M-Sport has devalued the M brand...

M-Sport has devalued the M brand...

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Discussion

Stick Legs

Original Poster:

4,825 posts

164 months

Monday 21st April 2014
quotequote all
I think that the fact that every BMW of any capacity can be had as an M sport has devalued the M logo.
I saw this on an ebay ad, to sell some stick on go faster plastic to SE spec cars, but thought it was quite funny!




Jon1967x

7,177 posts

123 months

Tuesday 22nd April 2014
quotequote all
The M brand is damaged by:

- switching to turbo charged engines
- magazines saying real world performance of the 535d is preferable to the m5 (previous models)
- the choice of other cars like caymans and now merc are making some decent AMG cars
- the general volumes of BMWs sold which has dragged their market down. It's not as special to own any bmw now compared to how it was 10 years ago

I don't think the m sport body kit is the biggest issue, I just think the market is changing in the same way the Subaru impreza or an evo was the car to own 15 years ago and now there's no market.


Kawasicki

13,041 posts

234 months

Tuesday 22nd April 2014
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I think the 316i was available with an M-Tech kit from the factory about 25 years ago, so not much has changed.

Chipmunk1

1,314 posts

161 months

Tuesday 22nd April 2014
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BMW and Merc have taken over, which I'm guessing was their goal in the Uk and further a field, I say we'll done, they make great cars that people want to own and pay extra for

Chipmunk1

1,314 posts

161 months

Tuesday 22nd April 2014
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pattyg

1,329 posts

226 months

Tuesday 22nd April 2014
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Is the ad in the OP not the wrong way round? The white car is the M Sport.

Jedilai

96 posts

120 months

Tuesday 22nd April 2014
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Bumper styles, M badges etc aside I have always looked at a cars brake disc size to indicate level of performance/power/sporting intention. This meant I could spot the difference between an old 116i and a 130i, or a 318d from a 335i from a distance. Rear brakes in particular would be the sign of lower budget where braking perfromance was not needed.

For the first time recently though I was deceived. Saw a new 1 series 114d with blue M sport calipers and discs filling a good proportion of the 18" wheels, much like my 330i in size. Thought it would be a M135i. Owner must have ticked that brake option. Walked away quite sad that my system was ruined.

Jon1967x

7,177 posts

123 months

Tuesday 22nd April 2014
quotequote all
Jedilai said:
Bumper styles, M badges etc aside I have always looked at a cars brake disc size to indicate level of performance/power/sporting intention. This meant I could spot the difference between an old 116i and a 130i, or a 318d from a 335i from a distance. Rear brakes in particular would be the sign of lower budget where braking perfromance was not needed.

For the first time recently though I was deceived. Saw a new 1 series 114d with blue M sport calipers and discs filling a good proportion of the 18" wheels, much like my 330i in size. Thought it would be a M135i. Owner must have ticked that brake option. Walked away quite sad that my system was ruined.
I used to use exhaust tips in the same way but that rule of thumb went a while back when the 520d started coming with twin exhausts.

Smuler

2,286 posts

138 months

Tuesday 22nd April 2014
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Interesting posts. I was in a showroom last Thursday and I must admit I didn't like the amount of external M badges which have appeared on the latest generation. I saw a M135i a 2 series and I think a 428i convertible also had them on the sides!
They are not M cars and therefore these external badges seemed unnecessary, inaccurate, and thus a bit daft.


However, it doesn't ruin the M brand because ultimately the M brand is about engineering, performance, and the engaging driving experience which, in my opinion, is superior to even the M performance cars.







dave_s13

13,813 posts

268 months

Tuesday 22nd April 2014
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"M"

And

"MSport"

Different sub-brands aren't they?

Dannbodge

2,160 posts

120 months

Tuesday 22nd April 2014
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dave_s13 said:
"M"

And

"MSport"

Different sub-brands aren't they?
This.

M sport is just BMW's version of S line, SRi. It's just the sport spec of car.

"M" is BMW's AMG

toon10

6,140 posts

156 months

Tuesday 22nd April 2014
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I think M-Sport has increased the standard BMW brand more than it has devalued the M brand. I think the insistance of auto boxes isn't helping the genuine drivers appeal that the M brand stands for but then again, if the market didn't dictate it they wouldn't do it. The E46 CSL in flappy padddle only, no thanks. Sticking a big thirsty V8 in the M3 was the start of the slide of the brand for me although others disagree. It seems to be more about power figures these days.

Welshbeef

49,633 posts

197 months

Tuesday 22nd April 2014
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Has anyone see. The X5 M550? The M550d badge is huge on the rear bumper

Welshbeef

49,633 posts

197 months

Tuesday 22nd April 2014
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Has anyone see. The X5 M550? The M550d badge is huge on the rear bumper

cerb4.5lee

30,192 posts

179 months

Tuesday 22nd April 2014
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toon10 said:
Sticking a big thirsty V8 in the M3 was the start of the slide of the brand for me
yes

The full fat M cars are made for a slightly different customer nowadays I think its more about comfort with plenty of power thrown in, I don't think M-Sport devalues the brand though really and if anything cars like the M135i/M235i are actually proving in my opinion to be a better all rounder than the full fat versions certainly as a day to day prospect.

Chipmunk1

1,314 posts

161 months

Tuesday 22nd April 2014
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Merc are just as bad try spotting a diesel Merc from a genuine AMG, at a glance it's very difficult, at least the new m3/m4 and m5/m6 genuinely stand out from the Msport diesels

Jon1967x

7,177 posts

123 months

Tuesday 22nd April 2014
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Chipmunk1 said:
Merc are just as bad try spotting a diesel Merc from a genuine AMG, at a glance it's very difficult, at least the new m3/m4 and m5/m6 genuinely stand out from the Msport diesels



Yep.. one has fog lights..

Leins

9,418 posts

147 months

Tuesday 22nd April 2014
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toon10 said:
I think M-Sport has increased the standard BMW brand more than it has devalued the M brand. I think the insistance of auto boxes isn't helping the genuine drivers appeal that the M brand stands for but then again, if the market didn't dictate it they wouldn't do it. The E46 CSL in flappy padddle only, no thanks. Sticking a big thirsty V8 in the M3 was the start of the slide of the brand for me although others disagree. It seems to be more about power figures these days.
Each to their own and all that, but what exactly did you find lacking in the CSL you drove because of the semi-manual box?

+49

77 posts

187 months

Tuesday 22nd April 2014
quotequote all
Jon1967x said:
The M brand is damaged by:

- switching to turbo charged engines
- magazines saying real world performance of the 535d is preferable to the m5 (previous models)
- the choice of other cars like caymans and now merc are making some decent AMG cars
- the general volumes of BMWs sold which has dragged their market down. It's not as special to own any bmw now compared to how it was 10 years ago

I don't think the m sport body kit is the biggest issue, I just think the market is changing in the same way the Subaru impreza or an evo was the car to own 15 years ago and now there's no market.
+1 wink 100% agree with all of that.

Everyone seems to be banging on about this M badges on non M car's lately? I'm not very old compared to some of you old timers on here but back in the E36 days my 318is M pack or Mtech or whatever you wanna call it had M badges all over it as standard,The steering wheel was exactly the same as an e36 m3 with tri color stitching and everything only difference I noticed was that the M badges round the car had M/// and m3's had well M3/// lol..Of course the body kit was exactly the same bar a few little touches.I had genuine m3 alloys and vadars in mine and you'd be hard pressed to tell any difference(yes it had rear discs :P)

So I can't figure out why everyone seem's to think this sticking M badges or having M Pack's on NON M models is something new or the brand has suddenly become diluted by this new trend when it's been commonplace for 20 odd years?

Oh and before someone ask's yes I proudly had 318IS on the back of mine! biggrin



pattyg

1,329 posts

226 months

Tuesday 22nd April 2014
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I can't see the problem apart from the X5M/X6M. On the whole though M badged cars are M engineered cars and M Sport cars are trim level only cars just like Audi S cars are S engineered and S Line cars are trim only.

What I don't understand is people thinking the M sport version is the better, faster car.