£20 Billion to promote lending whilst the Bonuses go on:
Discussion
The latest brainwave from the Coalition in the UK is to provide the funding desperately needed by small businesses in the UK with government guarantees from the taxpayer.
Who else?
Because despite all the determined efforts of George Osbourne, David Cameron, Vince Cable, the Bank of England, the Treasury and the entire government, the Banks will not lend to small commercial businesses in any volume in the UK. Even though the entire Banking Sector only exists because the Taxpayer bailed them out totally three years ago.
And at the same time the Banks are unable to repay the investments made by the taxpayer because years of recovery will be required with full bonuses during that period for the bankers, of course, in order for that recovery to be effected. Possibly. If the bonuses allow it.
Have any of the lessons that should have been learned in the Banking crisis?
I fear not.
Do politicians not realise that the blind greed that is driven by the lottery win bonuses and uncontrolled Bankers desire for instant wealth are precisely why we got into this mess in the first place?
Why not suggest to the Bankers that Millions of pounds worth of bonuses would become payable to them if they devised a way for this lending to be effected.
That would do it. Surely better than another 20,000 Billion from the poor taxpayer?
Bankers are obviously driven by personal aggrandisment.
Use that motivation to make lending commercial businesses their greatest wish.
If ever there was a clear demonstration that, the pygmies in parliament, are not up to the job, this must surely be the classic case.
Over half the Banking sector is there only by the grace of the taxpayer.
The real problem is of course, that successive UK Governments have become adept at grossly overspending and grossly overborrowing to create the spend in the easiest possible way.
Politicians thereby being in a position to lavish Benefits, Public Sector salaries and unaffordable lifestyles onto a sufficiently large section of the population so as to ensure being reelected at the next election. Self serving and utterly wrong.
Taxation is already at stratospheric levels and is not realistically capable of greater recovery. Therefore Politicians of all parties, have embraced utterly unsustainable borrowing levels en masse.
So borrow, borrow, borrow, became the mantra of government in the UK
Now, creating ludicrously expensive private finance initiatives under the last government, selling all the Public Utilities under the governments before that, and similar artificial devices, have become the Politicians way to find enough money to keep the merry go round running.
Finally, Cameron's latest brainwave, has arrived, whereby leasing or selling all out roads and transport systems to private investors, has been wheeled into play, to enable yet more unaffordable expenditure, because borrowing is getting tricky and taxation can yield no more.
We all know that we cannot live like kings on a pauper's income.
Apparently the Government do not see any difficulty in doing just that.
The mugs are of course us, the taxpayers. Paying for everything and getting nothing in return.
Is there anyone who believes that the Banks are operating in the national interest, whilst being able to be paid huge bonuses, being only able to survive through the taxpayer loans, with their bonuses and remuneration packages, utterly unrelated to the position of the rest of the country?
Meanwhile the government create 20 Billion funding to persuade the banks to deign to lend to the businesses that might just rebuild our Economy given half a chance? When the Banks should be doing just that themselves.
It seems madness to me. Unsustainable, stupid madness.
Who else?
Because despite all the determined efforts of George Osbourne, David Cameron, Vince Cable, the Bank of England, the Treasury and the entire government, the Banks will not lend to small commercial businesses in any volume in the UK. Even though the entire Banking Sector only exists because the Taxpayer bailed them out totally three years ago.
And at the same time the Banks are unable to repay the investments made by the taxpayer because years of recovery will be required with full bonuses during that period for the bankers, of course, in order for that recovery to be effected. Possibly. If the bonuses allow it.
Have any of the lessons that should have been learned in the Banking crisis?
I fear not.
Do politicians not realise that the blind greed that is driven by the lottery win bonuses and uncontrolled Bankers desire for instant wealth are precisely why we got into this mess in the first place?
Why not suggest to the Bankers that Millions of pounds worth of bonuses would become payable to them if they devised a way for this lending to be effected.
That would do it. Surely better than another 20,000 Billion from the poor taxpayer?
Bankers are obviously driven by personal aggrandisment.
Use that motivation to make lending commercial businesses their greatest wish.
If ever there was a clear demonstration that, the pygmies in parliament, are not up to the job, this must surely be the classic case.
Over half the Banking sector is there only by the grace of the taxpayer.
The real problem is of course, that successive UK Governments have become adept at grossly overspending and grossly overborrowing to create the spend in the easiest possible way.
Politicians thereby being in a position to lavish Benefits, Public Sector salaries and unaffordable lifestyles onto a sufficiently large section of the population so as to ensure being reelected at the next election. Self serving and utterly wrong.
Taxation is already at stratospheric levels and is not realistically capable of greater recovery. Therefore Politicians of all parties, have embraced utterly unsustainable borrowing levels en masse.
So borrow, borrow, borrow, became the mantra of government in the UK
Now, creating ludicrously expensive private finance initiatives under the last government, selling all the Public Utilities under the governments before that, and similar artificial devices, have become the Politicians way to find enough money to keep the merry go round running.
Finally, Cameron's latest brainwave, has arrived, whereby leasing or selling all out roads and transport systems to private investors, has been wheeled into play, to enable yet more unaffordable expenditure, because borrowing is getting tricky and taxation can yield no more.
We all know that we cannot live like kings on a pauper's income.
Apparently the Government do not see any difficulty in doing just that.
The mugs are of course us, the taxpayers. Paying for everything and getting nothing in return.
Is there anyone who believes that the Banks are operating in the national interest, whilst being able to be paid huge bonuses, being only able to survive through the taxpayer loans, with their bonuses and remuneration packages, utterly unrelated to the position of the rest of the country?
Meanwhile the government create 20 Billion funding to persuade the banks to deign to lend to the businesses that might just rebuild our Economy given half a chance? When the Banks should be doing just that themselves.
It seems madness to me. Unsustainable, stupid madness.
Steffan said:
The latest brainwave from the Coalition in the UK is to provide the funding desperately needed by small businesses in the UK with government guarantees from the taxpayer.
Who else?
Because despite all the determined efforts of George Osbourne, David Cameron, Vince Cable, the Bank of England, the Treasury and the entire government, the Banks will not lend to small commercial businesses in any volume in the UK. Even though the entire Banking Sector only exists because the Taxpayer bailed them out totally three years ago.
And at the same time the Banks are unable to repay the investments made by the taxpayer because years of recovery will be required with full bonuses during that period for the bankers, of course, in order for that recovery to be effected. Possibly. If the bonuses allow it.
Have any of the lessons that should have been learned in the Banking crisis?
I fear not.
Do politicians not realise that the blind greed that is driven by the lottery win bonuses and uncontrolled Bankers desire for instant wealth are precisely why we got into this mess in the first place?
Why not suggest to the Bankers that Millions of pounds worth of bonuses would become payable to them if they devised a way for this lending to be effected.
That would do it. Surely better than another 20,000 Billion from the poor taxpayer?
Bankers are obviously driven by personal aggrandisment.
Use that motivation to make lending commercial businesses their greatest wish.
If ever there was a clear demonstration that, the pygmies in parliament, are not up to the job, this must surely be the classic case.
Over half the Banking sector is there only by the grace of the taxpayer.
The real problem is of course, that successive UK Governments have become adept at grossly overspending and grossly overborrowing to create the spend in the easiest possible way.
Politicians thereby being in a position to lavish Benefits, Public Sector salaries and unaffordable lifestyles onto a sufficiently large section of the population so as to ensure being reelected at the next election. Self serving and utterly wrong.
Taxation is already at stratospheric levels and is not realistically capable of greater recovery. Therefore Politicians of all parties, have embraced utterly unsustainable borrowing levels en masse.
So borrow, borrow, borrow, became the mantra of government in the UK
Now, creating ludicrously expensive private finance initiatives under the last government, selling all the Public Utilities under the governments before that, and similar artificial devices, have become the Politicians way to find enough money to keep the merry go round running.
Finally, Cameron's latest brainwave, has arrived, whereby leasing or selling all out roads and transport systems to private investors, has been wheeled into play, to enable yet more unaffordable expenditure, because borrowing is getting tricky and taxation can yield no more.
We all know that we cannot live like kings on a pauper's income.
Apparently the Government do not see any difficulty in doing just that.
The mugs are of course us, the taxpayers. Paying for everything and getting nothing in return.
Is there anyone who believes that the Banks are operating in the national interest, whilst being able to be paid huge bonuses, being only able to survive through the taxpayer loans, with their bonuses and remuneration packages, utterly unrelated to the position of the rest of the country?
Meanwhile the government create 20 Billion funding to persuade the banks to deign to lend to the businesses that might just rebuild our Economy given half a chance? When the Banks should be doing just that themselves.
It seems madness to me. Unsustainable, stupid madness.
Remember all the moaning from people LIKE YOU about how the banks were lending recklessly?Who else?
Because despite all the determined efforts of George Osbourne, David Cameron, Vince Cable, the Bank of England, the Treasury and the entire government, the Banks will not lend to small commercial businesses in any volume in the UK. Even though the entire Banking Sector only exists because the Taxpayer bailed them out totally three years ago.
And at the same time the Banks are unable to repay the investments made by the taxpayer because years of recovery will be required with full bonuses during that period for the bankers, of course, in order for that recovery to be effected. Possibly. If the bonuses allow it.
Have any of the lessons that should have been learned in the Banking crisis?
I fear not.
Do politicians not realise that the blind greed that is driven by the lottery win bonuses and uncontrolled Bankers desire for instant wealth are precisely why we got into this mess in the first place?
Why not suggest to the Bankers that Millions of pounds worth of bonuses would become payable to them if they devised a way for this lending to be effected.
That would do it. Surely better than another 20,000 Billion from the poor taxpayer?
Bankers are obviously driven by personal aggrandisment.
Use that motivation to make lending commercial businesses their greatest wish.
If ever there was a clear demonstration that, the pygmies in parliament, are not up to the job, this must surely be the classic case.
Over half the Banking sector is there only by the grace of the taxpayer.
The real problem is of course, that successive UK Governments have become adept at grossly overspending and grossly overborrowing to create the spend in the easiest possible way.
Politicians thereby being in a position to lavish Benefits, Public Sector salaries and unaffordable lifestyles onto a sufficiently large section of the population so as to ensure being reelected at the next election. Self serving and utterly wrong.
Taxation is already at stratospheric levels and is not realistically capable of greater recovery. Therefore Politicians of all parties, have embraced utterly unsustainable borrowing levels en masse.
So borrow, borrow, borrow, became the mantra of government in the UK
Now, creating ludicrously expensive private finance initiatives under the last government, selling all the Public Utilities under the governments before that, and similar artificial devices, have become the Politicians way to find enough money to keep the merry go round running.
Finally, Cameron's latest brainwave, has arrived, whereby leasing or selling all out roads and transport systems to private investors, has been wheeled into play, to enable yet more unaffordable expenditure, because borrowing is getting tricky and taxation can yield no more.
We all know that we cannot live like kings on a pauper's income.
Apparently the Government do not see any difficulty in doing just that.
The mugs are of course us, the taxpayers. Paying for everything and getting nothing in return.
Is there anyone who believes that the Banks are operating in the national interest, whilst being able to be paid huge bonuses, being only able to survive through the taxpayer loans, with their bonuses and remuneration packages, utterly unrelated to the position of the rest of the country?
Meanwhile the government create 20 Billion funding to persuade the banks to deign to lend to the businesses that might just rebuild our Economy given half a chance? When the Banks should be doing just that themselves.
It seems madness to me. Unsustainable, stupid madness.
This is what you get.
Not necessarily.
Successive governments have rewarded reckless lending with a no strings bail out, job security, permanent employment and easy pickings all without addressing the fundamental issues of the Banking Crisis.
This is beyond the ability of our pygmy leaders. That is the problem.
None of whom have any real experience of working in any industry. Look at George Osbourne and Cameron. Or Moonpig and Balls up. Can you really believe they are capable of solving our economic problems?
Hardly.
This is capable of solution.
But not with governments made of politicians who are largely inexperienced wet behind the ears apparatchiks.
That is the problem.
Successive governments have rewarded reckless lending with a no strings bail out, job security, permanent employment and easy pickings all without addressing the fundamental issues of the Banking Crisis.
This is beyond the ability of our pygmy leaders. That is the problem.
None of whom have any real experience of working in any industry. Look at George Osbourne and Cameron. Or Moonpig and Balls up. Can you really believe they are capable of solving our economic problems?
Hardly.
This is capable of solution.
But not with governments made of politicians who are largely inexperienced wet behind the ears apparatchiks.
That is the problem.
Steffan said:
The latest brainwave from the Coalition in the UK is to provide the funding desperately needed by small businesses in the UK with government guarantees from the taxpayer.
Who else?
Because despite all the determined efforts of George Osbourne, David Cameron, Vince Cable, the Bank of England, the Treasury and the entire government, the Banks will not lend to small commercial businesses in any volume in the UK. Even though the entire Banking Sector only exists because the Taxpayer bailed them out totally three years ago.
And at the same time the Banks are unable to repay the investments made by the taxpayer because years of recovery will be required with full bonuses during that period for the bankers, of course, in order for that recovery to be effected. Possibly. If the bonuses allow it.
Have any of the lessons that should have been learned in the Banking crisis?
I fear not.
Do politicians not realise that the blind greed that is driven by the lottery win bonuses and uncontrolled Bankers desire for instant wealth are precisely why we got into this mess in the first place?
Why not suggest to the Bankers that Millions of pounds worth of bonuses would become payable to them if they devised a way for this lending to be effected.
That would do it. Surely better than another 20,000 Billion from the poor taxpayer?
Bankers are obviously driven by personal aggrandisment.
Use that motivation to make lending commercial businesses their greatest wish.
If ever there was a clear demonstration that, the pygmies in parliament, are not up to the job, this must surely be the classic case.
Over half the Banking sector is there only by the grace of the taxpayer.
The real problem is of course, that successive UK Governments have become adept at grossly overspending and grossly overborrowing to create the spend in the easiest possible way.
Politicians thereby being in a position to lavish Benefits, Public Sector salaries and unaffordable lifestyles onto a sufficiently large section of the population so as to ensure being reelected at the next election. Self serving and utterly wrong.
Taxation is already at stratospheric levels and is not realistically capable of greater recovery. Therefore Politicians of all parties, have embraced utterly unsustainable borrowing levels en masse.
So borrow, borrow, borrow, became the mantra of government in the UK
Now, creating ludicrously expensive private finance initiatives under the last government, selling all the Public Utilities under the governments before that, and similar artificial devices, have become the Politicians way to find enough money to keep the merry go round running.
Finally, Cameron's latest brainwave, has arrived, whereby leasing or selling all out roads and transport systems to private investors, has been wheeled into play, to enable yet more unaffordable expenditure, because borrowing is getting tricky and taxation can yield no more.
We all know that we cannot live like kings on a pauper's income.
Apparently the Government do not see any difficulty in doing just that.
The mugs are of course us, the taxpayers. Paying for everything and getting nothing in return.
Is there anyone who believes that the Banks are operating in the national interest, whilst being able to be paid huge bonuses, being only able to survive through the taxpayer loans, with their bonuses and remuneration packages, utterly unrelated to the position of the rest of the country?
Meanwhile the government create 20 Billion funding to persuade the banks to deign to lend to the businesses that might just rebuild our Economy given half a chance? When the Banks should be doing just that themselves.
It seems madness to me. Unsustainable, stupid madness.
It's nice out today Steffan, why not lose the doom and gloom rhetoric for a couple of hours and have a beer in the sun. The financial meltdown you so fervently wish for will not come any sooner just because you keep writing about it, so just chill out and wait for it to come to you Who else?
Because despite all the determined efforts of George Osbourne, David Cameron, Vince Cable, the Bank of England, the Treasury and the entire government, the Banks will not lend to small commercial businesses in any volume in the UK. Even though the entire Banking Sector only exists because the Taxpayer bailed them out totally three years ago.
And at the same time the Banks are unable to repay the investments made by the taxpayer because years of recovery will be required with full bonuses during that period for the bankers, of course, in order for that recovery to be effected. Possibly. If the bonuses allow it.
Have any of the lessons that should have been learned in the Banking crisis?
I fear not.
Do politicians not realise that the blind greed that is driven by the lottery win bonuses and uncontrolled Bankers desire for instant wealth are precisely why we got into this mess in the first place?
Why not suggest to the Bankers that Millions of pounds worth of bonuses would become payable to them if they devised a way for this lending to be effected.
That would do it. Surely better than another 20,000 Billion from the poor taxpayer?
Bankers are obviously driven by personal aggrandisment.
Use that motivation to make lending commercial businesses their greatest wish.
If ever there was a clear demonstration that, the pygmies in parliament, are not up to the job, this must surely be the classic case.
Over half the Banking sector is there only by the grace of the taxpayer.
The real problem is of course, that successive UK Governments have become adept at grossly overspending and grossly overborrowing to create the spend in the easiest possible way.
Politicians thereby being in a position to lavish Benefits, Public Sector salaries and unaffordable lifestyles onto a sufficiently large section of the population so as to ensure being reelected at the next election. Self serving and utterly wrong.
Taxation is already at stratospheric levels and is not realistically capable of greater recovery. Therefore Politicians of all parties, have embraced utterly unsustainable borrowing levels en masse.
So borrow, borrow, borrow, became the mantra of government in the UK
Now, creating ludicrously expensive private finance initiatives under the last government, selling all the Public Utilities under the governments before that, and similar artificial devices, have become the Politicians way to find enough money to keep the merry go round running.
Finally, Cameron's latest brainwave, has arrived, whereby leasing or selling all out roads and transport systems to private investors, has been wheeled into play, to enable yet more unaffordable expenditure, because borrowing is getting tricky and taxation can yield no more.
We all know that we cannot live like kings on a pauper's income.
Apparently the Government do not see any difficulty in doing just that.
The mugs are of course us, the taxpayers. Paying for everything and getting nothing in return.
Is there anyone who believes that the Banks are operating in the national interest, whilst being able to be paid huge bonuses, being only able to survive through the taxpayer loans, with their bonuses and remuneration packages, utterly unrelated to the position of the rest of the country?
Meanwhile the government create 20 Billion funding to persuade the banks to deign to lend to the businesses that might just rebuild our Economy given half a chance? When the Banks should be doing just that themselves.
It seems madness to me. Unsustainable, stupid madness.
Steffan said:
Not necessarily.
Successive governments have rewarded reckless lending with a no strings bail out, job security, permanent employment and easy pickings all without addressing the fundamental issues of the Banking Crisis.
This is beyond the ability of our pygmy leaders. That is the problem.
None of whom have any real experience of working in any industry. Look at George Osbourne and Cameron. Or Moonpig and Balls up. Can you really believe they are capable of solving our economic problems?
Hardly.
This is capable of solution.
But not with governments made of politicians who are largely inexperienced wet behind the ears apparatchiks.
That is the problem.
You're bonkers mate.Successive governments have rewarded reckless lending with a no strings bail out, job security, permanent employment and easy pickings all without addressing the fundamental issues of the Banking Crisis.
This is beyond the ability of our pygmy leaders. That is the problem.
None of whom have any real experience of working in any industry. Look at George Osbourne and Cameron. Or Moonpig and Balls up. Can you really believe they are capable of solving our economic problems?
Hardly.
This is capable of solution.
But not with governments made of politicians who are largely inexperienced wet behind the ears apparatchiks.
That is the problem.
Job security? Do you have ANY IDEA how many people in banks have lost their jobs. Tens of thousands.
Typical uninformed ranting, comrade.
Change the record FFS.
Nothing like an uninformed rant to start a pointless thread.
You miss out some salient points.
On one hand politicians say both "evil banks lent too much!" and simultaneously "evil banks should lend more to those poor risk-free small businesses!" because it makes them look good in front of the electorate even though it makes absolutely no sense whatsoever.
On the other hand however (and the bit you fail to mention), the banking regulators are *forcing* banks to lend less, by increasing capital ratios. (the only alternative being to raise more capital by selling shares, except at the moment, no-one's buying).
Reconcile that one.
You miss out some salient points.
On one hand politicians say both "evil banks lent too much!" and simultaneously "evil banks should lend more to those poor risk-free small businesses!" because it makes them look good in front of the electorate even though it makes absolutely no sense whatsoever.
On the other hand however (and the bit you fail to mention), the banking regulators are *forcing* banks to lend less, by increasing capital ratios. (the only alternative being to raise more capital by selling shares, except at the moment, no-one's buying).
Reconcile that one.
munky said:
Nothing like an uninformed rant to start a pointless thread.
You miss out some salient points.
On one hand politicians say both "evil banks lent too much!" and simultaneously "evil banks should lend more to those poor risk-free small businesses!" because it makes them look good in front of the electorate even though it makes absolutely no sense whatsoever.
On the other hand however (and the bit you fail to mention), the banking regulators are *forcing* banks to lend less, by increasing capital ratios. (the only alternative being to raise more capital by selling shares, except at the moment, no-one's buying).
Reconcile that one.
As usual he misses out all the salient points, he reminds me of one of those one topic nutters (normally religion) that you used to get hanging around shopping centres on a lunchtime ranting at an uninterested passers by. The best thing to do was ignore them, and that's probably the answer to Steffan's endless posts on the inevitable breakdown of our economy\society in general.You miss out some salient points.
On one hand politicians say both "evil banks lent too much!" and simultaneously "evil banks should lend more to those poor risk-free small businesses!" because it makes them look good in front of the electorate even though it makes absolutely no sense whatsoever.
On the other hand however (and the bit you fail to mention), the banking regulators are *forcing* banks to lend less, by increasing capital ratios. (the only alternative being to raise more capital by selling shares, except at the moment, no-one's buying).
Reconcile that one.
Marf said:
Steffan said:
Soovy.
I would think you work in Financial Services or Financial Investment.
Would I be right?
Check his profile, lawyer working in derivatives. What is the relevance of that?I would think you work in Financial Services or Financial Investment.
Would I be right?
He has no clue at all about how the City works, and what we do. We are scrupulously honest, heavily regulated and have a professional conscience at my shop.
Steffan - stop reading the Daily Mail, take a deep breath and think about things for yourself logically.
As others have noted, on the one hand the banks are told they lend irresponsibly. Now they are told to lend more - presumably our dear govt have a much better view of who the bad risks are? Or more likely they don't care as they know the bankers will get all the downside.
Your ire should be at the idiots in govt, not the banks. They need to make their minds up what they want. Or better still, let the banks do their thing and let them fail if they cock up.
Furthermore, the taxpayer isn't funding this. It is guaranteeing it. There's a difference.
As others have noted, on the one hand the banks are told they lend irresponsibly. Now they are told to lend more - presumably our dear govt have a much better view of who the bad risks are? Or more likely they don't care as they know the bankers will get all the downside.
Your ire should be at the idiots in govt, not the banks. They need to make their minds up what they want. Or better still, let the banks do their thing and let them fail if they cock up.
Furthermore, the taxpayer isn't funding this. It is guaranteeing it. There's a difference.
Soovy said:
Marf said:
Steffan said:
Soovy.
I would think you work in Financial Services or Financial Investment.
Would I be right?
Check his profile, lawyer working in derivatives. What is the relevance of that?I would think you work in Financial Services or Financial Investment.
Would I be right?
He has no clue at all about how the City works, and what we do. We are scrupulously honest, heavily regulated and have a professional conscience at my shop.
Can you just explain to me why the banks went bust if everything is so well regulated and secure?
Please.
Steffan said:
Soovy said:
Marf said:
Steffan said:
Soovy.
I would think you work in Financial Services or Financial Investment.
Would I be right?
Check his profile, lawyer working in derivatives. What is the relevance of that?I would think you work in Financial Services or Financial Investment.
Would I be right?
He has no clue at all about how the City works, and what we do. We are scrupulously honest, heavily regulated and have a professional conscience at my shop.
Can you just explain to me why the banks went bust if everything is so well regulated and secure?
Please.
There are loads of threads on this exact subject on how NR have too much exposure to mortgages and have not much investment, RBS making a bad decision of buying a bank with hidden toxic debit, Lloyds just being Lloyds and also having a lot of exposure...
The other UK banks were not bailed out.
But there are a lot of threads that explain this in a lot of detail.
Gassing Station | News, Politics & Economics | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff