Israeli

[BlackLabel]

And some people continue to defend acts like the one below because the same happened to Jews in North Africa, Egypt, Iraq etc however why punish residents in places like Jaffa for the actions of anti- Jewish zealots in these other place?



(From the Guardian link you posted).

"The vast majority of the 100,000 Arabs in Jaffa were forced to leave in fear for their lives; the port and beaches were packed with families scrambling for places on ships to Gaza or Lebanon. Others fled on foot to Nablus in the West Bank or Jordan. Within days, only 4,000 remained; the rest were destined to be lifelong refugees.

"All the Palestinians in Jaffa were rounded up and brought to the Ajami neighbourhood, surrounded by a fence with soldiers and dogs," said Abu Shehadeh. "The Jews called our neighbourhood a ghetto. My grandfather, who used to get a taxi from Jaffa to Beirut, needed military permission to leave Ajami."

A year later Israel decreed that properties whose owners were "absent" would pass to the state. Not only did all of Jaffa's refugees lose their property, but so did those forced into Ajami who owned property in other areas of the city: "1948 was the first naqba [catastrophe]," said Abu Shehadeh. "The absentee law was the second."

Mr Snap said:

Be under no illusions, ethnic cleansing by other methods is still taking place -

http://www.vice.com/en_uk/read/palestinians-in-eas...
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2010/jul/18/jaffa...
http://www.loonwatch.com/2013/10/judaizing-jerusal...
http://www.haaretz.com/print-edition/opinion/discr...

[Mrr T]

SR7492 said:

As stated before and by many good posts, Israel doesn't care because, simply put, they want to 'wipe out' the Palestinians so they can have their Greater Jewish State.

Lets do the numbers. The current ground incursion has been going on 16 days. The previous shelling was about 10 days. So in 26 days the Israel's have killed about 700 civilians. Based on Wiki population figures (1.8M) and birth rates (2.4%) in Gaza in the last 26 days 3,000 babies will have been born.

That's the problem with these Jew is they are no good at mass murder.

Please accept this as black humour.

I do however think its a bit hard to suggest Israel is trying to wipe out the population of Gaza and be taken seriously.

[Rocksteadyeddie]

Mrr T said:

Lets do the numbers. The current ground incursion has been going on 16 days. The previous shelling was about 10 days. So in 26 days the Israel's have killed about 700 civilians. Based on Wiki population figures (1.8M) and birth rates (2.4%) in Gaza in the last 26 days 3,000 babies will have been born.

That's the problem with these Jew is they are no good at mass murder.

Please accept this as black humour.

I do however think its a bit hard to suggest Israel is trying to wipe out the population of Gaza and be taken seriously.

Are you able to view what is happening with any sense of balance? Or are you totally and utterly blinkered?

[Scuffers]

durbster said:

Honestly, isn't it about time we got we wise to this sort of reporting? It's weak, embarrassing and should be consigned to history.

are you for real?

Look, I am not suggesting the style or slant of the vid is 100% but it;s pretty hard to argue with the hard facts.

at this rate, more people will have died in protests about Gaza than have actually died in Gaza.

that's insane.

what the video does show though is just how gullible and ill-educated the general masses are.

[allnighter]

Scuffers said:

Mr Snap said:

Be under no illusions, ethnic cleansing by other methods is still taking place -

http://www.vice.com/en_uk/read/palestinians-in-eas...
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2010/jul/18/jaffa...
http://www.loonwatch.com/2013/10/judaizing-jerusal...
http://www.haaretz.com/print-edition/opinion/discr...

really?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ewFW3EZsFIY&fe...

remind me again what genocide is?

Nice diversion technique, no one can question Israel according to you. Every time we put the spotlight on Israel, and its racist policies in the way it treats innocent Palestinians, you try and move the spotlight away from Israel and shine it on some hell hole on another part of this planet. So that makes it alright? Israel, according to you, should , like in Agatha Christie's novel, get away with murder when it comes to Arabs, because other Arabs are killing even more Arabs by the thousands, and the fact that Israel is killing them by the hundreds only , it just shows it's doing them a 'favour'. Israel, in comparison,is the 'Mother Theresa' of Arab killers. What kind of twisted logic is that may I ask?

Edited by allnighter on Thursday 24th July 09:55

[durbster]

Scuffers said:

...it;s pretty hard to argue with the hard facts.

at this rate, more people will have died in protests about Gaza than have actually died in Gaza.

Well, with hard facts like that how can I argue.

Scuffers said:

what the video does show though is just how gullible and ill-educated the general masses are.

Since you appear to think this video is nothing more than tabloid nonsense, I agree.

[avinalarf]

This whole Israeli / Palestinian thing is a feck up.
I was amazed when I first looked at the map of the area and saw the West Bank and Gaza ,two separated bits of land that are supposed to be a State of Palestine,how is that supposed to work ?
A very complex problem that will not be resolved by you lot arguing and shouting at each other.
You are part of the problem.
Nobody wants to see innocent children and civilians being maimed or killed,Palestinian or Israeli.
If peace is to be won it will require both parties to sit down and make sacrifices.
So instead of this "he said,she said"nonsense lets hear some practical solutions for a change.
Solutions that will enable both Israel and Palestine to co exist in peace.

[Scuffers]

allnighter said:

ice diversion technique, no one can question Israel according to you. Every time we put the spotlight on Israel, and its racist policies in the way it treats innocent Palestinians, you try and move the spotlight away from Israel and shine it on some hell hole on another part of this planet. So that makes it alright? Israel, according to you, should , like in Agatha Christie's novel, get away with murder when it comes to Arabs, because other Arabs are killing even more Arabs by the thousands, and the fact that Israel is only killing them by the hundreds only , just shows it's doing them a 'favour'. Israel, in comparison,is the 'Mother Theresa' of Arab killers. What kind of twisted logic is that may I ask?

where have I said I support what Israel have/are doing?

and what exactly is an innocent palestinian?

[allnighter]

Scuffers said:

durbster said:

Honestly, isn't it about time we got we wise to this sort of reporting? It's weak, embarrassing and should be consigned to history.

are you for real?

Look, I am not suggesting the style or slant of the vid is 100% but it;s pretty hard to argue with the hard facts.

at this rate, more people will have died in protests about Gaza than have actually died in Gaza.

that's insane.

what the video does show though is just how gullible and ill-educated the general masses are.

Which sums you up really. It's embarrassing!

[allnighter]

Scuffers said:

allnighter said:

ice diversion technique, no one can question Israel according to you. Every time we put the spotlight on Israel, and its racist policies in the way it treats innocent Palestinians, you try and move the spotlight away from Israel and shine it on some hell hole on another part of this planet. So that makes it alright? Israel, according to you, should , like in Agatha Christie's novel, get away with murder when it comes to Arabs, because other Arabs are killing even more Arabs by the thousands, and the fact that Israel is only killing them by the hundreds only , just shows it's doing them a 'favour'. Israel, in comparison,is the 'Mother Theresa' of Arab killers. What kind of twisted logic is that may I ask?

where have I said I support what Israel have/are doing?

and what exactly is an innocent palestinian?

Oh Gosh you are making it worse, stop it please stop!

ETA If you post a video like that then you are presenting a 'thinking' (and I use that term loosely) or an Agenda that you subscribe to.

Edited by allnighter on Thursday 24th July 10:07

[Scuffers]

avinalarf said:

This whole Israeli / Palestinian thing is a feck up.
I was amazed when I first looked at the map of the area and saw the West Bank and Gaza ,two separated bits of land that are supposed to be a State of Palestine,how is that supposed to work ?
A very complex problem that will not be resolved by you lot arguing and shouting at each other.
You are part of the problem.
Nobody wants to see innocent children and civilians being maimed or killed,Palestinian or Israeli.
If peace is to be won it will require both parties to sit down and make sacrifices.
So instead of this "he said,she said"nonsense lets hear some practical solutions for a change.
Solutions that will enable both Israel and Palestine to co exist in peace.

you are 100% right.

the issues with all this are somewhat historic, when people go on about 'our land' it's just a question of time rather than actual ownership (imagine of all the Aboriginals said we want our land back?)

None of the maps posted these days are remotely accurate, but I do agree with you, it's hard to see how it can work like it is (that said, the west bank and gaza do not need to be attached as such, in the same way alaska is not attached to the rest of the US)

as for answers, I don't have any, best I can come up with is to basically starve them into submission, ie, cut off the aid money from every source.

[Mrr T]

Rocksteadyeddie said:

Mrr T said:

Lets do the numbers. The current ground incursion has been going on 16 days. The previous shelling was about 10 days. So in 26 days the Israel's have killed about 700 civilians. Based on Wiki population figures (1.8M) and birth rates (2.4%) in Gaza in the last 26 days 3,000 babies will have been born.

That's the problem with these Jew is they are no good at mass murder.

Please accept this as black humour.

I do however think its a bit hard to suggest Israel is trying to wipe out the population of Gaza and be taken seriously.

Are you able to view what is happening with any sense of balance? Or are you totally and utterly blinkered?

Yes I have a sense of balance.

What lacks balance is the post suggesting Israel is attempting to wipe out the population of Gaza.

[Mr Snap]

Mrr T said:

Lets do the numbers. The current ground incursion has been going on 16 days. The previous shelling was about 10 days. So in 26 days the Israel's have killed about 700 civilians. Based on Wiki population figures (1.8M) and birth rates (2.4%) in Gaza in the last 26 days 3,000 babies will have been born.

That's the problem with these Jew is they are no good at mass murder.

Please accept this as black humour.

I do however think its a bit hard to suggest Israel is trying to wipe out the population of Gaza and be taken seriously.

No, let's not do numbers, because numbers is reducing real people to mere statistics (and we all know what Stalin said re statistics). Let's talk ethics and morals instead.

Do you think it's acceptable to kill civilians? Do you think it's acceptable to destroy innocent families and devastate property?

Your argument seems to be that it's ok to bump off a few innocent Palestinians because, like buses, there'll be another one along in a moment. Do you have children yourself? Do you reckon it'd be ok if I killed them? There are, after all, lots of people in the UK who would be able to make up for your trivial loss. Your contribution drips with racism and contempt for the innocent.

Nor does the fact that you suddenly see fit to inject humour into the subject of killing innocent people reflect well on you.

In the last few pages, you've tried to nit-pick holes in arguments without making any substantive contribution. You've demanded that people provide citations to their contributions but you eschew doing it yourself. Your contributions are both pompous and patronising and you would appear to have no compunction about making light of the deaths of innocent people. You need to take a good look at yourself.

[Scuffers]

Guam said:

What is concerning me more right now is the rise in Anti Semitism across Europe and the attacks noted in the press.

It seems to me it would be no different to attacks on Mosques and innocent Muslims, justified by the ISIS attacks on Christians and their Churches in IRAQ.

Peoples Ire needs to be contained to the Nation state involved not those sharing a faith with them imho.

very much so.

the whole world seems to manage to ignore the hundreds of thousands of people that die every year to some persecution just because it's not trending on twater or book.

[Mrr T]

Mr Snap said:

No, let's not do numbers, because numbers is reducing real people to mere statistics (and we all know what Stalin said re statistics). Let's talk ethics and morals instead.

So lets also stop ridicules posts suggesting Israel is trying to wipe out the Gaza population.
Stalin now there is a man who knew about mass murder.

Mr Snap said:

Do you think it's acceptable to kill civilians? Do you think it's acceptable to destroy innocent families and devastate property?

As they say war is hell.
Deliberately killing civilian is always a controversial decision. However, its been done in most wars.

Mr Snap said:

Your argument seems to be that it's ok to bump off a few innocent Palestinians because, like buses, there'll be another one along in a moment. Do you have children yourself? Do you reckon it'd be ok if I killed them? There are, after all, lots of people in the UK who would be able to make up for your trivial loss. Your contribution drips with racism and contempt for the innocent.

No my argument is that its clear Israel is not trying to wipe out the civilian population of Gaza. Every civilian death is a tragedy. Unfortunately most of history is littered with tragedy.
I do have children and I would be unhappy if you killed them. Then again I have made no attempt to lob missiles at you.

Mr Snap said:

Nor does the fact that you suddenly see fit to inject humour into the subject of killing innocent people reflect well on you.

I disagree. This whole middle east situation is so tragic I feel humour is all that is left.

Mr Snap said:

In the last few pages, you've tried to nit-pick holes in arguments without making any substantive contribution. You've demanded that people provide citations to their contributions but you eschew doing it yourself. Your contributions are both pompous and patronising and you would appear to have no compunction about making light of the deaths of innocent people. You need to take a good look at yourself.

I have only asked for citation where one person posted alleged quotes and facts. I notice I never received them. As for me I did post citations. I agree wiki is not all ways right but you can disagree with the number if you wish..

Edited by Mrr T on Thursday 24th July 10:51

[audidoody]

Israel is not committing genocide, `exacting vengeance' or taking `retribution'. They are running a battle to eliminate the rockets and tunnels . Hamas's philosophy is `We love death like the Jews love life.' Their call for the destruction of Israel is not as a result of Israeli policies. They have wanted the destruction of Israel since 1948. Israel's actions and policies are a result of this intransigence.

Israel's 'problem' is that it doesn't care about world opinion, while Hamas are running an incredibly powerful PR and propaganda campaign using civilians as cannon fodder and ensuring the international media get the 'best' photo opportunities. And it is working better than they could ever have imagined. They have damaged Israel much more than mere rockets ever could.

Had Israel confined its military campaign against Hamas using brilliant 'Entebbe-style' special forces raids without inflicting civilian casualties the propaganda outcome would have been dramatically different.

The actions of the last two weeks will be Netenyahu's unfortunate lasting legacy.

[Mr Snap]

Scuffers said:

you are 100% right.

the issues with all this are somewhat historic, when people go on about 'our land' it's just a question of time rather than actual ownership (imagine of all the Aboriginals said we want our land back?)

None of the maps posted these days are remotely accurate, but I do agree with you, it's hard to see how it can work like it is (that said, the west bank and gaza do not need to be attached as such, in the same way alaska is not attached to the rest of the US)

as for answers, I don't have any, best I can come up with is to basically starve them into submission, ie, cut off the aid money from every source.

Starve. Them.

[avinalarf]

Scuffers said:

you are 100% right.

the issues with all this are somewhat historic, when people go on about 'our land' it's just a question of time rather than actual ownership (imagine of all the Aboriginals said we want our land back?)

None of the maps posted these days are remotely accurate, but I do agree with you, it's hard to see how it can work like it is (that said, the west bank and gaza do not need to be attached as such, in the same way alaska is not attached to the rest of the US)

as for answers, I don't have any, best I can come up with is to basically starve them into submission, ie, cut off the aid money from every source.

A possible basis for a solution.
1. Palestinians agree that Israel has a right to exist.
2. Divide Jerusalem.
3. Israel offer a piece of land ,adjoining West Bank,to exchange for Gaza.
4.Israel to stop building settlements on West Bank.

[Mr Snap]

Mrr T said:

Mr Snap said:

No, let's not do numbers, because numbers is reducing real people to mere statistics (and we all know what Stalin said re statistics). Let's talk ethics and morals instead.

Mr Snap said:

Do you think it's acceptable to kill civilians? Do you think it's acceptable to destroy innocent families and devastate property?

Mr Snap said:

Your argument seems to be that it's ok to bump off a few innocent Palestinians because, like buses, there'll be another one along in a moment. Do you have children yourself? Do you reckon it'd be ok if I killed them? There are, after all, lots of people in the UK who would be able to make up for your trivial loss. Your contribution drips with racism and contempt for the innocent.

Mr Snap said:

Nor does the fact that you suddenly see fit to inject humour into the subject of killing innocent people reflect well on you.

Mr Snap said:

In the last few pages, you've tried to nit-pick holes in arguments without making any substantive contribution. You've demanded that people provide citations to their contributions but you eschew doing it yourself. Your contributions are both pompous and patronising and you would appear to have no compunction about making light of the deaths of innocent people. You need to take a good look at yourself.

There you go, avoiding the substantive points again.

Is it ok to kill children?
Is it ok to destroy homes?
Is it ok to create millions of refugees by means of terror?
Is it ok to put millions of refugees into a small, under-resourced, area and then starve them of basic supplies including water and power?
Is it ok to kill people because they breed quickly?
Is it racist to hold this opinion?

Simple questions and no requirement to seek references.

[Scuffers]

avinalarf said:

A possible basis for a solution.
1. Palestinians agree that Israel has a right to exist.
2. Divide Jerusalem.
3. Israel offer a piece of land ,adjoining West Bank,to exchange for Gaza.
4.Israel to stop building settlements on West Bank.

I'm not 100% on this, but I am pretty sure that was one of the offers put to the palestinians years ago - land for peace?