Kit cars and Reg plates

Kit cars and Reg plates

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Discussion

Steve_D

13,737 posts

257 months

Thursday 12th May 2011
quotequote all
The most likely place you will find the emissions figures will be in section 3 Special Notes on the front page of the V5c.

One of mine (age related) reads:-
1. kit built/converted - assembled from parts all of which may not be new.
2. SVA Cert issued 22 09 2008 Emission limit - %CO 3.5: HC 0.12.

Steve

ChrisJ.

563 posts

239 months

Wednesday 25th May 2011
quotequote all
AdiT said:
Later SVA'd cars were issued with the emmision limit on the V5. That info' should come up when the car is logged onto the VOSA mot system at the test. If you're lucky the tester won't read the info (they often don't) and many believe a Q plate is automatically a visable smoke only test. If it's not on your V5 (SVA'd before they changed it) then it gets a visable smoke test.
Many thanks for that.

It isn't on my V5, so it gets a visable smoke test. Is that the case no matter what engine I fit from now on?

ChrisJ.

563 posts

239 months

Wednesday 25th May 2011
quotequote all
Steve_D said:
The most likely place you will find the emissions figures will be in section 3 Special Notes on the front page of the V5c.

One of mine (age related) reads:-
1. kit built/converted - assembled from parts all of which may not be new.
2. SVA Cert issued 22 09 2008 Emission limit - %CO 3.5: HC 0.12.

Steve
Thanks. Mine reads:

1. Non-transferable registration mark.
2. Kit built/converted - assembled from parts all of which may not be new.

So nothing at all written anywhere on the whole of my V5C regarding emissions.

AdiT

1,025 posts

156 months

Wednesday 25th May 2011
quotequote all
ChrisJ. said:
Many thanks for that.

It isn't on my V5, so it gets a visable smoke test. Is that the case no matter what engine I fit from now on?
Yep, thats right. Any engine change has no effect on the emmision status of the car.

AdiT

1,025 posts

156 months

Friday 27th May 2011
quotequote all
Update having just returned from MOTing mine.

Although the emmisions are on my V5, they didn't come up on the check sheet when they logged it onto the MOT system. Niether did the brake wieghts.. or anything else. Sheet was completly blank.


bill bob

133 posts

209 months

Saturday 28th May 2011
quotequote all
I would say in the vast majority of cases (not all) that correctly and legally registered kit cars will be on a Q plate. What matters? As has already been recognised in this thread, you can't see the plates from inside the car.

Bill Bob

one eyed mick

1,189 posts

160 months

Sunday 29th May 2011
quotequote all
bill bob said:
I would say in the vast majority of cases (not all) that correctly and legally registered kit cars will be on a Q plate. What matters? As has already been recognised in this thread, you can't see the plates from inside the car.

Bill Bob
I think that is a very sweeping statement bill bob ! yes there are a good number of incorrectly registered cars about that are not on "Q" plate but I cannot agree that the majority of legal cars are on "Q". the biggest prob with that plate it automaticaly devalues the car by a considerable amount no matter how well its built and there is no way of having it changed for apersonal plate or even an age related one.To me it matters not what plate it is on so long as it is properly built and safe !, Bye for now

Hunky Dory

1,049 posts

204 months

Monday 30th May 2011
quotequote all
bill bob said:
I would say in the vast majority of cases (not all) that correctly and legally registered kit cars will be on a Q plate.

Bill Bob
In my case, the DVLA simply cocked up and gave me a new 52 plate (SVA'd and registered in '02) instead of a Q and I have spoken to a couple of people since who had the same thing happen to them.

So OP, understand that this goes on as well and it's not always the builder trying to pull a fast one that results in a non Q plate being issued.

Not "correctly" registered, but still perfectly "legal"! wink

Frankthered

1,619 posts

179 months

Monday 30th May 2011
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one eyed mick said:
bill bob said:
I would say in the vast majority of cases (not all) that correctly and legally registered kit cars will be on a Q plate. What matters? As has already been recognised in this thread, you can't see the plates from inside the car.

Bill Bob
I think that is a very sweeping statement bill bob ! yes there are a good number of incorrectly registered cars about that are not on "Q" plate but I cannot agree that the majority of legal cars are on "Q". the biggest prob with that plate it automaticaly devalues the car by a considerable amount no matter how well its built and there is no way of having it changed for apersonal plate or even an age related one.To me it matters not what plate it is on so long as it is properly built and safe !, Bye for now
I'd have to agree with Mick - I don't think it's that difficult to get an age related plate - especially if you plan it that way from the start of your build. You only need TWO major components from one donor to qualify, major components being defined as: Chassis/Bodyshell, Axles, Transmission, Steering Assembly, Engine and Suspension (front and back).

Clearly there are lots of kits that could easily be built to ensure an age related plate is given to the car. There will always be some that don't, but I wouldn't necessarily see that as a problem. Mick says it would devalue the car - I don't think this is necessarily the case. I'd accept that for a replica or traditionally styled roadster, a "Q" plate would be disappointing for a potential buyer, but for a bike engined 7 (for example) it shouldn't be too big a deal. At least it wouldn't be for me!!

robcollingridge

603 posts

282 months

Monday 30th May 2011
quotequote all
I set out to get an 07 plate on my Fisher Fury R1 build, just because it makes it easier to put a personal plate on it later if I wanted too. There was no donor car as such as the chassis, bodywork, propshaft, etc. were all new.

They let me off with a 2nd hand engine but I claimed the diff and gearbox had been reconditioned to as new state. I think you are allowed 2 major parts that are not new. I paid a chap to put the paperwork through for me (£50 IIRC) to ensure I got an 07 plate.


jason61c

5,978 posts

173 months

Monday 30th May 2011
quotequote all
While we are talking about it.... I was using a single donor but my engine died so I fitted another.

I've got the donor diff/gearbox/steering/ecu/engine wiring loom

Is this enough to get an age related plate from the donor?


Comadis

1,731 posts

222 months

Wednesday 1st June 2011
quotequote all
as i´m from abroad, i always wondered about that q-plate thing and why a car has less value on a q-plate than on a "normal" plate.

the value of a kit, imo, is based on certain facts: has it been built-up properly and is the quality of built on a high level.

e.g.: i never understood why one of the cars i bought had a q-plate, the next car i bought (same brand, same spec, same manufacturing year) had the reg. from the donor car (but correct make of the kit in the V5).

i´ve seen so many kits on a q-plate where the built quality was on a extreme high level, where interestingwise the majority of robinhoods from the 90ies showed the reg-date from the donor car....and we know how those robins are from the built quality....

Frankthered

1,619 posts

179 months

Wednesday 1st June 2011
quotequote all
jason61c said:
While we are talking about it.... I was using a single donor but my engine died so I fitted another.

I've got the donor diff/gearbox/steering/ecu/engine wiring loom

Is this enough to get an age related plate from the donor?
You won't get the plate from the donor - the only way you can do this is if you keep the donor chassis/structure. What you get if you can show you've used several components from a single car is a different number of the same vintage.

By my reckoning, you should be ok for an age related plate. I would say diff+gearbox = transmission (first major component) and steering would be second. That's just my opinion though, I don't work for the DVLA and am no expert and, as others have noted earlier in the thread, DVLA responses can be a little random!

One thing you will need though is the donor's V5 - do you have it?

On your engine, did you swap like for like? If you did (or even if you didn't) it might be worth your while updating the donor V5 with the new engine number (and capacity if different).

Not really sure if this is dodgy or not tbh - it would seem reasonable to me if it's an engine you would have fitted to the donor if you were running it. (Particularly if it's the same spec.)

On Comadis' point regarding the 'Q' plate, the only issue I can really see is that once a 'Q' is issued, it cannot be changed to anything else. You are stuck with it. With an age related plate, you are allowed to change it to a personalised plate or a plate of a more authentic looking age (for a replica) as long as you don't try to make the car appear younger than the age you were issued with.

AdiT

1,025 posts

156 months

Wednesday 1st June 2011
quotequote all
Swapping the engine "on paper" by having the donor v5 changed to a more modern one was a loop hole and the DVLA are onto it now. They want to see evidence of it fitted to the donor in the form of a photo.

Steve_D

13,737 posts

257 months

Wednesday 1st June 2011
quotequote all
AdiT said:
Swapping the engine "on paper" by having the donor v5 changed to a more modern one was a loop hole and the DVLA are onto it now. They want to see evidence of it fitted to the donor in the form of a photo.
They are also likely to want an engineers report that the quoted engine number is installed in the vehicle.

Steve

Frankthered

1,619 posts

179 months

Wednesday 1st June 2011
quotequote all
Steve_D said:
AdiT said:
Swapping the engine "on paper" by having the donor v5 changed to a more modern one was a loop hole and the DVLA are onto it now. They want to see evidence of it fitted to the donor in the form of a photo.
They are also likely to want an engineers report that the quoted engine number is installed in the vehicle.

Steve
OK, fair enuff! It was just a (sneaky) thought. I guess it wasn't that original though, hey!

Do you reckon Jason still has a chance for an age related plate?

Hobzy

1,271 posts

210 months

Wednesday 1st June 2011
quotequote all
ChrisJ. said:
Steve_D said:
The most likely place you will find the emissions figures will be in section 3 Special Notes on the front page of the V5c.

One of mine (age related) reads:-
1. kit built/converted - assembled from parts all of which may not be new.
2. SVA Cert issued 22 09 2008 Emission limit - %CO 3.5: HC 0.12.

Steve
Thanks. Mine reads:

1. Non-transferable registration mark.
2. Kit built/converted - assembled from parts all of which may not be new.

So nothing at all written anywhere on the whole of my V5C regarding emissions.
Thanks for that Steve! I never even spotted that on the front... mine has nothing on the emissions section but has it on the special notes - 0.05CO 0.3FI HC 0.02FI Lambda 0.97-1.03.

Seeing as I have to find a new mot place this year I suspect I wont pass that with the current lack of CAT frown

one eyed mick

1,189 posts

160 months

Thursday 2nd June 2011
quotequote all
Comadis said:
as i´m from abroad, i always wondered about that q-plate thing and why a car has less value on a q-plate than on a "normal" plate.

the value of a kit, imo, is based on certain facts: has it been built-up properly and is the quality of built on a high level.

e.g.: i never understood why one of the cars i bought had a q-plate, the next car i bought (same brand, same spec, same manufacturing year) had the reg. from the donor car (but correct make of the kit in the V5).

i´ve seen so many kits on a q-plate where the built quality was on a extreme high level, where interestingwise the majority of robinhoods from the 90ies showed the reg-date from the donor car....and we know how those robins are from the built quality....
There are lots of Robin Hoods out on the road that are just as well built as any other home built car ! I personaly seen some real dogs of home builds from numerous other makes ,just my veiw . the q plate thing offends me because it is athing that is looked down upon as if the cars are poorly built or unsafe when they are not I honestly think that it should be changed to an age related thing or scrapped altogether ,since IVA all cars should be of an eaqual standard so why create a lower urder ,again things are my veiws BTW hi Comadis I thought you had forsaken us!

MTX371

1 posts

139 months

Wednesday 20th August 2014
quotequote all
Guys,

I am not from UK, but interested in buying an unregistered kit car in UK.
The owner has to register it so that I can register it in my country.

As I have read it is possible to register the kit, which originally was built e.g. in 2001, as an age related. Donor car, major parts, enough points etc. as described above.

But what EXACTLY does that mean then?!??

What is standing as the "Date of first registration" (field "B")in the V5C?
Is it the current date, on which the car was tested (August 20, 2014)?
Or is it the first registration date of the donor car?

Is the age related sign shown anywhere in the V5C or is this something totally different?

Best regards!

Edited by MTX371 on Wednesday 20th August 13:12

Fastpedeller

3,848 posts

145 months

Wednesday 20th August 2014
quotequote all
Comadis said:
with a Q-plate you can be sure that the car is "correctly" registered...which means the V5 shows the correct make, a correct chassis-no. ..also i thought a q-plate means always a visible smoke test...or am i wrong?
Not quite ---- You can be sure at some stage it was deemed by DVLA to be of indeterminate age, meaning that it could have been a rebuilt 'tin box' car, or (more likely) a kit car. Hopefully of a description fitting the car you are thinking of buying, but it could have been a different kit car with the plates (both chassis and registration plates) used to 'legalise' a different kit car.
Unfortunately the buyer has to be VERY careful (applies also to a production car) that what he is buying is what's on the V5.