Exceeding track limits after the red flag…
Discussion
Whilst the driver investigates the situation he wants to remain anonymous. So here we go..
At a meet this weekend during a 14 lap race the following happened.
Driver ‘A’ led the race from laps 1-10 followed by driver ‘B’ in 2nd place, on lap 11 driver ‘B’ overtakes ‘A’ however during that lap driver ‘B’ exceeds track limits.
In a separate incident a driver crashes and the MSA throw a red flag, given the spent duration the MSA end the race and revert to the previous lap for finishing, normal….. however driver ‘B’ gets a 5sec time penalty for exceeding track limits in lap 11 now placing him P7
So the question is, If the MSA discount lap 11 and revert to lap 10 as the last lap for the finishing positions in that race can/should the MSA penalise driver ‘B’ for exceeding track limits in lap 11 that now doesn’t count, shouldn’t he be classified in P2 which was his place on lap 10 which is now the last recognised lap of the race..
Your thoughts?
At a meet this weekend during a 14 lap race the following happened.
Driver ‘A’ led the race from laps 1-10 followed by driver ‘B’ in 2nd place, on lap 11 driver ‘B’ overtakes ‘A’ however during that lap driver ‘B’ exceeds track limits.
In a separate incident a driver crashes and the MSA throw a red flag, given the spent duration the MSA end the race and revert to the previous lap for finishing, normal….. however driver ‘B’ gets a 5sec time penalty for exceeding track limits in lap 11 now placing him P7
So the question is, If the MSA discount lap 11 and revert to lap 10 as the last lap for the finishing positions in that race can/should the MSA penalise driver ‘B’ for exceeding track limits in lap 11 that now doesn’t count, shouldn’t he be classified in P2 which was his place on lap 10 which is now the last recognised lap of the race..
Your thoughts?
Lap 11 doesn't count - protest to the MSA.
Firstly they should of had a get out of jail free excursion.
Second report : Black & white warning flag
Next report: Five-second time penalty
So they would have had to have done it 3 times ?
I would have protested it initially at the meeting - although you can't protest a track excursion as it's a judgement of fact but you can take it to the MSA and protest it there.
A lot of the time COCs do not follow the correct procedures and therefore they should be challenged
Firstly they should of had a get out of jail free excursion.
Second report : Black & white warning flag
Next report: Five-second time penalty
So they would have had to have done it 3 times ?
I would have protested it initially at the meeting - although you can't protest a track excursion as it's a judgement of fact but you can take it to the MSA and protest it there.
A lot of the time COCs do not follow the correct procedures and therefore they should be challenged
As Woof says, protest this.
In the Blue Book Q5.4.3 "...the result will be based on the order of crossing the finish line at one lap less than at the time of the first showing of the Red Flag"
So any penalties you are given on the lap when the red flag is shown should not affect the result.
In the Blue Book Q5.4.3 "...the result will be based on the order of crossing the finish line at one lap less than at the time of the first showing of the Red Flag"
So any penalties you are given on the lap when the red flag is shown should not affect the result.
I don't see why it shouldn't count. B broke the rules while the race was active and got a punishment, then the race was red flagged. For obvious reasons the race result is pulled back to lap 10, B's penalty is then given.
The race didn't stop at lap ten, it stopped after B broke the rules and then for obvious safety reasons the result is pulled back, it doesn't mean that lap didn't happen and everything that happened on it should be forgotten. The rules aren't *just* there to stop/punish unfair advantages, there are safety reasons too and to ignore infringement because the race was stopped would be bad for the sport imo.
The rules were broken while the race was active, the fact the result was pulled back is irrelevent imo.
I'd suggest a more constructive question would be for driver B to ask themselves why they had exceeded the track limits three times in just 11 laps.
The race didn't stop at lap ten, it stopped after B broke the rules and then for obvious safety reasons the result is pulled back, it doesn't mean that lap didn't happen and everything that happened on it should be forgotten. The rules aren't *just* there to stop/punish unfair advantages, there are safety reasons too and to ignore infringement because the race was stopped would be bad for the sport imo.
The rules were broken while the race was active, the fact the result was pulled back is irrelevent imo.
I'd suggest a more constructive question would be for driver B to ask themselves why they had exceeded the track limits three times in just 11 laps.
TwoLeadFeet said:
As Woof says, protest this.
In the Blue Book Q5.4.3 "...the result will be based on the order of crossing the finish line at one lap less than at the time of the first showing of the Red Flag"
So any penalties you are given on the lap when the red flag is shown should not affect the result.
I don't agree with your interpretation of that at all. The result has been based upon that, then penalties have then been applied. Just because the result is based upon that does not mean infringement afterwards are forgotten.In the Blue Book Q5.4.3 "...the result will be based on the order of crossing the finish line at one lap less than at the time of the first showing of the Red Flag"
So any penalties you are given on the lap when the red flag is shown should not affect the result.
You get into dangerous ground with your thinking, drivers losing the lead of a race could cause an intentional red flag with a dangerous manouver, knowing that as long as a red flag comes out they will still be listed as winner...
Edited by Forbes82 on Monday 14th April 09:12
Forbes82 said:
You get into dangerous ground with your thinking, drivers losing the lead of a race could cause an intentional red flag with a dangerous manouver, knowing that as long as a red flag comes out they will still be listed as winner...
Only if Flavio is the team manager Edited by Forbes82 on Monday 14th April 09:12
Forbes82 said:
I don't see why it shouldn't count. B broke the rules while the race was active and got a punishment, then the race was red flagged. For obvious reasons the race result is pulled back to lap 10, B's penalty is then given.
The race didn't stop at lap ten, it stopped after B broke the rules and then for obvious safety reasons the result is pulled back, it doesn't mean that lap didn't happen and everything that happened on it should be forgotten. The rules aren't *just* there to stop/punish unfair advantages, there are safety reasons too and to ignore infringement because the race was stopped would be bad for the sport imo.
The rules were broken while the race was active, the fact the result was pulled back is irrelevent imo.
Fair point, that upon reflection I'd agree with...The race didn't stop at lap ten, it stopped after B broke the rules and then for obvious safety reasons the result is pulled back, it doesn't mean that lap didn't happen and everything that happened on it should be forgotten. The rules aren't *just* there to stop/punish unfair advantages, there are safety reasons too and to ignore infringement because the race was stopped would be bad for the sport imo.
The rules were broken while the race was active, the fact the result was pulled back is irrelevent imo.
Don't protest!
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