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flyingdutchie

Original Poster:

566 posts

78 months

[news] 
Monday 4th June 2012 quote quote all
I have been offered an amount of 5000 euro's to take out my current mbe ecu and wiring and to put a new ecu in with a new engine loom. This is for my ls engined cerbera. Enginemapping and everything included.

Is there a way to do this for a lot less? I do not want a budget solution with bad cold starts and non functioning lamdafunctions.


Alexdaredevilz

5,173 posts

63 months

[news] 
Monday 4th June 2012 quote quote all
I was always under the impression the stock LS Ecu was fully mappable?

I'm sure the GM harness will be hard to beat, so I'd leave that if it were me,

Might be worth spending a few hours with a guy who has rolling road with the right software Before changing it

7 TVR

2,407 posts

52 months

[news] 
Tuesday 5th June 2012 quote quote all
Mr Dutchie please give Warren at Topcats a call as i have mentioned your plight to him!
You could also speak to Paul at Wortec who set mine and many others up!
The standard GM ECU is very capable fully mappable and intelligent to boot, takes into account temps etc
You sound like you have been given the run around! PM me to tell me what happened with the original installer's duty to finish what you paid for!!

Ken Barlow

86 posts

49 months

[news] 
Tuesday 5th June 2012 quote quote all
Has Steve Heath stopped trading, does that mean they is no support for the cars they converted think he was doing 1 a month at some stage

since they have there own clutch and ecu setup they will not be very easy cars to sell on

.

flyingdutchie

Original Poster:

566 posts

78 months

[news] 
Tuesday 5th June 2012 quote quote all
I see different offerings of wiring looms and gm ecu's on ebay.com.

What is the opinion of this kit? Suitable for installation in the Cerb? I have also asked the tuner for a opinion.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/200518132935?item=20051813...

The offered 5K euro's is a lot of money. Really a lot. It scared me, but a system like the KMS sets you back almost 1K already. It is stil in the box then.
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Blair357ci

1,084 posts

92 months

[news] 
Tuesday 5th June 2012 quote quote all
Nothing will plug in off the shelf even a GM aftermarket loom. As said before you should prob consider Emerald or a GM ECU speak to tinker for prices inc dyno set up.

eff eff

463 posts

88 months

[news] 
Wednesday 6th June 2012 quote quote all


If you know your engine spec GM run kits cost around 1000 Euros............ you get the lot loom, relays, ECU pedal and it's plug and play ......it worked in my Griff

Edited by eff eff on Wednesday 6th June 16:27

flyingdutchie

Original Poster:

566 posts

78 months

[news] 
Wednesday 6th June 2012 quote quote all
Did you do this yourself? How did you connect the fans and the A/C? What wires were needed to connect with the car's electronics?

eff eff

463 posts

88 months

[news] 
Wednesday 6th June 2012 quote quote all


Arjen, you have e mail

7erbera

351 posts

81 months

[news] 
Thursday 7th June 2012 quote quote all
Dont forget the different ECU requirements for the the different LS engines.

I think flyingdutchie has an LS1 so will use the 24x crankshaft reluctor wheel, all the GM kits that I have come across are for the Gen4 (x54 reluctor) so will not be compatible, only LS2/LS3/LS7 etc.

I don't think it is an easy fix to convert the car to a modern GM ecu though this would be the best overal system, I think the Emerald ECU might be a quicker solution bearing in mind that you want as few changes as possible.

spitfire4v8

1,838 posts

65 months

[news] 
Thursday 7th June 2012 quote quote all
I suggested the KMS system to Arjem because he's in Holland and they're a Dutch company.
The SH install uses a TVR AJP flywheel in effect with a bosch 60-2 trigger pattern on the back so going straight for a GM ecu might do it if it's a 60-2 pattern version. You've also got to find someone in Holland who will get involved with mapping the GM ecu. Who will hold their hand up and sort out any issues if it doesn't work though?
If he goes to KMS they can do everything, make loom, fit, map, test etc. Given his location (no language barrier on technical conversations, no long distance/ferry ride to UK etc) it sounded by far the best bet for me.
What is 5kEuro in UKP exactly? Yes it sounds expensive but surely if the original install never really worked properly then a contribution from the original installer might be in order?

900T-R

19,362 posts

141 months

[news] 
Thursday 7th June 2012 quote quote all
spitfire4v8 said:
What is 5kEuro in UKP exactly?
4K at present, a bit more until recently due to the ongoing Euro-crisis...

flyingdutchie

Original Poster:

566 posts

78 months

[news] 
Thursday 7th June 2012 quote quote all
I want to do my changes to the conversion step by step I think. The reluctorwheel is the 58X. Does this mean that when a new loom and ecu are installed, I cannot change flywheel/gearbox afterwards without retune?

Walford

1,571 posts

50 months

[news] 
Thursday 7th June 2012 quote quote all
The reluctor is on the crank shaft
the colour of the pickup sensor, next to the starter, will normaly tell you how which wheel you have


eff eff

463 posts

88 months

[news] 
Thursday 7th June 2012 quote quote all
The crankshaft sensing function of the distributorless ignition system depends on reading the toothed reluctor wheel on the crankshaft. Early LS engines mostly used 24-tooth wheels and upgraded a few years ago to 58-tooth (also known as 58X) wheels. When building an LS engine, it is imperative the correct reluctor wheel is used with the compatible crankshaft position sensor and ignition controller.

Read more: http://www.gmhightechperformance.com/tech/0901gmht...

If you've got a 58x engine it should work with the GM run kit, but you could also have a look at www.speartech.com they have a range of off-the-shelf ECU and looms (or harnesses as they call them) for 24x and 58x engines, they will also make specific custom packages and they are not that expensive. I don't think the reluctor has any impact on the flywheel and gearbox.

Edited by eff eff on Thursday 7th June 18:02

flyingdutchie

Original Poster:

566 posts

78 months

[news] 
Thursday 7th June 2012 quote quote all
The KMS was also suggested by my tuner. He also said a universal loom wouldn't do it for the cerbera. I my simple thinking I thought that a GM loom would fit directly on the engine and the ecu. Probably some other connectors for the fans etc. If the ecu is already preprogrammed for the engine spec, wouldn't that save a lot of time? You're right that optimizing the mapping on the rolling road wil require him to get used to working with the GM ecu. He is familiar with the KMS systems. It is just that i want to prevent that things are going to be reinvented. I visited a corvette workshop this week and they do a lot of business with www.hotrodlane.cc. If he gives them the engine spec, he gets a loom and a ecu and it is plug and play he says. He puts ls1 engines in 70's corvette's.

Walford

1,571 posts

50 months

[news] 
Thursday 7th June 2012 quote quote all
eff eff said:
I don't think the reluctor has any impact on the flywheel and gearbox.
Look at d picture the reluctor is on the crank
these engines are run every day on engine dyno,s with no g,box on them

tinker-27

830 posts

108 months

[news] 
Thursday 7th June 2012 quote quote all
5000 euros is to much , most Gm run kits run FBY throttles which are not every body's choice , I would go emerald , they work and are simple and most Dyno people csn tune them . They are the most cost effective way ahead and very flexible , yours will probably have a 60-2 trigger wheel which most ecus will run with or without cam sensor , look behind the starter and if it's a grey sensor it's 58 and black is 24 .

tinker-27

830 posts

108 months

[news] 
Thursday 7th June 2012 quote quote all
Are you running cats ?

flyingdutchie

Original Poster:

566 posts

78 months

[news] 
Thursday 7th June 2012 quote quote all
Yes! I am running cats. I need a proper lambdasetting. What I've learned is that a lot converters (I think) just run on the mapping in the UK. They settle for a "bad" cold start, when not using IACV in combination with a cablethrottlebody. I feel myself a complete jurk when my engine stalls 3 times before I have left the block. At the dutch MoT you need to have 0.5% CO max at idle. Between 2500-3200rpm max CO is 0.3%. Furthermore the lamdavalue needs to be between 0.97 and 1.03 at the rpm level 2500-3200rpm's. Overhere there are no friendly MoT testers. It needs to meet these requirements. An engine like mine is vey mild and should idle dead smooth at 600-700rpm's cold or hot. I've already bought the IACV and the connector, but it hasn't been fitted yet.

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