Can see this affecting a few on here, changes to the MOT
Discussion
http://www.theaa.com/motoring_advice/car-servicing...
I think the nanny state has gone a bit too far this time, im now going to have to refit the cat to my discovery even though it passes the emmisions test without it and im going to have to find out why the speedo doesn't work on my 406 shed. Neither is really affecting the safety of either vehicle in my opinion.
The only bit that seems half sensible is the testing of tow bars and associated lighting.
I think the nanny state has gone a bit too far this time, im now going to have to refit the cat to my discovery even though it passes the emmisions test without it and im going to have to find out why the speedo doesn't work on my 406 shed. Neither is really affecting the safety of either vehicle in my opinion.
The only bit that seems half sensible is the testing of tow bars and associated lighting.
AA said:
Vehicles fitted with aftermarket HID systems must also be fitted with properly working washer and levelling systems.
Wrong. Nowhere in the MOT test manual is this stated. This has been covered at length on here, the test manual is quite clear - where fitted, they must work. There is no requirement for them to be fitted and HID's are mentioned only as an example as to where a car may be fitted with such a system.A shame the AA did not read the test manual before offering opinion on it.
Fox- said:
Wrong. Nowhere in the MOT test manual is this stated. This has been covered at length on here, the test manual is quite clear - where fitted, they must work. There is no requirement for them to be fitted and HID's are mentioned only as an example as to where a car may be fitted with such a system.
A shame the AA did not read the test manual before offering opinion on it.
Is that the current MOT manual or the one for the new test coming in in 2012?A shame the AA did not read the test manual before offering opinion on it.
mat13 said:
Is that the current MOT manual or the one for the new test coming in in 2012?
The new test coming in 2012.MOTManual said:
Vehicles equipped with High Intensity Discharge (HID) or LED dipped beam headlamps may be fitted with headlamp washers and a suspension or headlamp self levelling system.
Where such systems are fitted, they must work; however, it is accepted that it may not be possible to readily determine the functioning of self levelling systems. In such cases, the benefit of the doubt must be given.
It explains that a fail should be given if:Where such systems are fitted, they must work; however, it is accepted that it may not be possible to readily determine the functioning of self levelling systems. In such cases, the benefit of the doubt must be given.
Manual said:
A headlamp levelling or cleaning device inoperative or otherwise obviously defective.
Inoperative or defective. Not 'not present'.This means two things most people dont realise it means:
a) If you retrofitted HID's into crappy reflector lenses with no washers and no levelling, your car will pass its MOT
b) If you drive a car with conventional, non HID headlights that happens to be fitted with headlight washers, and they dont work, your car will fail its MOT
Bizarre.
Fox- said:
Inoperative or defective. Not 'not present'.
This means two things most people dont realise it means:
a) If you retrofitted HID's into crappy reflector lenses with no washers and no levelling, your car will pass its MOT
Bizarre.
I don't think that's quite the same mate. You need self-levelling HIDs to make them road legal, are ones without self levellers even CE marked for road use?This means two things most people dont realise it means:
a) If you retrofitted HID's into crappy reflector lenses with no washers and no levelling, your car will pass its MOT
Bizarre.
ks.Prof Prolapse said:
I don't think that's quite the same mate. You need self-levelling HIDs to make them road legal, are ones without self levellers even CE marked for road use?
This is a completely different issue to the MOT changes being discussed and isn't covered at MOT time.To conform to construction and use regulations a new vehicle fitted with HID headlamps must also have washers and levellers to get Type Approval. There is no reference to the aftermarket. Where there is, is a ridiculous one page document from the DfT giving 'opinion' on what they 'think' the law 'might' say. In other words, there is no case law regarding aftermarket HID lighting systems without levelling/washers. Merely the opinion of a department which is not a law enforcement agency. This is why they carefully use 'It is the Departments view' in said document.
The sad thing is that all this rubbish is barking up the wrong tree. It isn't the presence or otherwise of washers and levellers that make retrofit HID's a nightmare - its numpties fitting them into the wrong headlight lenses. Sadly this point appears to have been missed.
My Infiniti G37 rental car in the States had factory HID's with no washers or levelling system - neither system is really important to the safe operation of HID's and I'm at a loss as to why the EU thinks they are. My 335i had self levelling - it isnt quick enough to react to road conditions and its only purpose is to protect us from driver stupidity, those who dont bother to use the adjuster wheel when they load the car up.
Fox- said:
This means two things most people dont realise it means:
a) If you retrofitted HID's into crappy reflector lenses with no washers and no levelling, your car will pass its MOT
b) If you drive a car with conventional, non HID headlights that happens to be fitted with headlight washers, and they dont work, your car will fail its MOT
Bizarre.
Not bizarre but glad you posted a) If you retrofitted HID's into crappy reflector lenses with no washers and no levelling, your car will pass its MOT
b) If you drive a car with conventional, non HID headlights that happens to be fitted with headlight washers, and they dont work, your car will fail its MOT
Bizarre.
Last time around we noticed examples of exception for estate cars with self levelling suspension and sports cars with stiff suspension
Presumably (b) above would still need to pass alignment to prevent dazzle?
Quick question - the middle seatbelt on my car doesn't work. The lock is jammed on so you can't pull it out at all.
Also the lock on one of the rear doors doesn't work from the button or putting the key in the lock, but you can lock it and unlock it manually from the inside.
Will that fail an MOT?
Also the lock on one of the rear doors doesn't work from the button or putting the key in the lock, but you can lock it and unlock it manually from the inside.
Will that fail an MOT?
)"The tester will check for the presence and correct operation of the ESC malfunction warning light together with looking for obviously missing, excessively damaged or inappropriately repaired or modified components and electrical wiring,"
So how do you test that then? Are they going to inspect the wiring loom?
So how do you test that then? Are they going to inspect the wiring loom?
Nurburgsingh said:
"The tester will check for the presence and correct operation of the ESC malfunction warning light together with looking for obviously missing, excessively damaged or inappropriately repaired or modified components and electrical wiring,"
So how do you test that then? Are they going to inspect the wiring loom?
and how are they going to check for the correct operation of the tyre pressure warning light? deflate your tyres?So how do you test that then? Are they going to inspect the wiring loom?
"Seats
It must be possible to secure the driver's seat fore and aft adjustment mechanism in two or three different positions. On electric seats the motors must move the seat fore and aft."
OK.. so my road legal race car has its seat bolted to the floor... is that a failure now? or becuase the fore and aft adjustmnet mech isnt there I dont have to worry?
Fox- said:
This is a completely different issue to the MOT changes being discussed and isn't covered at MOT time.
To conform to construction and use regulations a new vehicle fitted with HID headlamps must also have washers and levellers to get Type Approval. There is no reference to the aftermarket. Where there is, is a ridiculous one page document from the DfT giving 'opinion' on what they 'think' the law 'might' say. In other words, there is no case law regarding aftermarket HID lighting systems without levelling/washers. Merely the opinion of a department which is not a law enforcement agency. This is why they carefully use 'It is the Departments view' in said document.
The sad thing is that all this rubbish is barking up the wrong tree. It isn't the presence or otherwise of washers and levellers that make retrofit HID's a nightmare - its numpties fitting them into the wrong headlight lenses. Sadly this point appears to have been missed.
My Infiniti G37 rental car in the States had factory HID's with no washers or levelling system - neither system is really important to the safe operation of HID's and I'm at a loss as to why the EU thinks they are. My 335i had self levelling - it isnt quick enough to react to road conditions and its only purpose is to protect us from driver stupidity, those who dont bother to use the adjuster wheel when they load the car up.
I don't agree that self levellers are too slow to be useful. The ones fitted to our Mini, although far from perfect, certainly stop your retinas being burned out on a steep hill. Can lenses honestly do the same job?To conform to construction and use regulations a new vehicle fitted with HID headlamps must also have washers and levellers to get Type Approval. There is no reference to the aftermarket. Where there is, is a ridiculous one page document from the DfT giving 'opinion' on what they 'think' the law 'might' say. In other words, there is no case law regarding aftermarket HID lighting systems without levelling/washers. Merely the opinion of a department which is not a law enforcement agency. This is why they carefully use 'It is the Departments view' in said document.
The sad thing is that all this rubbish is barking up the wrong tree. It isn't the presence or otherwise of washers and levellers that make retrofit HID's a nightmare - its numpties fitting them into the wrong headlight lenses. Sadly this point appears to have been missed.
My Infiniti G37 rental car in the States had factory HID's with no washers or levelling system - neither system is really important to the safe operation of HID's and I'm at a loss as to why the EU thinks they are. My 335i had self levelling - it isnt quick enough to react to road conditions and its only purpose is to protect us from driver stupidity, those who dont bother to use the adjuster wheel when they load the car up.
Also, if it's a seperate issue entirely, surely there are a number of components you could replace with incredibly unsafe items which aren't specifically covered in MOT guidelines? Sugarglass windscreen perhaps? Chocolate panels? Surely there's a degree of commonsense interpretation required? Would MOT testers not have an obligation, if not a legal then a moral one, to not allow a car an MOT certificate with "not suitable for road use" components fitted?
Prof Prolapse said:
Also, if it's a seperate issue entirely, surely there are a number of components you could replace with incredibly unsafe items which aren't specifically covered in MOT guidelines? Sugarglass windscreen perhaps? Chocolate panels? Surely there's a degree of commonsense interpretation required? Would MOT testers not have an obligation, if not a legal then a moral one, to not allow a car an MOT certificate with "not suitable for road use" components fitted?
would be impossibleEvery time you fit an aftermarket oil filter or disc pads is the MOT station supposed to check it?
Or is MOT just a functional check that say the headlights dont spread beyond a defined pattern
There are a number of circumstances where self levelling can be counter productive. Do you really need the lights horizontal on a gradient so they shine into the eyes of those going uphill?
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