LOVE AT FIRST SITE

LOVE AT FIRST SITE

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dreamin_of_a_s6S

Original Poster:

2 posts

261 months

Wednesday 24th July 2002
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Hello,

I am introducing myself. I am David, I live in the state of Michigan in the US. I recently have stumbled across the most beautiful car ive ever seen. The Tuscan S. I am looking at buying a new one but i am having trouble finding a way to get it here. I am currently the owner of a 01 Black on black Honda S2000. Love the car, but the Tuscan S makes it seem repulsive. I was hoping i could not only get knowledge but some help on purchasing one from everyone. Thanks for any help you can provide.

Sincerely the newest proud Tuscan lover,
David

maranellouk

2,066 posts

263 months

Wednesday 24th July 2002
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Welcome to PH!

I don't think there is a way of bringing a Tuscan in to the U.S if you hold a U.S passport. The LHD Tuscans are not yet on sale so it would be a RHD. Check the threads on this forum for more info as there are quite a few people here who want one.

I'll be taking mine to NYC for a year and driving it to SanFran a few times a year. Can't decide between Black/tan interior, black/grey or black/black. There are a few guys on the forums here who are doing the same thing next year. It will be an awesome sight to see a few TVR's running through the U.S.

Ah, the U.K passport is the sweetest thing!

>> Edited by maranellouk on Wednesday 24th July 09:28

JARCY

1,559 posts

275 months

Wednesday 24th July 2002
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In the meantime, take a look at the movie Swordfish, if you haven't already. John Travolta found a way of exploiting this car in the US.

JonGwynne

270 posts

265 months

Tuesday 27th August 2002
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Well, if you figure out how to get the car registered in the US, please let us all know. I think that will be your biggest problem.

I'm an American working in the UK and my regular car is a Honda S2000 as well. The Honda is a fine car in its own way, but if you drive a Tuscan, you'll never want to get back in your Honda.

I rented a Tuscan for a week and it was AMAZING. I hated giving it up.

However, a few pieces of advice.

First, before you even think about actually buying a Tuscan, invest in a little research. Take a vacation to the UK and rent one while you're here. They can be had though several different places: check the ads in the back of British sports car magazines and call some of them for quotes and availability.

Ideally, you'll want to come over for a few weeks and rent an ordinary car to get used to driving on the other side. It takes about a week of driving every day to really get used to driving over here. Once you start to get comfy with the driving and the roads, pick up your Tuscan and have a blast around some British B roads in it.

One of two things will happen. You'll either love the Tuscan or hate it. As someone who has driven both a Tuscan and an S2000, let me say a few things on the comparison...

There is none. They are as diametrically opposed as it is possible for two cars to be and still be two-seater roadsters. They are are different as a Mazda Miata and a Lamborghini Diablo.

The Honda is quiet, relaxing, polite and dignified. The TVR is none of those things. The Tuscan's steering is shockingly immediate, heavy at low speeds and almost as communicative as the Lotus Elise. The clutch is quite heavy - so much so that I'd say it would be either impossible or extremely uncomfortable for the average woman to drive this car. I'm 6' tall, weigh 190lbs and have pretty strong legs but the TVR took some getting used to and once I did, going back to the Honda was a major adjustment. Also, the pedals are "floor-hinged". Some people find this a difficult adjustment - others don't. Speaking of which... note to Blackpool: This *is* the UK and wet shoe soles aren't exactly unusual around here. If you're going to make a clutch pedal that heavy and floor-hinged as well, you might want to think about making the surface a little more non-slip.

Also, as you may have heard, there are no driver aids in the Tuscan. That means no ABS and no traction-control. Some fools in the automotive trade call these things "safety" features. They're either ignorant or being deliberately deceptive. Let's be clear on this. The TVR is a safe car to drive; as safe as the driver. Some people like to portray it as a wild animal that constantly threatens to break loose and go sideways. That's crap. I've driven this car aggressively on wet roads and it was never anything but absolutely predictable. Why? Because I didn't do anything stupid. However, it bears remembering that a whole range of stupid things are possible in the TVR. It also is worth remembering that just because you *can* do something doesn't mean you should. Get to know this car's limits gradually. This is NOT a car in which you have to floor the throttle to get any sort of performance out of it. The people who crash them are the ones who forget that they're driving a car that refuses to baby the driver. Those sorts of people should stick to nice, safe (and fun-free) cars like BMW Z3s and Porsche Boxters.

Anyway, now on to the negative comparisons. Compared to the Honda, the build-quality of the Tuscan is nowhere even close. There are two ways to look at it. You can call the Tuscan's flaws "character" or you can call them "appalling". The only way to know for sure is to drive the car. The windows rattle when the door closes. When it rains, even if the roof doesn't actually leak water when the car is closed up tight, you'll get a good dripping-on when you get in and out of the car. There are lots of little things than are puzzling like how easy it is to damage the rear-light assembly from inside the trunk.

And don't let anyone tell you that air-conditioning is anothing but an absolute essential if you want to spend any time in the car with the roof on. If you do buy a car and take it to the US, you MUST get air-con and you MUST get good answers from people as to how the cooling system for both you and engine will work in American weather and traffic.

Interior noise is something you must consider. It may or may not be a problem but you won't know until you've driven one for an extended period. Some people think the noise it makes is great. Some people think it is awful. About the only thing everyone agrees on is that there is a lot and there's no getting away from it.

Hope this answers some questions and encourages you to try out a Tuscan.

dan

1,068 posts

284 months

Tuesday 27th August 2002
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quote:

I'll be taking mine to NYC for a year and driving it to SanFran a few times a year. Can't decide between Black/tan interior, black/grey or black/black. There are a few guys on the forums here who are doing the same thing next year. It will be an awesome sight to see a few TVR's running through the U.S.



Just as a matter of interest... Maranello/anyone... how much does it cost to ship a car to the states(NYC)?

dreamin_of_a_s6S

Original Poster:

2 posts

261 months

Tuesday 27th August 2002
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WOW

Thanks for that badass post. That helped me out alot. unfortunatly i wont be able to make it over there for quite sometime. Maybe John Travolta will let me drive his...lol. Any how I have found a way to get the car legal in the US. You must have it plated in Arizona. From what I hear Arizona is considered a testing state. Which makes it un affected by many of the emission and safety laws that bar the S. So at this point its the money and shipping that I am working on finding. No sense in spending all the money to test it out if I cant get it over here. The is excellent that you are also a fellow S2K owner. Unfortunatly I have not had the mechinical strenth and soundness you speak of. Nor the customer service. Mainly in which part when the District Service Rep denied me fix on my clutch and said that he could tell I was abusing my car meerly by my age (20), that the horrific service was either out of jealousy or ignorance. So I have dumped an additional 15g's into the S2K in a year to keep her running, and about to dump another 5g's into a new trans cause of course they didnt perform the TSB for the second gear and the synchro went. God shifting from 1st to 3rd kind of taked the fun out of the car. But any how. Thanks again for all your help. What year is your S2K?

JonGwynne

270 posts

265 months

Wednesday 28th August 2002
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Actually, I heard that Travolta only had his on loan during the production and promotion of Swordfish and that after he drove it to the premier he had to give it back.

Thanks for the tip about Arizona. I am a Californian so if I ever decide to go back and want to take a Tuscan with me, it will be a small price to pay to have Arizona plates even if I have to set up "residence" in Arizona. Plus, it is probably cheaper to register cars in Az. ;->

To answer your question, I have a 2002 S2K.

Sorry to hear about your clutch problems. I have had pretty good luck with mine though it whines a little in 4th under engine braking. It sucks that your people automatically assume that you abused the car. I would demand proof of their allegations before they renege on their warranty obligations and threaten to take them to court if they don't make good. Remind them in the US, the phrase "innocent until proven guilty" still carries some weight in courts.

Another thing I should point out about the Tuscan is that AFAIK they are still only available as Right Hand Drive cars - despite rumors of LHD R&D to boost European sales. So, if you take one for a test drive and decide you have to have it, you'll have to get used to driving on the other side of the car. It does take a bit of getting used to. For me it stopped being weird after about a week and I got comfortable with it after about a month. After a year, I still have minor trouble with things like reversing into a parking spot and I still want to look over my right shoulder as I back up but other than that, it is second-nature.

For someone as young as you, you might have an easier time making the adjustment than someone who's been driving as long as you've been alive. ;->

Speaking of age, if you're thinking about arranging a vacation to the UK for a Tuscan blast, be sure you tell the rental place how old you are. There shouldn't be any problem with you having a US driver's license but at least one of the places I know that rents them won't let the Tuscan go out with anyone under 30. But maybe you can get around it by having someone older rent the thing and then let you drive it.

Also, if you're really serious about getting one, make sure you have the service details worked out before you commit yourself. Unlike earlier TVRs that use tweaked versions of other manufacturer's engines (e.g. Rover), the Tuscan uses TVR's own straight-six. It is a fabulous engine and I'm told that it isn't excessively complex but you'll have to make arrangements for service by someone you trust who is willing and able to plunge into the unknown and I don't know how easy it will be for them as someone outside of TVR's authorized service network to get access to technical documentation and parts should it be necessary.

If you find this is causing too much difficulty, you could always "compromise" and go for a Griffith or Chimera as they use a pretty basic Rover V8. Also, the 5.0 liter version of this engine puts out more torque (and at much lower revs) than the Tuscan.

In many ways it is even more fun to drive, most people will agree that it is an easier car to live with as a daily driver and it is definitely more reliable/cheaper to run. And also, since the engine is the same (apart from TVR's performance tweaks) as that used in Land Rovers, you might have an easier time getting it registered in the US.

And if you really want a Tuscan, remember they come in "Reflex" paint jobs and that would make it even more of an eye-catcher than it already is. I'll never forget when I saw a Tuscan in "Reflex Spice" coming the other way on the road. I almost drove into a tree staring at it. It was absolutely stunning. Be sure you at least look at one with Reflex paint before you buy.



>> Edited by JonGwynne on Thursday 29th August 13:02

luca brazzi

3,975 posts

265 months

Wednesday 28th August 2002
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If you plan on coming over to the UK to test drive one, for heaven's sake get in touch with a few Tuscan owners on this forum beforehand.

Depending on where you choose to stay in England, there are bound to be folks around who would love to meet up, some with Tuscans no doubt.

I for one would be happy to catch up with a US chappy over here to look at Tuscans. With the right insurance, maybe even a test drive in mine which also happens to be in reflex green, but is 'only' a standard Tuscan, not the 'S'.

If you want to see some pics, look here...
www.the.nestas.btinternet.co.uk/cargallery.htm

I hope to be hosting a video of one of our TVR runs on my website in the immediate future, or I can perhaps send you out a cd of the movie....if you ask me nicely

As an owner, I absolutely love the car, fantastic in all respects, highly addictive, and so much fun. Big grins are always present.

Steve
London

SurfingSidney

9 posts

260 months

Thursday 29th August 2002
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if anyone has more details about the Arizona registering process please post,

a sad californian

JonGwynne

270 posts

265 months

Friday 30th August 2002
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quote:

if anyone has more details about the Arizona registering process please post,

a sad californian



You might gamble a few bucks on a call to the Arizona Department of Motor Vehicles. 602-255-0072.

Or, if you're really serious, you could call a lawyer in Arizona who is familiar with such matters. If you don't know any names, contact the Arizona Bar Association and they'll be happy to refer you to one.

That would be my first step if I were thinking of going in that direction.

However, I would't hold my breath. I cite the following:

Section 28-1052-D of the Arizona Vehicle Code...

"Before the department issues a certificate of title to a vehicle imported into this country, the owner shall obtain a certificate of compliance that states that the vehicle meets all federal vehicle equipment and emissions equipment requirements."

In other words, unless you can find someone to certify the Speed 6 engine compliant with Federal DOT emissions standards, get someone to rememdy the lack of airbags and bumpers (and who knows what else the DOT will find on the Tuscan to whine about), you're dead in the water. The problem is that personally "federalizing" the Tuscan will cost nearly as much as the car itself. I used to live in Newport Beach and there was a place down the road who said that they could import the Lotus Elise and make it and its Rover engine California street legal for about $30,000 above and beyond the price of the car, shipping and import duties.

You're probably still better off having it professionally disassembled, shipped over in pieces and then put back together as a "kit car" once in the US.


>> Edited by JonGwynne on Friday 30th August 11:18

>> Edited by JonGwynne on Friday 30th August 11:20

goin2fast52

57 posts

260 months

Saturday 26th October 2002
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hey luca, how come you're wearing a ferrari jacket when you went to puck up the tuscan?

luca brazzi

3,975 posts

265 months

Saturday 26th October 2002
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goin2fast52 said: hey luca, how come you're wearing a ferrari jacket when you went to puck up the tuscan?

I always like to cause a little controversy

I just like the fleece...got the hat and t-shirt too.
I wear the fleece whenever we go on drives around Surrey or to Virginia Waters meet-ups, as its easily identifiable. Plus I like it.

But I do love the Tuscan, stunning in every way.
And the offer still stands to anyone visiting South London looking at Tuscans...get in touch and we go for an excursion.
LB
PS...have you seen my first video, and the trailer for the 2nd Surrey Run???

keithyboy

1,940 posts

270 months

Sunday 27th October 2002
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". . . You're probably still better off having it professionally disassembled, shipped over in pieces and then put back together as a "kit car" once in the US." Jon, can you expound upon this please - note the the title of the "kit car" thread which I started. Are you suggesting that if one were to do such a thing and register it as a "JonGwynneAutomobile" or "keithycar" or similar, then this would be the legitimate loophole Im seeking - I have a 1991 V8S.



>> Edited by keithyboy on Sunday 27th October 12:13

JonGwynne

270 posts

265 months

Monday 28th October 2002
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keithyboy said: ". . . You're probably still better off having it professionally disassembled, shipped over in pieces and then put back together as a "kit car" once in the US." Jon, can you expound upon this please - note the the title of the "kit car" thread which I started. Are you suggesting that if one were to do such a thing and register it as a "JonGwynneAutomobile" or "keithycar" or similar, then this would be the legitimate loophole Im seeking - I have a 1991 V8S.



>> Edited by keithyboy on Sunday 27th October 12:13


I'm not an expert on this but my understanding is that if you import the components of a car into the US (most people seem to agree that simply removing the drive-train is enough, you don't have to take the whole thing apart into individual components) and re-assemble it on American soil, it can be registered as if it were a kit car. Thus, bypassing the need for formal crash-testing and DOT engine-certification.

The English have a thing called Single Vehicle Approval (SVA) where people who build their own car can submit it to a thorough inspection by the Ministry of Transportation (British version of DMV) and if all the common-sense things (seat-belts, lights, brakes, exhaust, etc.) are good, then the car can be licensed for on-road use without having to submit to the sort of expensive testing auto manufacturers have to go through.

Anyway, I don't know what the American version of an SVA inspection is called but since kit-cars do exist in the US and are driven on public roads, there must be some equivalent. The trick is to get your car to qualify for that status.

Older TVRs may well have problems passing emission tests in states like California and New York so I would suggest you research the matter carefully and find out what comes out of your tailpipes and compare that to California standards before even thinking about starting to take the car apart.

Another option might be to establish residency in either Canada or Mexico (whichever is closer) so you can register the car there. Some states in the US allow you to establish residency with a simple Post Office box. Auto registration law gets a bit blurry when someone has two residences in different states or even countries.

The thing is, if you really want to take a TVR into the US, the best thing to do is talk to a lawyer who knows their way around these issues and is willing to get creative.

Good luck.

goin2fast52

57 posts

260 months

Sunday 3rd November 2002
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for emissions, you don't have to worry about it if the car is over 25yrs old(1973-)

Tailslide

15 posts

257 months

Tuesday 5th November 2002
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That Arizona teaser is quite exciting... I'm not adverse to the idea of moving to Arizona, shipping in a Griffith (wonder who bought mine) and getting dark skies into the bargain. Now to look for some information security jobs in Arizona....

JonGwynne

270 posts

265 months

Tuesday 5th November 2002
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Tailslide said: That Arizona teaser is quite exciting... I'm not adverse to the idea of moving to Arizona, shipping in a Griffith (wonder who bought mine) and getting dark skies into the bargain. Now to look for some information security jobs in Arizona....


Why bother moving? You're almost certainly going to encounter exactly the same issues anywhere in the country. Every state in the union is going to have to follow DOT regulations.

Before you move, talk to a lawyer locally and see what he says about registering the car in your home state. Also, if you're set on a Griff/Chim, be sure the lawyer knows that this is a 4.0/4.3/4.5/5.0 liter Rover V8 which has been brough into the US in various Rover vehicles. Actually, according to what I've heard, it is based on a Buick evolution of an original BMW design.

It shouldn't be too difficult to convince some DMV drone that the engine is something already known to and approved by the DOT. The problem you're likely to run into is going to revolve around whatever liberties TVR may have taken with the intake and exhaust components. You'll want to ask a someone "in the know" how dramatically TVR has deviated from the original design.

This and the endless nitpicking they're going to do regarding things like bumpers, cockpit switchgear, nature/location of indicator lights, exhaust noise, airbags, crash-damage resistance, etc...

Those are going to be your obstacles. I think you'll find that there's a reason why people don't import desireable cars into the US from overseas anymore. Otherwise there would be more than a few cars like the BMW Z1, Peugeot 206CC, Lancia Delta Integrale, etc... cruising American roads.

Graham

16,368 posts

284 months

Tuesday 5th November 2002
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If you did want to import a chim/griff into the states and were going the kit car route...

Id consider selling the tvr engine and transmission in the uk, import the car without enigne and box and

buy a new crate corvette LS1 motor and T5 Gearbox in the USA.

get whoever you were going to get to put the car back together to mod it to fit...

then you've got a properly certified motor, no parts problem and heck probably even a warranty..

g

JonGwynne

270 posts

265 months

Wednesday 6th November 2002
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Graham said: If you did want to import a chim/griff into the states and were going the kit car route...

Id consider selling the tvr engine and transmission in the uk, import the car without enigne and box and

buy a new crate corvette LS1 motor and T5 Gearbox in the USA.

get whoever you were going to get to put the car back together to mod it to fit...

then you've got a properly certified motor, no parts problem and heck probably even a warranty..

g



Why should anyone have to do that? Isn't the basic Rover engine already certified for North America?

Besides if something wants a light car driven by a giant block of Detroit iron, there are cars like the Detomaso Pantera and Intermeccanica Italia to keep them happy.

Graham

16,368 posts

284 months

Thursday 7th November 2002
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more power more availability