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carreauchompeur
10,611 posts
73 months
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Unless I've missed it, roughly how much money are we talking about?
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Breadvan72
10,227 posts
32 months
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That is a short relationship, so legal intent may be more readily inferred.
Text messages might be relevant evidence. What do they say?
The fact that your ex cheated on you is completely irrelevant to her financial claim. In which universe could that possibly be relevant to whether or not she lent you money?
You should negotiate. Offer an instalment plan if you wish. Court proceedings can continue unless and until a judgement is given or you reach a binding agreement.
An offer to pay made to the court will be taken as an admission of liability. Settlement negotiations are best conducted otherwise than through the court. Make it clear that any offer to compromise is made without prejudice and cannot be referred to in court.
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hillbob
Original Poster
68 posts
72 months
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Someone mentioned about whether I had cheated? Which is a no but she admitted to.and somebody off here said maybe she gave you money as to try and rid her of the guilt of cheating.(This is not what I am thinking by the way).some good advice at last, so thanks ladies and gents.
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Du1point8
14,289 posts
61 months
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One query I do have... who brought up the lack of your money, her or you?
her = more likely gift.
you = you hinting that you want money and no gift.
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hillbob
Original Poster
68 posts
72 months
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Well I never asked for it and always said no when offered to send me some.at times she maybe said how come your not going here or doing that,my response I can't I'm skint,her response I'll give/send you some. I'm not trying to avoid paying at all. Just not a clue on the legal side of things and the procedures and follow up to the claim form. As if I fill it in with an offer and she then refuses this offer and still takes me to court, well that's just hassle/expense nobody wants
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mykhunt
6,419 posts
23 months
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hillbob said: Well I never asked for it and always said no when offered to send me some.at times she maybe said how come your not going here or doing that,my response I can't I'm skint,her response I'll give/send you some. I'm not trying to avoid paying at all. Just not a clue on the legal side of things and the procedures and follow up to the claim form. As if I fill it in with an offer and she then refuses this offer and still takes me to court, well that's just hassle/expense nobody wants So if you never wanted it then why did you keep the money?
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Du1point8
14,289 posts
61 months
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hillbob said: Well I never asked for it and always said no when offered to send me some.at times she maybe said how come your not going here or doing that,my response I can't I'm skint,her response I'll give/send you some. I'm not trying to avoid paying at all. Just not a clue on the legal side of things and the procedures and follow up to the claim form. As if I fill it in with an offer and she then refuses this offer and still takes me to court, well that's just hassle/expense nobody wants Still you didnt send the money back though and always kept it. You are still contradicting yourself here... 'Im not trying to avoid paying at all' then 'if I offer and she rejects, then that's just hassle/expense I dont want'... As said, you ignored the claim and your Ex for a period of time long enough for it to get this far, you are not telling the whole story, just a twisted end part of yes, but, no, but yes, but no... Saying you are away for weeks on end with work doesnt sway, unless you are mining underground for all that time a phone and PC do work... if my father can contact my mother from the middle of a jungle at least once a week whilst away, you really cant claim 'oh I couldn't talk as a defence'... So far you have for you: 1) you didnt ask for it. 2) you told her you didnt want it. 3) Most things in a relationship are a gift unless specified. Against you... 1) You type like its not a gift. 2) You mention you want to pay, but dont want to be fleeced.... all the time in your replies. 3) you never gave the 'gifts' back despite not wanting them. 4) its from a business account. 5) you have ignored/not talked it through despite Ex taking time to contact you, which could and probably will look bad on you. Unknowns: 1) was it ever declared anywhere else that is want not a gift (discussion, email, etc)? 2) Do you want to pay her, or is that guilt setting in, either you do or you don't, its not a 2 way street. 3) The claim form is simple... Why do you not think anything is owed... its not an exam, its a simple reply. From the looks of it, its you not wanting to talk and sticking 2 fingers up at Ex... then it going through claims and you now think that something might get found out, maybe I can offer something, maybe they wont find out, what do I do now... you have been advised to fill out the document to the best of your ability, but dont lie on the form as it can get found out, from the way you type there is something else.
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Breadvan72
10,227 posts
32 months
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I suggest that your defence might be along these lines, but NB you have to verify this, so only say to the court what is true.
1. I do not accept that I am liable for the sum claimed by the Claimant, or for any sum.
2. The Claimant gave me various amounts whilst we were together in an intimate relationship. All sums were offered by the Claimant, and were made and received as gifts, without any conditions attached thereto.
3. I did not at any time have any intention to enter into legal relations with the Claimant, and I at no time agreed that any sum provided by her was a loan.
Separately, if you wish, make a without prejudice offer to pay all or part of the sum claimed. Specify that the offer is not an admission of liability and cannot be referred to in court.
NEGOTIATE!
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Jasandjules
45,410 posts
98 months
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4. The Claimant is put to strict proof
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Breadvan72
10,227 posts
32 months
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You can add that if you like, but it doesn't seem to me to add anything to the previous paragraphs. The Claimant has to prove her case anyway, absent any relevant admissions. Saying that she must prove it only states the obvious. In legal drafting, less is more.
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Caulkhead
4,938 posts
26 months
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hillbob said: Apologies if I miss answering any questions. Doing all this via phone internet. Was together about a year. First transaction 1-2 months after we met and then pretty much most months thereafter. Was a regular thing.would text messages prove anything in a case like this? Or if she had admitted cheating? I have no problem paying the money back, as it was a very nice thing of her to do, so apologies if anyone has got that impression I didn't want to.and people will now say why post then, well I posted because I know nothing of the legal side, so wasn't sure if I filled in the claim form agreeing to pay a set amount per month, is she then able to carry on to court? The court won't make you pay back any more than she gave you unless she claims interest. If you admit the debt and are happy to pay it back as you say on here, you don't need to worry about the 'legal' side of it.
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sugerbear
502 posts
27 months
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She is suffering post relationship breakup regret syndrome. Legally I don't believe you owe her anything.
In a way you may have taught her a very important lesson in life. If your ex did post the same question on here pointing out her predictment she would quickly be labelled a dimwit and advised never to lend people money (unless you don't mind never seeing the money again).
Morally you should pay back the money, but legally it doesn't sound like she has much chance of forcing you to.
Do you really want to be known as someone who lives of the earnings of a women? (often referred to as a ponce from my neighbourhood) ;-)
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MadMark911
1,358 posts
18 months
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If you don't have the funds to pay the legal costs, you might be better to make her a "without prejudice" offer of £50 per month or something like that.
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carreauchompeur
10,611 posts
73 months
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Seriously, how much money are we talking? This could have a distinct impact on advice tendered!
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Devil2575
4,427 posts
57 months
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mykhunt said: It is a forum, people can say what they want, if you don't like it...
... tough. This is true. However what people say is a very good way to get a measure of them. It would appear that many on here are wanting in the manners/social skills department.
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mykhunt
6,419 posts
23 months
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Devil2575 said: This is true. However what people say is a very good way to get a measure of them.
It would appear that many on here are wanting in the manners/social skills department. Indeed, but he should not be dictating what is said otherwise why ask anything.
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5678
5,018 posts
96 months
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sugerbear said: She is suffering post relationship breakup regret syndrome. Legally I don't believe you owe her anything.
In a way you may have taught her a very important lesson in life. If your ex did post the same question on here pointing out her predictment she would quickly be labelled a dimwit and advised never to lend people money (unless you don't mind never seeing the money again).
Morally you should pay back the money, but legally it doesn't sound like she has much chance of forcing you to.
Do you really want to be known as someone who lives of the earnings of a women? (often referred to as a ponce from my neighbourhood) ;-) I almost agree... It sounds like she's a bit bitter post split and now begrudges the money she gave you. Perhaps I have some wayward morals, but if someone gave me money because I was skint (in your relationship scenario) then I don't think I'd feel obliged to pay it back at this point. Legally, I have no clue. Sounds like breadvan and Jasand Jules have it covered though.
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k99
243 posts
37 months
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k99 said: Can we clear up things as I think they would make the legal and moral aspects much clearer
1) how much money did she give you and how wealthy is she?
(this is important as a millionaire giving you £10000 as a gift would be different someone of much lesser means doing the same)
2) under what circumstances did you break up?
(important from a moral point of view if for instance you cheated on her, dumped her but want to keep the money she leant you)
3) you said the money came from her business account?
Not something I would do as a gift if it was MY business, these gifts would have to be accounted for in the end of year company accounts. Large gifts from a business could be construed as attempting to avoid paying Corporation Tax on the profits. So if true would make me think they weren't gifts? You still haven't answered questions 1 and 3 - which I think have a direct bearing on what you are asking and the answers your given. Failure to answer wpuld make me suspect there's a lot more to this saga.
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Devil2575
4,427 posts
57 months
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sugerbear said: Do you really want to be known as someone who lives of the earnings of a women? (often referred to as a ponce from my neighbourhood) ;-) What century are you from? Nothing wrong with accepting financial assistance from someone you are in a relationship with. It's not the 1950s...
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Breadvan72
10,227 posts
32 months
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True, but the general social and cultural attitudes displayed on PH put us somewhere in the 1850s, regrettably.
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