Suggested buying an Alfa at a party, didn't expect answers

Suggested buying an Alfa at a party, didn't expect answers

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windy1

393 posts

250 months

Wednesday 23rd April 2014
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I've owned a 164 in the past with that glorious v6 engine, and my dad had a 156 from new for 12 years which I also drove regularly.
They both had a lot of miles put on them, the 164 207,000 miles. A few little niggles like an electric seat that needed to have the motor tapped to get it to work and stepper motors inside the dash that failed on the 164 (Bosch parts, nothing to do with Alfa Romeo). The 156 only needed a new variator on the engine aside from the usual regular servicing.
I have had lots of other cars, maybe I was just lucky, but the Alfas were the most reliable.
I'd quite like another one with the v6, one day perhaps.

RichB

51,435 posts

283 months

Wednesday 23rd April 2014
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Olivera said:
OP, if you have an E92 BMW then I simply wouldn't bother with a wobbly old GTV with a boat anchor slung out over the driven wheels. Stick with what you've got or buy something that really is more enjoyable to drive.
biglaugh You obviously don't expand your motoring horizons much if you believe Alfa's 3.0 V6 was a boat anchor. It's often described as one of the most glorious V6 engines ever built.

underphil

1,245 posts

209 months

Wednesday 23rd April 2014
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as touched upon earlier, most people judge a car purely by the badge on it ; how much pleasure you would get out of a prospective car is irrelevant to them as for them it's about getting from A to B with minimal engagement, with the pleasure coming from telling their friends that they drive an Audi

Mr2Mike

20,143 posts

254 months

Wednesday 23rd April 2014
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Olivera said:
OP, if you have an E92 BMW then I simply wouldn't bother with a wobbly old GTV with a boat anchor slung out over the driven wheels. Stick with what you've got or buy something that really is more enjoyable to drive.
And yet you own an old car based on the awful and very wobbly Mk4 Golf platform with an characterless 4 pot lump hanging over the front wheels. Why would you own such a thing unless you enjoy driving it?

Olivera

7,068 posts

238 months

Wednesday 23rd April 2014
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You know your onto something when repliers dig around in your own garage to cast insults completely unrelated to the original question smile

For the record I've driven several Alfa's from the 90s - at best they were mediocre by today's standards, including the GTV. The 2.0 twin spark was a not bad engine, the V6 was slightly better but again nothing special. Decent noise and throttle response from the V6, but completely outgunned for power, torque and economy when compared to a modern 1.8/2.0 turbo unit. Perhaps the shiney manifold trumps all of this? smile

In my opinion none of the 90s onward FWD Alfas are particularly good drives, so instead go for an MX5 or M3.

Mave

8,208 posts

214 months

Wednesday 23rd April 2014
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Olivera said:
You know your onto something when repliers dig around in your own garage to cast insults completely unrelated to the original question smile

For the record I've driven several Alfa's from the 90s - at best they were mediocre by today's standards, including the GTV. The 2.0 twin spark was a not bad engine, the V6 was slightly better but again nothing special. Decent noise and throttle response from the V6, but completely outgunned for power, torque and economy when compared to a modern 1.8/2.0 turbo unit. Perhaps the shiney manifold trumps all of this? smile

In my opinion none of the 90s onward FWD Alfas are particularly good drives, so instead go for an MX5 or M3.
I've owned an Alfa 2.0 twin spark, and a VAG 1.8 turbo. Both engines from a similar era. The VAG engine had more power, torque and better economy. But I preferred the Alfa engine. The VAG engine did what was neccesary, but was a bit grumpy about it. The Alfa engine egged you on at every opportunity. With the VAG, I'd overtake and be looking to change up as quickly as possible. With the Alfa, I looked for every opportunity to red line it. Every single day.

With regards to the V6 and the shiny manifold - have you driven one? The shiny manifold is just the icing on the cake, and just a hint that an engine is something to be admired and lusted over, not hidden away. I remember the first time I drove a 156 2.5V6, I started it up and just sat there listening to it in the car park. It felt special just sitting there. It's cliched to talk about taking the long way home, but a journey that took me 2 hours in the morning took nearly 5 in the evening just because I looked for every back road home instead of taking the motorway.

To the OP - hope you buy it. Life is short, if you don't like it you can always get rid of it. Don't listen to the badge brigade smile

lamboman100

1,445 posts

120 months

Thursday 24th April 2014
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The 8C is one of the most beautiful cars ever built. But almost all other Alfas today are rubbish. Slow or ugly, or both. And those offset front number plates on many models look ridiculous.

Lancia was Italy's best massmarket carmaker. Made some beautiful cars with laugh-out-loud drivability. But even they are now terrible.

ImpossiblyDaft

399 posts

180 months

Thursday 24th April 2014
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RichB said:
biglaugh You obviously don't expand your motoring horizons much if you believe Alfa's 3.0 V6 was a boat anchor. It's often described as one of the most glorious V6 engines ever built.
The Arese V6 is awesome, but its one drawback is that it's quite heavy. I went from a 155 2.0 to a 156 V6 and the weight difference over the front end was noticable through the bends.

Anyway, OP:
Basically, they're decently well made and reliable overall, suffer a bit more than average from wear and tear but have the odd Friday afternoon one out there. In terms of driving dynamics, they've got fantastic steering feel but there's something a little off about the ride which can make it feel a bit unsettled - pretty good overall, but unlike some more numb cars it doesn't really hide its flaws at all. The engines are brilliant, of course. The GTV seats are pretty but uncomfortable and unsupportive, unlike the 155 and 156 ones which are great. The interior will probably have the odd squeak or rattle.

The character thing is that they're great when it comes to sight, sound and feel (both in terms of driving and things like the steering wheels). Sure, they're not the fastest thing round the Nurburgring or at the traffic lights, but they're involving and fun in a way that some more 'perfect' cars aren't - if you see a car being described as clinical as a positive, it'll disappoint, it you see it as a synonym for boring, it'll probably be a great choice.

Pommygranite

14,229 posts

215 months

Thursday 24th April 2014
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Alfa's are like wives.

Some are wonderful, some are horrible. Some are beautiful, some are dogs. Some are expensive to run, some are cheap to run. Some you can trust, others not so much.

Just like wives, they can appear amazing when you are lusting after them and the reality may or not may meet expectations.

Whatever you do ignore the stories as everyone has them and just do it as a heart judgement because just like wives, if you were being rational you wouldn't buy an Alfa.

Ps mine was great. Alfa that is, not the ex.

anonymous-user

53 months

Thursday 24th April 2014
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Olivera said:
For the record I've driven several Alfa's from the 90s - at best they were mediocre by today's standards, including the GTV.
Name me a mass-produced car from the 90's that isn't mediocre by today's standards? Escort Cosworths were still being tugged over by many back then. Yet 5 years ago you got more power in a diesel Mondeo. Today's hot hatches are doing quicker Nurburgring lap times than Ferraris from the 90's. Mid-90's french cars were at their worst, quality-wise, Vauxhall were in the dullest of dull places, 90's Ford bumpers anyone? a 15-25 year old car is just that. It's never going to be as crisp to drive as a 6 month old Seat Ibiza TDi or whatever alternative shopping cars "the wo-man" would have you drive but where's the fun in everyone doing that?


RichB

51,435 posts

283 months

Thursday 24th April 2014
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Olivera said:
You know your onto something when repliers dig around in your own garage to cast insults completely unrelated to the original question smile
Forgive me but I didn't do that. Not being a fan of BMWs I don't even know what an E92 is without looking it up on Google. My reply was simply to say that your opinion was undermined by the use of a derogatory term like "boat anchor" to describe the Alfa V6 engine. One could obviously use a BMW straight 6 as a boat anchor but even though I have no interest in BMWs I am sufficiently aware of their engines' qualities not be flippantly dismissive of them.

stuart-b

Original Poster:

3,643 posts

225 months

Thursday 24th April 2014
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RichB said:
orgive me but I didn't do that. Not being a fan of BMWs I don't even know what an E92 is without looking it up on Google. My reply was simply to say that your opinion was undermined by the use of a derogatory term like "boat anchor" to describe the Alfa V6 engine. One could obviously use a BMW straight 6 as a boat anchor but even though I have no interest in BMWs I am sufficiently aware of their engines' qualities not be flippantly dismissive of them.
It's me with the E92, he has the V12 boat anchor in a rust bucket hehe

But seriously, it's a cheap car for cheap thrills. I'm not expecting 12C driving dynamics - just a bit of fun. I can assure you it's better than a 1.6 Astra! hehe

You can't compare a 3k Audi to a 3k GTV - the GTV has depreciated enough to make it viable

jimsy11

19 posts

147 months

Thursday 24th April 2014
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I have owned many many cars under the 2k mark. I have to say Audi by far and away was the best built car I have owned. Bmw e36 have been the worst.
I once went to buy a very very clean looked after 2.0 ts 156. It was very nice but was holding back when it hit a power band, I very nearly bought it telling my self it will be a simple fix but im glad I avoided it. I kept my ' temporary' primera gt, which I own another of now.

I really dislike how alfa styling is a get out of jail free card for build quality. But, at the minute, the alfa's that are left are probably on par with most other cars in their price bracket for reliability.

Dont listen to peoples opinion on the way a car drives. go and drive it and see how you get along with it. For me the best handling car I had was B5 a4 1.8t quattro sport. better than the prim gt, 4 bmw e36, and then general other audis vauxhalls etc. but had i listened to other people, they would say other wise.

RichB

51,435 posts

283 months

Thursday 24th April 2014
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stuart-b said:
It's me with the E92, he has the V12 boat anchor in a rust bucket hehe

But seriously, it's a cheap car for cheap thrills. I'm not expecting 12C driving dynamics - just a bit of fun. I can assure you it's better than a 1.6 Astra! hehe

You can't compare a 3k Audi to a 3k GTV - the GTV has depreciated enough to make it viable
Oops redface there you go I said I don't know the E-Numbers, isn't a 328i an E90..? Anyway yes, of course a GTV is more fun than an Astra. My wife (who loves her cars) had an Astra GTE Convertible which she swapped for an Alfa Spider 2.0 which she then swapped for the Spider 3.0 V6. I then swapped the Spider V6 for a 2.7 Boxster 987 (which I don't think she's forgiven me for wink) The 2.0 twin spark engine was great fun, sounded typically Italian and revved quickly to the red line. The V6 sounded (IMO) even better and was a wonderful engine. The Boxster is of course quicker, more precise and better built but then we've moved from a second hand Astra to an almost new Boxster. biggrin I've had 4 x Alfas over the years, 2 x 164 V6 Lussos (one of which had 135,000 on it when it went) and aside from silly things they've been excellent. Indeed the failures on all four are so few I could probably list tem off the top of my head; 1st 164 new exhaust, 2nd 164 new exhaust, new clutch and one ABS sensor; 1st Spider, hood motor (Bosch item), 2nd Spider no failures at all but the hood needed proofing after a few years. Porsche 4 years old, the roof has leaked, the ECU has failed and it's on it's 3rd battery already hehe Ho hum...

Mr2Mike

20,143 posts

254 months

Thursday 24th April 2014
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Olivera said:
You know your onto something when repliers dig around in your own garage to cast insults completely unrelated to the original question smile

For the record I've driven several Alfa's from the 90s - at best they were mediocre by today's standards, including the GTV.
My point is that you own a car that's pretty mediocre by today's standards (even if it's still pretty quick), but presumably you still enjoy owning and driving it?

Pete102

2,042 posts

185 months

Thursday 24th April 2014
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Had a 4 pot GTV myself...the ONLY car to leave me stranded by the motorway after it burnt a valve out!

Other than that...great car!

macdeb

8,493 posts

254 months

Wednesday 29th October 2014
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fjord said:
Alfas are st and ugly. I've driven a couple and found them to be uninspiring. I dont understand why alfa seems to hold demigod like status amongst car brands. I find most peoples alfa love comes from watching too much top gear.

Opinions of course, are all relative.
scratchchin Can't agree with that, as if you watch Top Snear you wouldn't buy an Alfa of any sort. Clarkson talks ste and so does the little st. They talk, the audience applaud like performing seals, utter crap hurl
You don't like them, so fair enough. I however love them especially after owning one for 10 years from new and can honestly say it's been the best car we've ever had. Would we have another? you bet and am on the look out at present.

crostonian

2,427 posts

171 months

Wednesday 29th October 2014
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How many times has a thread like this run on PH? Yawn yawn yawn.

Mr2Mike

20,143 posts

254 months

Wednesday 29th October 2014
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crostonian said:
How many times has a thread like this run on PH? Yawn yawn yawn.
I remember there was one about 6 months ago...

Mound Dawg

1,915 posts

173 months

Wednesday 29th October 2014
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Me too.

Thought it had died.