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Sprint Rich

Original Poster:

118 posts

64 months

[news] 
Monday 23rd April 2012 quote quote all
From Autosport:

Nico Rosberg says the fact he avoided sanction after vigorously defending from both Lewis Hamilton and Fernando Alonso during the Bahrain Grand Prix was proof that it was 'good racing'.

Rosberg appeared to push both drivers off the track on separate occasions between Turns 3 and 4 as he defended hard, with Hamilton forced to overtake off circuit and Alonso forced to abandon his attempt.

The stewards of the meeting met with the drivers and their representatives following the grand prix to discuss the clashes, but it was decided Rosberg's moves were legitimate.

Rosberg said he agreed with the decision, saying: "Of course there were the two incidents with Lewis and Fernando, which were both definitely good racing.

"I even had to go to the stewards for that and thankfully they judged that it was tough but okay so I didn't get a penalty for that."

Rosberg said a superior strategy had helped salvage the damage of a disastrous opening lap, and insisted he was happy to have finished fifth as it was the best he and Mercedes could have hoped for.

"We saw some teams being able to handle [tyre management] better than others, and for me overall fifth place was an okay result," he added.

"The whole first lap didn't go well, I was in the wrong place at the wrong time and didn't get the best out of it, so I was back in ninth. From then on we had a great strategy so I came all the way back up to fifth, which even if we started at the front was probably the best we could have gotten today in terms of our speed.

"That's okay - 35 points now in one week is good and only 18 points off the championship lead, that's cool too.


Not his biggest fan, though he did well last week. What really grabbed my eye was "definitely good racing". My arse it is, I know it is the modern way but I hate it. Thoughts?

Edited to add, guess the thread is not really about Britney exclusively, more the weaving

Edited by Sprint Rich on Monday 23 April 17:36

Allyc85

4,742 posts

69 months

[news] 
Monday 23rd April 2012 quote quote all
We all know what would have happened if it was Hamilton blocking like Rosberg did dont we? I could do with seeing it again from onboard the following cars but it did seem a bit of an excessive chop, not leaving a cars width like the new rules say to.

Rude-boy

18,263 posts

116 months

[news] 
Monday 23rd April 2012 quote quote all
Sprint Rich said:
What really grabbed my eye was "definitely good racing". My arse it is, I know it is the modern way but I hate it. Thoughts?
It was fricking dangerous and if it had be almost any other driver than Nico I would have expected to see their balls nailed to the stewards office wall.

I think Nico 'got away' with it only because they had the issue of should they ping LH for passing whilst out of the track limits, that it was Nico who hasn't got a reputation for putting others in the wall, and no one went off.

It is a really hard call though.

AreOut

866 posts

44 months

[news] 
Monday 23rd April 2012 quote quote all
Not hard call at all, there is a very simple explanation on autosport. It's your problem if you can't comprehend that.

Allyc85 said:
We all know what would have happened if it was Hamilton blocking like Rosberg did dont we? I could do with seeing it again from onboard the following cars but it did seem a bit of an excessive chop, not leaving a cars width like the new rules say to.


actually LH was at fault there because it is forbidden to overtake off the track, but they have forgiven gim and it is not the first time(counting not only this season)

Rude-boy

18,263 posts

116 months

[news] 
Monday 23rd April 2012 quote quote all
AreOut said:
Not hard call at all, there is a very simple explanation on autosport. It's your problem if you can't comprehend that.
fk me I hope you're never on the same track as me or in a position of influence in the tower if you think that was an easy call.

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Mr_Thyroid

961 posts

110 months

[news] 
Monday 23rd April 2012 quote quote all
Both Hamilton and Alonso were still fully behind and not alongside when Rosberg completed his one move to the far side of the track. This is the reason Rosberg didn't get a penalty.

I'm not sure you can penalise someone because 'it looked a bit dodgy' (and it did look dodgy) when the rule book says it's legal.

Sprint Rich

Original Poster:

118 posts

64 months

[news] 
Monday 23rd April 2012 quote quote all
Mr_Thyroid said:
Both Hamilton and Alonso were still fully behind and not alongside when Rosberg completed his one move to the far side of the track. This is the reason Rosberg didn't get a penalty.

I'm not sure you can penalise someone because 'it looked a bit dodgy' (and it did look dodgy) when the rule book says it's legal.
They were both fully behind when he STARTED the moves. I know the rules, I just wish things like the defensive chop could be unlearned(aerodynamics would be good too!), there were some savage examples in the GP2 races too. Defensive driving is an art, chopping across the track eyes glued to the mirrors is what the bad guy in Days of Thunder does. Its crass,crap and cheap, not "good racing".

TheHeretic

73,668 posts

138 months

[news] 
Monday 23rd April 2012 quote quote all
Rude-boy said:
AreOut said:
Not hard call at all, there is a very simple explanation on autosport. It's your problem if you can't comprehend that.
fk me I hope you're never on the same track as me or in a position of influence in the tower if you think that was an easy call.
The other cars were never alongside Rosberg. I know people like to think Rosberg shunted folks off, but they were always behind him. His move was as described in the report, as direct, straight, and without weaving to the edge of the circuit. The drivers decided on their own bat to go off the circuit. I suggest you rematch it.

AreOut

866 posts

44 months

[news] 
Monday 23rd April 2012 quote quote all
I don't know why is that so hard for people to comprehend...

TheHeretic

73,668 posts

138 months

[news] 
Monday 23rd April 2012 quote quote all
AreOut said:
I don't know why is that so hard for people to comprehend...
Clearly. Read the report, watch the footage. What, exactly, did he do wrong? You tell us.

Use Psychology

11,327 posts

75 months

[news] 
Monday 23rd April 2012 quote quote all
is if possible that the defending driver should consider the momentum of the overtaking car. if you put your car into a space where the car behind is heading, and remove the gap between you and the edge of the track, is that not 'crowding a car beyond the confines of the circuit"?

Mr_Thyroid

961 posts

110 months

[news] 
Monday 23rd April 2012 quote quote all
Use Psychology said:
is if possible that the defending driver should consider the momentum of the overtaking car. if you put your car into a space where the car behind is heading, and remove the gap between you and the edge of the track, is that not 'crowding a car beyond the confines of the circuit"?
In that situation the following driver removes his foot from the accelerator pedal.

Sprint Rich

Original Poster:

118 posts

64 months

[news] 
Monday 23rd April 2012 quote quote all
TheHeretic said:
Clearly. Read the report, watch the footage. What, exactly, did he do wrong? You tell us.
He said it was "good racing". In my opinion the chop, whoever does it,whenever, is in no way good. Effective? Yes. Legal? Yes, in these cases. The way things are now? Yes. Good racing? My arse.soapbox

robmlufc

3,927 posts

69 months

[news] 
Monday 23rd April 2012 quote quote all
Sprint Rich said:
He said it was "good racing". In my opinion the chop, whoever does it,whenever, is in no way good. Effective? Yes. Legal? Yes, in these cases. The way things are now? Yes. Good racing? My arse.soapbox
'The chop'? You mean blocking? Its always been good racing.

Hamilton should have been given a penalty IMO.

Use Psychology

11,327 posts

75 months

[news] 
Monday 23rd April 2012 quote quote all
blocking wasn't good racing when it would get you and the driver behind you killed...

robmlufc

3,927 posts

69 months

[news] 
Monday 23rd April 2012 quote quote all
Use Psychology said:
blocking wasn't good racing when it would get you and the driver behind you killed...
That would be driving into someone, not blocking.

Use Psychology

11,327 posts

75 months

[news] 
Monday 23rd April 2012 quote quote all
no, blocking (as in, moving across the track to stop a car coming past you) was frowned upon by most drivers until well into the 1970s I'd say.

AreOut

866 posts

44 months

[news] 
Monday 23rd April 2012 quote quote all
Mr_Thyroid said:
In that situation the following driver removes his foot from the accelerator pedal.
that's right, the same way Vettel defended from Kimi just without swerving across whole width of the track, Kimi let the throttle off and everything was OK, that was actually very very good defense from Vettel and one of his greatest moves that I can remember of, probably decided the winner of the race

Use Psychology said:
no, blocking (as in, moving across the track to stop a car coming past you) was frowned upon by most drivers until well into the 1970s I'd say.


Umm, and how exactly you think drivers should defend then, by throwing bananas on the road? biggrin

DanDC5

8,571 posts

50 months

[news] 
Tuesday 24th April 2012 quote quote all
TheHeretic said:
AreOut said:
I don't know why is that so hard for people to comprehend...
Clearly. Read the report, watch the footage. What, exactly, did he do wrong? You tell us.
I personally can't see any issue with the moves he made to be honest, he didn't weave, he made one move across the track and stuck to the tight inside line and did actually hinder his exit from the next turn. Agree with the stewards 100%, no foul. It was just hard racing, hopefully this sets the precedent for this year and they are actually allowed to race each other rather than health and safety stewards stepping and basically stopping the drivers from daring to race.

Sway

3,411 posts

77 months

[news] 
Tuesday 24th April 2012 quote quote all
AreOut said:
Umm, and how exactly you think drivers should defend then, by throwing bananas on the road? biggrin
By driving their car as quickly as possible?

Not quite sure why we feel that the leading driver must be able to purposefully change their line to defend.

Shirley the leading driver should be driving as quickly as they can. If the following driver is quicker, its down to them to find a passing opportunity.

The effect of this culture is quite large, with drivers playing the defense game losing time each lap they're in the battle. The aero may be different, but doesn't the lead.driver in a NASCAR actually speed up when someone is drafting him?

I went karting at the weekend for a stag. Bloody great dices with the other petrolheads, choosing different lines to try and get ahead of the guy in front, with the guy in front trying everything to eke out as much speed as possible. Completely ruined the race when I caught up to the stag's brother, who can't drive, but spent several laps looking behind him every corner to prevent me coming past....
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