Mystery anti-tamper screw

[fluffnik]

I have these M5 countersunk screws with 3 flats but nothing to drive them.



Does anyone know what they're called so I can buy an appropriate driver/bit?

[dblack1]

you could probably use a gator socket... Do you know what I am talking about?
https://www.google.com/search?q=gator+socket&i...fficial&client=firefox-a#q=gator+socket&rls=org.mozilla:en-USfficial&tbm=shop

I mean, it's not ideal, but it is still a functioning solution... You could also grind off the round sides and turn it into a normal 6 side socket...

Edit:
Did you say countersunk? sounds like somebody ground the head off and ground it flat... I believe the appropriate socket in that case is called a drill bit.

Edited by dblack1 on Saturday 19th October 05:45

[fluffnik]

dblack1 said:

Did you say countersunk?

Yup, and brand new.

They came with an entry phone panel and I'd like to fit them rather than the tamper friendly ones holding it meantime.

Gator sockets sound fun though...

[dudleybloke]

im pretty sure iv seen these fixings on some payphones.

[fluffnik]

dudleybloke said:

im pretty sure iv seen these fixings on some payphones.

I've seen them before but none of the Google searches I've tried have delivered joy.

[SpaceGhost]

I reckon it's a similar idea to the screws used to mount ignition switches. Screwed in with an ordinary bolt head, then when the bolt reaches the appropriate torque, the head snaps off and leaves the fixing permanantly installed. Kind of any anti-theft thing but easily removed if you know how.

[dudleybloke]

have you tried using 3 flat blade screwdrivers held together with an elastic band?
or get a cheap socket of similar size and grind to suit.

[fluffnik]

SpaceGhost said:

I reckon it's a similar idea to the screws used to mount ignition switches. Screwed in with an ordinary bolt head, then when the bolt reaches the appropriate torque, the head snaps off and leaves the fixing permanantly installed. Kind of any anti-theft thing but easily removed if you know how.

I know the thing you speak of, but, nope...

Mine are brand new and look like this in profile:



I want to put them IN to replace the tamper-friendly ones currently fitted but with the option of subsequent removal by me for maintenance...

....so, I'd like to buy the proper tool.

buying screws with heads I already have bits for is probably the sensible thing, but, y'know...

[Evoluzione]

Have you got the old ones out?

[Jimmyarm]

If they are new, where did you get them from and what are they called ?

ETA, knew I had seen that shape before, they are the same shape as the bolts on some bosch diesel pumps I believe. However them being counter sunk like that would really limit the amount of torque you could put on them.

http://www.metalnerd.com/cat05.htm

MN3001

They are probably a completely different head size though. Looking at them, are you sure they aren't designed to act as a stud with a nut screwed on the other end rather than screws ?

It would probably be a lot easier just to pick from the vast array of 'common' tamper proof screws available, lets face it if someone wants to get them off then having the right socket isn't going to be stopping them

Edited by Jimmyarm on Sunday 20th October 12:17

Edited by Jimmyarm on Sunday 20th October 12:25

[Evoluzione]

Jimmyarm said:

If they are new, where did you get them from and what are they called ?

ETA, knew I had seen that shape before, they are the same shape as the bolts on some bosch diesel pumps I believe. However them being counter sunk like that would really limit the amount of torque you could put on them.

http://www.metalnerd.com/cat05.htm

MN3001

Edited by Jimmyarm on Sunday 20th October 12:17

If they are C/S in flush I can't see how that would get hold of them, you need some kind of 3 pronged tool.

[SkinnyBoy]

Jimmyarm said:

They are probably a completely different head size though. Looking at them, are you sure they aren't designed to act as a stud with a nut screwed on the other end rather than screws ?

That' was my first thought. There are so many other suitable tamper proof fittings out there.

[Jimmyarm]

Evoluzione said:

If they are C/S in flush I can't see how that would get hold of them, you need some kind of 3 pronged tool.

The more I look at them, the more I think they are tamperproof studs rather than screws/bolts. The flat surface is on the outside of your lockable box nice recessed into it so no real purchase can be got on them and on the inside is a normal hex nut holding it together which can only be accessed with a key opening the door to said box ?

[Evoluzione]

Jimmyarm said:

The more I look at them, the more I think they are tamperproof studs rather than screws/bolts. The flat surface is on the outside of your lockable box nice recessed into it so no real purchase can be got on them and on the inside is a normal hex nut holding it together which can only be accessed with a key opening the door to said box ?

That makes a lot of sense to me, but then why the flats?
Needs more input from the OP. I would be either calling these guys up:
http://www.securitysafetyproducts.co.uk/security/s... For help,

Or putting a different kind of screw in (if indeed you can get the old ones out).

[fluffnik]

Evoluzione said:

Have you got the old ones out?

They were supplied with a brand new Amplyvox door entry panel, but they won't be answering their mail 'til Monday...



I'm currently using some M5 setscrews I had kicking about and could no doubt source some more standard countersunk anti-tamper screws to fit the 'ole above more easily than the required tool but curiosity has kicked in now.

[fluffnik]

Evoluzione said:

If they are C/S in flush I can't see how that would get hold of them, you need some kind of 3 pronged tool.

That's my conclusion too.

<googles 3 pronged tool>

Nope, just gardening and knitting. Much less scary than I feared!

[paintman]

Could they be the 'armature plate security screws' referred to in this link under 'Ancillary items'?
If so, looks like the 'screwdriver bit' which is a bit higher up the page is £28.10
And the screws themselves are a min order of 10 at £30.68
You may need to zoom in for a better look but they look just like your pics.
http://www.amplyvox.co.uk/pdf/Catalogue-Price-List...

Edited by paintman on Sunday 20th October 17:49

[fluffnik]

paintman said:

Could they be the 'armature plate security screws' referred to in this link under 'Ancillary items'?
If so, looks like the 'screwdriver bit' which is a bit higher up the page is £28.10
And the screws themselves are a min order of 10 at £30.68
You may need to zoom in for a better look but they look just like your pics.
http://www.amplyvox.co.uk/pdf/Catalogue-Price-List...

That's them!

I got a 404 on that file on Friday.

[Locknut]

fluffnik said:

I got a 404 on that file on Friday.

It opened for me. It's an 18 page PDF file so it's a bit slow. Try it again.

[shoehorn]

Evoluzione said:

That makes a lot of sense to me, but then why the flats?

To stop them spinning.