RE: BMW X6 Revealed
Discussion
Ummmmmm...gonna stick my neck out and disagree.
While the X6 ain't a looker, it's certainly better looking than the monstrosity that is the Cayenne.
IMO all these 'crossovers of crossover' nonsense is getting out of hand but it won't stop the school brigade from getting their hands on one.
The thing I worry about is as there are most of these tall 'urban utilities whatever' vehicles infesting our roads, the drivers of low slung sportscars (and bikers) will be in even more danger as most of them drive like they own the road.
While the X6 ain't a looker, it's certainly better looking than the monstrosity that is the Cayenne.
IMO all these 'crossovers of crossover' nonsense is getting out of hand but it won't stop the school brigade from getting their hands on one.
The thing I worry about is as there are most of these tall 'urban utilities whatever' vehicles infesting our roads, the drivers of low slung sportscars (and bikers) will be in even more danger as most of them drive like they own the road.
crocop said:
PJR said:
I see the BMW hating sheep train is in motion again. How predictable.. Getting a bit old now isn't it lads?
Generally speaking, it seems with each new model from BMW, Bangles 'stamp' becomes increasingly toned down. Which is a good thing, and this X6 is no exception. And as lardy 4X4's go, its sure to be a better drive than nearly all of the alternatives out there.
I like it, and I can see it becoming popular. Although its far too big for my humble needs.
P,
Oh I could not agree more with every word you said !! Generally speaking, it seems with each new model from BMW, Bangles 'stamp' becomes increasingly toned down. Which is a good thing, and this X6 is no exception. And as lardy 4X4's go, its sure to be a better drive than nearly all of the alternatives out there.
I like it, and I can see it becoming popular. Although its far too big for my humble needs.
P,
No-one slags off the Z4 or the 6... there's still controversy (but hardly hatred) of the 3, 5 and 7..
This niche marketing just blows the mind... I want on road performance that somehow doesn't compromise offroad ability, I must sit higher up and somehow not comprise that performance, it must look low, sleek and fast yet somehow still not compromise its ability to be higher up and hold luggage for the 5 people it must carry....
That kind of brief results in product that is a mess, seriously. I know people will like what they like, and the world would be boring without choice and competition etc, but we all know the truth, at this cost, this will be driven by yummy mums, small property developers, restaurant and/or nightclub owners or lower league footballers...
They'll tint the windows and 'lord' it all over the place.
The X5 has an argument, its higher for people to sit high, its shaped to fit 5 people and their luggage... a coupe version of that?
Where's that thread of the latest MaxPower craze in the states where old boxy 70's coupes gets raised up on 34" alloys... not much of niche now is it BMW?
Sad, when they have THAT much technological and engineering knowhow that they yield to the marketing men and accountants... PROFIT! come on build something new and trendy with our logo on it! sod the repercussions of brand dilution and ubiquity, lets make money now!
So no not BMW hating... I think its the observations of the German car industry as a whole. Porsche, Audi, MB, BMW... all have made some terrible decisions of late in the name of profit, whilst also being capable of brilliance.
I WISH said:
What always amuses me is when people describe SUVs as "having really carlike handling" ......... well ..... buy a fooking car then!!!!!!!!!!!!
Err... it is a car. And it's a bit disingenuous to use SUVs as a collective term when discussing handling. It's like using the term 'saloon car'. You'd never assume all saloon cars handled the same, and likewise the same is true of SUVs.As for the underlying assumption behind your comment, namely that SUVs cannot 'handle' (and I'm not assuming we both use that term in the same way), then you may remember that we lapped both ML63 and Cayenne TT faster around Bedford than the Elise S2 we used on the same day. As fast as the E60 M5 and faster than an SL55 in fact.
My apologies to those of you who do have first-hand experience of these cars, but I fear that many people's assumptions are based on nothing more than conjecture. Yes, the CofG is higher than on any other car, but they do a bloody good job of making such fact an irrelevance in road driving.
I can personally attest to how capable the chassis is on my ML63 and often eulogize about how much more adjustable and involving it is to corner quickly than in my B7 RS4.
I think the point is that an "SUV" can never handle as well as a car built on the same platform because a higher centre of gravity is an inherent disadvantage. The X6 may well handle well, but it wont handle as well as it would if BMW had made a car with the same chassis.
Even if it didn't handle it'd still sell anyway.
Even if it didn't handle it'd still sell anyway.
kambites said:
I think the point is that an "SUV" can never handle as well as a car built on the same platform because a higher centre of gravity is an inherent disadvantage. The X6 may well handle well, but it wont handle as well as it would if BMW had made a car with the same chassis.
I would not argue with the first part of your statement, the second part isn't quite so clean cut though. I've been on record many times saying that many of BMW's saloons under perform compared to their best SUVs, perhaps because their engineers try harder (and achieve more) to overcome the SUVs inherent compromises. Either way, also implicit within your statement (although forgive me if you do not mean this) is that SUVs do not handle well. And that is completely untrue. If they did not handle well then I for one would never consider buying them, and I've owned six of them now in the past 10 years.
I'm the sort of person that has a gagging reflex whenever the word MPV is mentioned, and find most of them really unpleasant to drive (S-Max and newer Galaxy excepted).
The kind of attributes that I value highly when referring to a cars handling are steering precision/response, adjustability and predictability of a chassis on the limit and ultimately being able to turn-in and carry speed into a corner picking a chosen line and sticking to it. If a car cannot offer me those attributes then I would not buy it, no matter how useful it might be at carrying stuff or wading off-road. I am really the last person to be singing praises for of an SUV. Motoring without being fun, just doesn't register on my range of interests.
Polarbert said:
Marki said:
FWDRacer said:
Its a SAC alright..... A SAC of sh..........
Ohh ho ho ho well i never look thats original Edited by FWDRacer on Monday 17th December 11:58
You should be happy that BMW have the freedom to make cars like this
the anit BMW sentiment on here defies belife
Marki said:
Horse_Apple said:
Marki said:
the anit BMW sentiment on here defies belife
It's right up there with the anit speeling sentiment. 
Was in a hurry
but i admit my speelin id toribleI've got 2 in the bag already which is why I had to sell my 540
.DoctorD said:
The kind of attributes that I value highly when referring to a cars handling are steering precision/response, adjustability and predictability of a chassis on the limit and ultimately being able to turn-in and carry speed into a corner picking a chosen line and sticking to it.
Well, handling is about the interaction between vehicle and driver, so it´s far more personal than many people make it out to be. Personally, I am five times more confident of a car´s ability to turn/in and carry speed into a corner when I´m sitting low inbetween the wheels than seemingly on top of them, aloof from the action. I´ve quite comprehensively driven the top of the SUV tree and I can safely say I, personally, would never throw them into corners the way I do when driving my humble MINI One, which incidentally felt like a full-on sports car when I drove it away from Pon Porsche Import after having returned a Cayenne there.Edited by 900T-R on Tuesday 18th December 14:58
I'm not sure there's anti BMW feeling, rather anti BMW drivers if anything.
If you can't tell me you haven't noticed the aggressive "Get out of my way, I'm in a BMW and I simply HAVE to be in front of you even though there is an endless stream of traffic stretching for miles ahead" attitude from almost every 3 series driver, then you must be living on a different planet from the rest of us.
The same attitude used to permeate through the entire BMW range ownership but I have to confess most 5 series drivers of late appear to be quite civilised and rather more intelligent.
Unfortunately the X5 drivers seem to be the worst for this sort of automotive thuggery. They use their front bumper sensors to their utmost to ensure they judge that 1" gap off your rear bumper with fine accuracy. I wouldn't mind if I was a slow dodderer. But when I'm travelling with the rest of the motorway traffic, and just like neanderthal behind I too may wish to go faster if the road was clear, I rather object to being pushed off the road just because I'm not giving the car in front of me the same sort of treatment.
Now I'm not saying it's only BMW drivers that behave like this. On the whole though, it's a distinct German car driver trait. And there are a hell of a lot of 3 series around.
Just my opinion based on many years driving many miles, but I do have the feeling my experience is not unique..
If you can't tell me you haven't noticed the aggressive "Get out of my way, I'm in a BMW and I simply HAVE to be in front of you even though there is an endless stream of traffic stretching for miles ahead" attitude from almost every 3 series driver, then you must be living on a different planet from the rest of us.
The same attitude used to permeate through the entire BMW range ownership but I have to confess most 5 series drivers of late appear to be quite civilised and rather more intelligent.
Unfortunately the X5 drivers seem to be the worst for this sort of automotive thuggery. They use their front bumper sensors to their utmost to ensure they judge that 1" gap off your rear bumper with fine accuracy. I wouldn't mind if I was a slow dodderer. But when I'm travelling with the rest of the motorway traffic, and just like neanderthal behind I too may wish to go faster if the road was clear, I rather object to being pushed off the road just because I'm not giving the car in front of me the same sort of treatment.
Now I'm not saying it's only BMW drivers that behave like this. On the whole though, it's a distinct German car driver trait. And there are a hell of a lot of 3 series around.
Just my opinion based on many years driving many miles, but I do have the feeling my experience is not unique..
Horse_Apple said:
Marki said:
Horse_Apple said:
Marki said:
the anit BMW sentiment on here defies belife
It's right up there with the anit speeling sentiment. Was in a hurry
but i admit my speelin id toribleI've got 2 in the bag already which is why I had to sell my 540
.
there i have said it " i am Marki and im a bit of a ginge "Trundlebug said:
I'm not sure there's anti BMW feeling, rather anti BMW drivers if anything.
If you can't tell me you haven't noticed the aggressive "Get out of my way, I'm in a BMW and I simply HAVE to be in front of you even though there is an endless stream of traffic stretching for miles ahead" attitude from almost every 3 series driver, then you must be living on a different planet from the rest of us.
I live in Holland and i can honestly say i have not experienced that , i think thats a British rudness thing not a BMW thing If you can't tell me you haven't noticed the aggressive "Get out of my way, I'm in a BMW and I simply HAVE to be in front of you even though there is an endless stream of traffic stretching for miles ahead" attitude from almost every 3 series driver, then you must be living on a different planet from the rest of us.
Marki said:
I live in Holland and i can honestly say i have not experienced that , i think thats a British rudness thing not a BMW thing
Um, you must drive on different roads then. It's not a BMW thing though, more a thing with any car which is 'aspirational' to folks that are not quite making it but still think their time is more important than yours or any of the thousands of other drivers in front of you - I find Hyundai Tucsons are more liable to show this kind of erratic driving than 3-series these days. Edited by 900T-R on Tuesday 18th December 15:26
DoctorD said:
kambites said:
I think the point is that an "SUV" can never handle as well as a car built on the same platform because a higher centre of gravity is an inherent disadvantage. The X6 may well handle well, but it wont handle as well as it would if BMW had made a car with the same chassis.
I would not argue with the first part of your statement, the second part isn't quite so clean cut though. I've been on record many times saying that many of BMW's saloons under perform compared to their best SUVs, perhaps because their engineers try harder (and achieve more) to overcome the SUVs inherent compromises. Either way, also implicit within your statement (although forgive me if you do not mean this) is that SUVs do not handle well. And that is completely untrue. If they did not handle well then I for one would never consider buying them, and I've owned six of them now in the past 10 years.
On a different note. I have driven a Cayenne (briefly) and frankly wasn't impressed with the driving experience at all. Yes it was fantastically fast and capable but it was like playing a computer game - no feedback, no tactility.
Edited by kambites on Tuesday 18th December 15:26
900T-R said:
Marki said:
I live in Holland and i can honestly say i have not experienced that , i think thats a British rudness thing not a BMW thing
I find Hyundai Tucsons are more liable to show this kind of erratic driving than 3-series these days. bosscerbera said:
crocop said:
oagent said:
Bugger all chance of ever seeing an X6 with the front fogs off, unless they get left on in Waitrose car park and drain the battery.
Impossible...they switch off automatically.....you mean....
...BMW drivers actually....
...you know....
...switch on the...
....the....
...fog lights....
...deliberately?
Some cars just look fat, this car however has a serious fluid retention problem.
But look, big can be beautiful...
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