Best Smoker Barges 1-5 large [Vol 7]
Discussion
Zwolf said:
SpeckledJim said:
E65Ross said:
Zwolf said:
In other news, I bought a new barge this weekend past, picking it up on Saturday all being well. A little outside thread budget, but 18 months-2 years ago it would have been within its remit...
Do tell! You can't leave it at that 
RenesisEvo said:
Zwolf said:
SpeckledJim said:
E65Ross said:
Zwolf said:
In other news, I bought a new barge this weekend past, picking it up on Saturday all being well. A little outside thread budget, but 18 months-2 years ago it would have been within its remit...
Do tell! You can't leave it at that Is that dealer prices though? You could double what I've spent on mine if I let a dealer near it and didn't source my own bits.
The trick would be finding one that's had some major love by the previous, enthusiast owner. The trouble is, that type of owner will want to see a good return for their efforts so are unlikely to sell.
The trick would be finding one that's had some major love by the previous, enthusiast owner. The trouble is, that type of owner will want to see a good return for their efforts so are unlikely to sell.
Edited by Patrick Bateman on Monday 20th October 21:00
Patrick Bateman said:
Is that dealer prices though? You could double what I've spent on mine if I let a dealer near it and didn't source my own bits.
The work done on the car has been documented elsewhere on the forum (can't find it right now), but very little of it is main dealer - it's been at specialists for the most part, including CPC. Lots of invoices for parts sourced independently (in fact as I mentioned to Ross, I need a new folder for the service history!). It's all common stuff for the E39, but it all adds up very, very quickly. To summarise: discs/pads and tyres all round, sump and rocker gaskets, diff seals, many suspension bushes, steering bar, gearbox fluid, interior refresh/repair (e.g. auto-dimming mirror, gearknob, steering wheel, pixel repair), Insp. II, wheel refurb, paint correction detail. The list goes on. And that's to say nothing of what I've spent thus far. The car was truly a credit to its previous owner, I just wish I could match his stomach for large bills.In my estimation maybe £3k or more is required to make it perfect, that should place it among the better examples out there - only its mileage will stop it ever being of serious value. But if I'd bought a low mileage one, a) I'd never drive it anywhere and b) there's no guarantee it won't need all that work/money. A fellow owner has suffered the misfortune of a failed clutch - replacement incl. flywheel will be around £2.5k. These cars are fine examples of the difference between purchase price and running costs - another acquaintance claims to be spending less keeping a 996 Turbo going than his old M5. But when all is sorted, and you do go for a drive... it's worth it
Edited by RenesisEvo on Monday 20th October 21:41
This is very true. If you want a 15 year old high performance car with some serious use under its belt to run and handle and ride genuinely as well as it should, you have to be prepared to do all this kind of stuff. If you can't or don't want to do it at home, then that means paying someone competent with the correct facilities, tools and experience.
Derin100 gets this and does it properly. A lot of people prefer to use 'em up rather than keep them spot on or restore them. Instead they pass 'em on in gradually deteriorating condition until eventually they go to the scrapper.
That's fine of course: it's the normal life and times of the used car, and if you paid for it you can treat it how you want. And if you just want to waft around in fairly gently something cheap and shiny it doesn't necessarily need to be as good as it was when it was young and vigorous.
Derin100 gets this and does it properly. A lot of people prefer to use 'em up rather than keep them spot on or restore them. Instead they pass 'em on in gradually deteriorating condition until eventually they go to the scrapper.
That's fine of course: it's the normal life and times of the used car, and if you paid for it you can treat it how you want. And if you just want to waft around in fairly gently something cheap and shiny it doesn't necessarily need to be as good as it was when it was young and vigorous.
RenesisEvo said:
The work done on the car has been documented elsewhere on the forum (can't find it right now), but very little of it is main dealer - it's been at specialists for the most part, including CPC. Lots of invoices for parts sourced independently (in fact as I mentioned to Ross, I need a new folder for the service history!). It's all common stuff for the E39, but it all adds up very, very quickly. To summarise: discs/pads and tyres all round, sump and rocker gaskets, diff seals, many suspension bushes, steering bar, interior refresh/repair (e.g. auto-dimming mirror, gearknob, steering wheel, pixel repair), Insp. II, wheel refurb, paint correction detail. The list goes on. And that's to say nothing of what I've spent thus far. The car was truly a credit to its previous owner, I just wish I could match his stomach for large bills.
In my estimation maybe £3k or more is required to make it perfect, that should place it among the better examples out there - only its mileage will stop it ever being of serious value. But if I'd bought a low mileage one, a) I'd never drive it anywhere and b) there's no guarantee it won't need all that work/money. A fellow owner has suffered the misfortune of a failed clutch - replacement incl. flywheel will be around £2.5k. These cars are fine examples of the difference between purchase price and running costs - another acquaintance claims to be spending less keeping a 996 Turbo going than his old M5. But when all is sorted, and you do go for a drive... it's worth it
You're preaching to the converted here, however, figures like this massively misrepresent the sort of expenses you can expect to the point that I'm unsure if it's a typo? I'd hate to see any potential buyers completely put off.In my estimation maybe £3k or more is required to make it perfect, that should place it among the better examples out there - only its mileage will stop it ever being of serious value. But if I'd bought a low mileage one, a) I'd never drive it anywhere and b) there's no guarantee it won't need all that work/money. A fellow owner has suffered the misfortune of a failed clutch - replacement incl. flywheel will be around £2.5k. These cars are fine examples of the difference between purchase price and running costs - another acquaintance claims to be spending less keeping a 996 Turbo going than his old M5. But when all is sorted, and you do go for a drive... it's worth it
I'm no stranger to expenditure but where does that figure come from for a new clutch and flywheel? You can pick up a Sachs/LUK clutch and flywheel for a combined ~£430 via. ECP or Carparts4less. I'm somewhat fortunate in that the mechanic I have is extremely reasonable and lets me source my parts but even if that wasn't the case you'd need sectioned if you were willing to pay £2.5k for a clutch and flywheel change.
Even some of the more specialist jobs aren't that bad, replacement VANOS bank at CPC? £900.
It's not cheap, no, far from it, but it's not a Ferrari.
harry kular said:
A well sorted e39 m5 is a lovely, lovely thing. Probably the best car BMW have made.
The gearshift quality always frustrated me though- never kept it long enough to try and rectify it...
I'm playing devil's advocate here.... But for what the M5 is all about, is the E39 better than an F10? The F10 rides very well indeed, has a nice interior, is more quiet, more efficient, has more perfor and a gearbox very fitting for the type of car it is; they also look rather nice. The gearshift quality always frustrated me though- never kept it long enough to try and rectify it...
Only potential let down is the lack of engine noise.... But I can't see what the E39 does better than the F10?
E65Ross said:
harry kular said:
A well sorted e39 m5 is a lovely, lovely thing. Probably the best car BMW have made.
The gearshift quality always frustrated me though- never kept it long enough to try and rectify it...
I'm playing devil's advocate here.... But for what the M5 is all about, is the E39 better than an F10? The F10 rides very well indeed, has a nice interior, is more quiet, more efficient, has more perfor and a gearbox very fitting for the type of car it is; they also look rather nice. The gearshift quality always frustrated me though- never kept it long enough to try and rectify it...
Only potential let down is the lack of engine noise.... But I can't see what the E39 does better than the F10?
Objectively the F10 might be better, but it's not 10 times better.
So, relatively, it's worse!
(barge thread, barge philosophy!)
(and it looks MILES better)
r129sl said:
I'd love to sell 124s like these guys sell 123s: http://www.mercedesmotoring.com.
There's some bloomin' nice stuff on there. One to bookmark, just for the sake of looking.So, to keep the run flats or get rid from my mini barge? I don't find the ride on the run flats too bad on my SE suspension, even though the profiles are 45 and 40 respectively but the ride could definitely be improved.
I still can't work out why BMW deem it necessary to fit 255/40 R17s to a car with 218bhp and not that much torque. The m-sport wheels do look sexy though.
I still can't work out why BMW deem it necessary to fit 255/40 R17s to a car with 218bhp and not that much torque. The m-sport wheels do look sexy though.
SpeckledJim said:
E65Ross said:
harry kular said:
A well sorted e39 m5 is a lovely, lovely thing. Probably the best car BMW have made.
The gearshift quality always frustrated me though- never kept it long enough to try and rectify it...
I'm playing devil's advocate here.... But for what the M5 is all about, is the E39 better than an F10? The F10 rides very well indeed, has a nice interior, is more quiet, more efficient, has more perfor and a gearbox very fitting for the type of car it is; they also look rather nice. The gearshift quality always frustrated me though- never kept it long enough to try and rectify it...
Only potential let down is the lack of engine noise.... But I can't see what the E39 does better than the F10?
Objectively the F10 might be better, but it's not 10 times better.
So, relatively, it's worse!
(barge thread, barge philosophy!)
(and it looks MILES better)
I've only sampled the power plant from the current generation in M6 guise and whilst it was undeniably quick there was no sense of occasion about it at all. Ostensibly the similar looking 640d did almost all the same tricks. Aurally the M car didn't tick the boxes either, even with its sound generator device I assume.
Having had an E34 M5 and driven numerous E39's I may be biased but these are cars very definitely of a different era in BMW history and all the better for it. The E60 had a quite stupendous engine, perhaps one of the best production V10's, but it too lost some of what makes a proper M5. All IMHO of course.
Anyway, the days of the decent £5k E39 M5 may be past but they still offer one of the best super-saloon experiences you can get for the budget of mere mortals.
To paraphrase - "Hurry, limited stocks available!"
E65Ross said:
I'm playing devil's advocate here.... But for what the M5 is all about, is the E39 better than an F10? The F10 rides very well indeed, has a nice interior, is more quiet, more efficient, has more perfor and a gearbox very fitting for the type of car it is; they also look rather nice.
Only potential let down is the lack of engine noise.... But I can't see what the E39 does better than the F10?
It's got a proper gearbox, is smaller than an aircraft carrier, weighs less than a black hole (a full250kg less than the F10 M5), has better throttle response and (if properly invested in) is much more likely to be serviceable in 15 years' time. Also, while the F10 is less hideous than the E60 to look at, it is still ugly in comparison to the E39. Everything is overscale and clunky and chunky in the modern idiom.Only potential let down is the lack of engine noise.... But I can't see what the E39 does better than the F10?
Those are the first few things that spring to mind.
Also, you might as well set fire to a huge bundle of cash as buy an F10 whereas the E39 is past the bottom of the depreciation curve. In 10 years' time the E39 will be worth more than an F10, in 20 years' time an E39 wil be worth 10x as much as an F10.
Edited by Lowtimer on Tuesday 21st October 06:43
Edited by Lowtimer on Tuesday 21st October 07:22
Hoddo said:
RenesisEvo said:
Sterillium said:
Oooh I say I do like that. Absurdly good value for money. 110k miles in that is a fair chunk of fuel.
SpeckledJim said:
E65Ross said:
harry kular said:
A well sorted e39 m5 is a lovely, lovely thing. Probably the best car BMW have made.
The gearshift quality always frustrated me though- never kept it long enough to try and rectify it...
I'm playing devil's advocate here.... But for what the M5 is all about, is the E39 better than an F10? The F10 rides very well indeed, has a nice interior, is more quiet, more efficient, has more perfor and a gearbox very fitting for the type of car it is; they also look rather nice. The gearshift quality always frustrated me though- never kept it long enough to try and rectify it...
Only potential let down is the lack of engine noise.... But I can't see what the E39 does better than the F10?
Objectively the F10 might be better, but it's not 10 times better.
So, relatively, it's worse!
(barge thread, barge philosophy!)
(and it looks MILES better)
Patrick Bateman said:
You're preaching to the converted here, however, figures like this massively misrepresent the sort of expenses you can expect to the point that I'm unsure if it's a typo? I'd hate to see any potential buyers completely put off.
I'm no stranger to expenditure but where does that figure come from for a new clutch and flywheel? You can pick up a Sachs/LUK clutch and flywheel for a combined ~£430 via. ECP or Carparts4less. I'm somewhat fortunate in that the mechanic I have is extremely reasonable and lets me source my parts but even if that wasn't the case you'd need sectioned if you were willing to pay £2.5k for a clutch and flywheel change.
The source is someone I trust not to make up figures, and an E39 fan (also runs a 525d touring). He mentioned the flywheel was coming from Germany so I suspect genuine BMW parts could be a factor. The final bill (or part) haven't arrived so I don't know if that was just an estimate.I'm no stranger to expenditure but where does that figure come from for a new clutch and flywheel? You can pick up a Sachs/LUK clutch and flywheel for a combined ~£430 via. ECP or Carparts4less. I'm somewhat fortunate in that the mechanic I have is extremely reasonable and lets me source my parts but even if that wasn't the case you'd need sectioned if you were willing to pay £2.5k for a clutch and flywheel change.
I too have experienced (briefly) an F13 M6 and agree with the comments about the lack of character of the power unit. It is true the gearshift quality is not stellar on the E39, with a long throw that doesn't like to be rushed, but the depth and breadth of torque means you don't need to frantically work the gears so it's not a big issue.
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