles to take over does not leave you with manual control. After about 30secs, it starts to do the gear changing again. Bugged me to tears and caused a few nasty moments. Why, oh why?!

It only reverts back to auto after 30 seconds if you leave the lever in D or S, move the lever across to the manual position and it will only self-upshift when you hit the limiter on accelaration or downshift if you go too slow for the gear or stop when it selects 1st.

As for not having full control, the computer only 'takes over' if you try to over-rev, excessively labour the engine or try to start pull away not in 1st gear - sure you can't select 2nd gear at 120mph but why would you want to?

To me the only downside is the clutch grabbiness when pulling away from standstill and some of that is due to the sensitive throttle (on 3.2l) otherwise it is the best of both worlds IMO.

I like Marmite too.......

Edited by catso on Friday 2nd November 18:36

Agreed - in D after you pull the paddles, it gives you manual control for a while but then switches back to normal. This makes sense as you may have just wanted to anticipate an overtake.

However, sport is just like D except it hangs on to the gears a bit longer if you aren't in manual (i.e. haven't pulled the paddles). I agree it doesn't change up when you hit the limiter etc (as long as it is still in manual). My issue is that when driving it on local roads in Scotland where you sometimes want to sometimes hold 3rd for 2-3 minutes, after about 30secs of enthusiastic driving in the one gear, it just assumes you have forgotten to do any gear changes yourself and takes over (usually on the entry to a bend). You cannot permanently lock it into manual. Why not?!

Edited by daytona600 on Monday 5th November 17:13

[Paul.B]

catso said:

Paul.B said:

The GTi has paddles which only adds to the enjoyment.

Are there DSG cars out there without the paddles then?...........

Yep! Wifes TDi only has manual option on the selector. Move it to the left when in D and change gear + or -


A question to the experts. I am a man, therefore can not read instruction manuals. Can you use the paddles whilst in D or S? What do you do to engage them. Also, this business where it changes gear after 30 secs, is that when in D / S or with it pushed over to the left?

It would seem I have not fully learnt all the DSG functions!!!! I have only ever driven her car on rare occassions. Need all the info I can now I have one to play with.


Edited yo add: What is the "Off" on the right hand paddle for?


Cheers

Paul.B

Edited by Paul.B on Monday 5th November 16:18

[FUBAR]

While my A4 is in for some surgery they've lent me an A3 with flappy paddles. Loved it..... for the first 24 hours.

Still have the car, now having done 1600 miles in it. Great for bumbling about but cant wait to get my manual A4 back. Its 'OK' when on the move but a PITA pulling away/out of junctions, but that maybe the throttle?

I, personally, wouldnt order a car with flappy paddles. First flappy paddle I tried was in a Vanquish a client lent me a couple of years back. That was farking AWFUL!

I like marmite too

[catso]

Paul.B said:

A question to the experts. I am a man, therefore can not read instruction manuals. Can you use the paddles whilst in D or S? What do you do to engage them. Also, this business where it changes gear after 30 secs, is that when in D / S or with it pushed over to the left?

If you use the paddles in D or S then your input will overide the auto selection but it will revert back to auto after 30 secs of non-paddle use. When lever moved over to left it will remain in 'manual' but it will auto-upshift if you hit the limiter or auto-downshift if you go too slow for the gear finally it will select 1st if you stop.

Paul.B said:

Edited yo add: What is the "Off" on the right hand paddle for?

I have no idea, it's not on mine

[daytona600]

catso said:

Paul.B said:

A question to the experts. I am a man, therefore can not read instruction manuals. Can you use the paddles whilst in D or S? What do you do to engage them. Also, this business where it changes gear after 30 secs, is that when in D / S or with it pushed over to the left?

If you use the paddles in D or S then your input will overide the auto selection but it will revert back to auto after 30 secs of non-paddle use. When lever moved over to left it will remain in 'manual' but it will auto-upshift if you hit the limiter or auto-downshift if you go too slow for the gear finally it will select 1st if you stop.

Paul.B said:

Edited yo add: What is the "Off" on the right hand paddle for?

I have no idea, it's not on mine

Catso - I'm confused reading your post. My A3 had D in the normal place and you pushed it left across the gate to activate Sport. Manual only started when you pulled the paddles. There was no M space for the lever (or indeed button) on my A3. Hence you couldn't "lock it into manual"

P.S. Nice 916, I have a 916 SPS too - passion beyond reason. Power delivery like a baseball bat to the face indeed!

[catso]

daytona600 said:

Catso - I'm confused reading your post. My A3 had D in the normal place and you pushed it left across the gate to activate Sport. Manual only started when you pulled the paddles. There was no M space for the lever (or indeed button) on my A3. Hence you couldn't "lock it into manual"

P.S. Nice 916, I have a 916 SPS too - passion beyond reason. Power delivery like a baseball bat to the face indeed!

Mine has P,R,N,D,S in a straight line with the manual mode being left from D, when in manual you can shift with the lever (+/-) or use the paddles. 'Launch control' works only in S or Manual with the ESP switched off - maybe different models are different?

As for the 916, you know it makes sense.......

Edited by catso on Monday 5th November 17:29

[atom111]

Edited yo add: What is the "Off" on the right hand paddle for?

If you hold the off button aka (+) it puts the box back into S or D if in those modes. Not sure what it does if in manual mode though.

Edited by atom111 on Monday 5th November 18:26

[david968s]

catso said:

'Launch control' works only in S or Manual with the ESP switched off - maybe different models are different?

Launch control? Do tell more!

[catso]

david968s said:

catso said:

'Launch control' works only in S or Manual with the ESP switched off - maybe different models are different?

Launch control? Do tell more!

Because there is no manually operated clutch, if you want to start quickly there is a launch control mode;

Select S or Manual, switch off ESP (traction control) press left foot on to brake pedal, floor throttle - revs rise to around 3000rpm, dump brake pedal as if it were a clutch and keep throttle pinned.........

[FUBAR]

catso said:

david968s said:

catso said:

'Launch control' works only in S or Manual with the ESP switched off - maybe different models are different?

Launch control? Do tell more!

Because there is no manually operated clutch, if you want to start quickly there is a launch control mode;

Select S or Manual, switch off ESP (traction control) press left foot on to brake pedal, floor throttle - revs rise to around 3000rpm, dump brake pedal as if it were a clutch and keep throttle pinned.........

Right, Im trying that tonight!

[david968s]

Tried the launch control - brilliant! It is really impressive... hard to find many opportunities to use it though...

[FUBAR]

I couldnt get launch control to work. Cars gone back and Im back in the A4 again

[Tame Technician]

As far as all the customers i know, 90% love the DSG. As far as all the technicians and "real drivers" are concerned 99% hate the DSG.

Heres a true story. (sale demo, not customers car)

3.2 TT 2007 model DSG. Winding b road, coming out of 2nd gear bend, short blast to very tight corner wanted to go up to rev limit in 2nd then brake hard to say 3000rpm for turn in, (FORGOT LIKE A FOOL) it wouldn't do that, it changed up onto third just before i braked, so i press the down shift paddle, it was just a bit to much for the box to change down at that speed, to save over revving the engine it wont allow the down shift, ok i think i'll just take the bend in 3rd, no bog deal. Just as I'm off the brake and turning in........Yep you guessed it, it now decides its ok and selected 2nd gear and seriously upset the balance of the car, flicked the back end right out(lift off oversteer style) and if it didnt have ESP i may well have binned it.

Its jurky in town, and not great getting away, it changes up at high rpm, even when you supposed to be controlling the up shifts, and as detailed above, it can even make you crash. DSG Marmite indeed, I hate it, kids with play stations and people who pose love it.

However it is faster 0-60 by about 0.4 of a sec or something daft, but how often do you do that, If you think you a but of a driver, or like some sort of involvement with he car, ITS GOT TO BE A MANUAL.

[atom111]

Tame Technician said:

Its jurky in town, and not great getting away, it changes up at high rpm, even when you supposed to be controlling the up shifts, and as detailed above, it can even make you crash. DSG Marmite indeed, I hate it, kids with play stations and people who pose love it.

Must have been bust as my is smooth as silk around town and is excellent at getting away albeit in a different car. For the type of driving the UK has now become especially around the south of England where I do most of my driving the DSG is ideal, I never got on with DSG's in Golfs when I test drove both the GTI, GT TDI and TSI so I guess it's the same with the A3 they do feel better cars with a manual but in larger more sedate cars DSG is awesome.

[david968s]

Tame Technician said:

3.2 TT 2007 model DSG. Winding b road, coming out of 2nd gear bend, short blast to very tight corner wanted to go up to rev limit in 2nd then brake hard to say 3000rpm for turn in, (FORGOT LIKE A FOOL) it wouldn't do that, it changed up onto third just before i braked, so i press the down shift paddle, it was just a bit to much for the box to change down at that speed, to save over revving the engine it wont allow the down shift, ok i think i'll just take the bend in 3rd, no bog deal. Just as I'm off the brake and turning in........Yep you guessed it, it now decides its ok and selected 2nd gear and seriously upset the balance of the car, flicked the back end right out(lift off oversteer style) and if it didnt have ESP i may well have binned it.

What mode were you in? I haven't really had the opportunity to push mine hard on winding roads like there are in the UK, so I haven't experienced DSG at the limit. I would agree that a manual always gives you more confidence - more control? Maybe your driving style needs to adapt to DSG - it isn't like a manual. I don't really like the way that DSG decides how it wants you to drive, but as I say, I haven't tried to bully it either.

The jerkiness around town may be more to do with the throttle sensitivity on the 3.2 engined cars - lots of testers seem to prefer the 2.0 TFSI/DSG combination. My GTi isn't jerky at all.

Tame Technician said:

kids with play stations and people who pose love it.

As others have said - it suits a lot of driving situations very well, so you can't dimiss other people's choice with such a simple generalisation. I wouldn't choose a car with DSG every time, but for most real world driving (i.e. commuting, or living where I do), I would prefer it to a manual. Also, it is more economical than the manual, I think (albeit very slightly).

[atom111]

I drove 30 miles in 2.5hrs this morning thank god for the DSG made it bearable.

[baz1985]

Double/treble downshifting and then flooring it on a majestic B-road...brilliant fun.

And then the engine noise in sport mode.....awesome.

It does have issues, but that's what makes it's interesting.

[Tame Technician]

When the "Moment" occured i was in full manual mode, if you can call it that. It wasn't broken was a brand new car, and I probably drive 4 or 5 different ones like it every week, fairly typical off DSG.

If i didnt make it clear before, I work on and drive cars all the time, and maybe I drive differently to other people, I blip on down shifts my self, use engine breaking and engine torque to keep the car balanced in corners etc. If like me you enjoy driving and manual car and having that extra bit of control, then DSG is not for you.

Equally if you like the smoothness of a good automatic gear box you probably wont like it either.

But if you like DSG then you like it, nearly all our customers think its great. S-Tronic is a new name for it, the box is the same.

I hate the multi-tronic automatic even more, so dont get me started on that one.

[atom111]

I test drove the multi-tronic in an A4 that was awful, and I see it's still available in the new A4 why?

[Griff Boy]

Tame Technician said:

As far as all the customers i know, 90% love the DSG. As far as all the technicians and "real drivers" are concerned 99% hate the DSG.

Heres a true story. (sale demo, not customers car)

3.2 TT 2007 model DSG. Winding b road, coming out of 2nd gear bend, short blast to very tight corner wanted to go up to rev limit in 2nd then brake hard to say 3000rpm for turn in, (FORGOT LIKE A FOOL) it wouldn't do that, it changed up onto third just before i braked, so i press the down shift paddle, it was just a bit to much for the box to change down at that speed, to save over revving the engine it wont allow the down shift, ok i think i'll just take the bend in 3rd, no bog deal. Just as I'm off the brake and turning in........Yep you guessed it, it now decides its ok and selected 2nd gear and seriously upset the balance of the car, flicked the back end right out(lift off oversteer style) and if it didnt have ESP i may well have binned it.

Its jurky in town, and not great getting away, it changes up at high rpm, even when you supposed to be controlling the up shifts, and as detailed above, it can even make you crash. DSG Marmite indeed, I hate it, kids with play stations and people who pose love it.

However it is faster 0-60 by about 0.4 of a sec or something daft, but how often do you do that, If you think you a but of a driver, or like some sort of involvement with he car, ITS GOT TO BE A MANUAL.

Glad to hear Audi mechanics treat all there cars with due care and dillegence, it may or may not have been a 'customers car' this time, but lets hope you don't buy a ex demo from this garage!

Its very easy to thrash the arse off a car when it is not yours and you do not have to pay the bills on it. 99% of people do not enter a bend at such high velocity that the car is on the brink of crashing for whatever reason, and if they did want to drive in that manner then you would not choose an Audi of any kind. A quasi racer would be your best bet.

Take the DSG gearbox for what it is, and appreciate how good an all rounder it is, I have just come from a Porsche Tiptronic and this is a much better version. Remember as you say 90% of your customers love it, don't they pay your wages????