Is it time for a group 7 at the classic?

[croydon]

Just throwing it out here but surely we are missing some great cars as time ticks on?

1977 - 1982 must have some greats machines?

Certainly it would spice up the event which it defiantly needs.

Ian

[furtive]

Absolutely. Was saying this while I was there.

[Mark B]

It would make me change my mind and return in 2016

Edited by Mark B on Wednesday 9th July 13:33

[gruffalo]

I think it is needed, it felt like there was a lot of between race stuffing being added this year to fill the time.

I go to this event to watch iconic cars racing not to watch a bunch of modern BMWs drive round or to watch a marching band walk up and down.

'77 to '82 is a good idea but it may be worth widening that by a few years to get the Jags and Aston Martin Nimrods and things like that included.

[crockett]

gruffalo said:

I think it is needed, it felt like there was a lot of between race stuffing being added this year to fill the time.

I go to this event to watch iconic cars racing not to watch a bunch of modern BMWs drive round or to watch a marching band walk up and down.

'77 to '82 is a good idea but it may be worth widening that by a few years to get the Jags and Aston Martin Nimrods and things like that included.

hit the nail on the head, i love the really old cars but they should consider making the fields smaller to increase the plateaus.

and who the hell was that french bloke commentating, i thought he was having a fit at times, when the english guy chirped in all he said was "the blue Bugatti is in the lead" very poor commentory i thought

[AllezWasps]

I agree. Cut down on the crap and ridiculously long delays between races and add a plateau 7.

[Spare tyre]

YES

one thing i'd love to see is the top 10% from each group all race at the end, would be fascinating to see the difference in performance

The difference in performance between the first two groups was crazy

[gt6]

Yes i would love to see a further selection of cars but with 18 races already another 3 would mean either shorter races or a reduction in the time between each race, and although i would prefer the later the safety issues and pure logistics of clearing the track and collecting the cars then sorting the next group of cars would i am sure lead to shorter races.

[lowdrag]

Just think of the maths; 6 grids give an even number of races per grid over the 24 hours. Plateau 3 on Saturday was already an hour late. How are you going to regulate 7 grids? Who loses out? During the night plateau 6, according to my marshal friend, actually had 10 minutes racing and the rest was behind the pace car. Not good value for money. But back to the question; how to regulate?

[gt6]

I agree with leaving things as they are in plateau and number of races but think that a slicker roll over from one race to the other could be achieved but I doubt it will happen

[Truckosaurus]

crockett said:

and who the hell was that french bloke commentating

Bruno Van der Something.

[XJ Flyer]

It would probably be better to introduce another seperate Classic event just for later types including Group C cars and similar period GT cars thereby making the Classic an annual event not just a bi annual one.Or remove the ealiest plateau and latest one every alternate year thereby keeping the 6 plateau system.Or move the earliest plateau to the legends support race of the main 24 event and put the Group C years plateau into the Classic.The classic events should also be run without the chicanes on the Mulsanne.

Edited by XJ Flyer on Thursday 10th July 01:16

[lowdrag]

XJ Flyer said:

It would probably be better to introduce another seperate Classic event just for later types including Group C cars and similar period GT cars thereby making the Classic an annual event not just a bi annual one.Or remove the ealiest plateau and latest one every alternate year thereby keeping the 6 plateau system.Or move the earliest plateau to the legends support race of the main 24 event and put the Group C years plateau into the Classic.The classic events should also be run without the chicanes on the Mulsanne.

1. There is already another classic event on alternate years called Le Mans Story. This is run on the Bugatti circuit.

2. Group C cars are invited to the 24 Hours every second year.

3. Alternating with the Group C are the D-types etc.

4. The chicanes are a permanent feature for safety reasons. The will not be removed.

[DS240]

gt6 said:

I agree with leaving things as they are in plateau and number of races but think that a slicker roll over from one race to the other could be achieved but I doubt it will happen

They can't even organize a simple one-way system for the open pit lane sessions at the 24hrs.

Everyone crowding in one entrance with everyone then getting to the end and then having to walk back against the flow of people.

One end in, one end out! The public then naturally reduces and flows along in the same direction.

Oh so simple.


But to be fair, the place has got so much better in terms of organization. I can only imagine though the delays in between the different races. At least by the sounds of it they put on something to look at though.

[FRMATT]

DS240 said:

They can't even organize a simple one-way system for the open pit lane sessions at the 24hrs.

Everyone crowding in one entrance with everyone then getting to the end and then having to walk back against the flow of people.

One end in, one end out! The public then naturally reduces and flows along in the same direction.

Oh so simple.


But to be fair, the place has got so much better in terms of organization. I can only imagine though the delays in between the different races. At least by the sounds of it they put on something to look at though.

It was open at both ends this year...

[rdjohn]

Spare tyre said:

YES

one thing i'd love to see is the top 10% from each group all race at the end, would be fascinating to see the difference in performance

The difference in performance between the first two groups was crazy

It seems ironic that Chris Harris would probably have qualified his D type about 10th in the Grid 6 race, despite it being set-up for a track without chicanes.

There seems to be a yawning gap between the wherewithal to buy an historic race car and the prowess to actually drive it competitively. An FIA International license is an easy obstacle to overcome if, say, you live in Belgium and do a couple of races in Holland and France to get your license. Most British club racers have much more actual racing experience.

Some day the AOC, or FIA will wake up to this fact after a serious incident. Someone will ask the obvious question as to why a driver with zero experience went out for 2 fast laps in the rain and darkness to set a time. The obvious conclusion will be that he should have been given more time to familiarise himself with the track.

But, their answer, of course will be that, in lieu of this getting useful track time, parade laps and club laps were offered to anyone who could afford them.

My view, is that they are skating on the edge of reality. The term " an accident waiting to happen " springs to mind. Hence the huge number of laps behind safety cars, which are a disappointment to the fans.

[lowdrag]

rdjohn said:

It seems ironic that Chris Harris would probably have qualified his D type about 10th in the Grid 6 race, despite it being set-up for a track without chicanes.

There seems to be a yawning gap between the wherewithal to buy an historic race car and the prowess to actually drive it competitively. An FIA International license is an easy obstacle to overcome if, say, you live in Belgium and do a couple of races in Holland and France to get your license. Most British club racers have much more actual racing experience.

Some day the AOC, or FIA will wake up to this fact after a serious incident. Someone will ask the obvious question as to why a driver with zero experience went out for 2 fast laps in the rain and darkness to set a time. The obvious conclusion will be that he should have been given more time to familiarise himself with the track.

But, their answer, of course will be that, in lieu of this getting useful track time, parade laps and club laps were offered to anyone who could afford them.

My view, is that they are skating on the edge of reality. The term " an accident waiting to happen " springs to mind. Hence the huge number of laps behind safety cars, which are a disappointment to the fans.

Well written. The whole point is that all of the modern classic racing is a question of money. I was told this weekend, and I assume it to be true, that someone coming to race from the UK counts on an overall bill of about £11,000. That is insane in my book, but there is the entry, then of course you are ripped off for your motorhome site in Houx, then petrol at 3 euros a litre, and so it goes on. "Parade" laps bring in substantial money, the rent for stands is insane and any of the serious vendors come no more, leaving it to those with margins of 300% if one is crazy enough to buy anything.

On qualifying times, in 2006 the leading car in plateau 3 had a time of about 4 minutes 45 seconds from memory, and the last car over 17 minutes. So he was lapped about four times before he completed a lap. It was the same in the main race with the GTE Am Ferrari being lapped on his fourth lap at the second chicane. Sticking with the main race for the moment, Rockenfeller's accident was purely down to a rookie amateur caught like a rabbit in the headlights, and we have already had very serious accidents in the past in the Classic. This from 2004 for example:-



Then there was Adrian Newey trying to out brake Ray Bellm in 2006:-



Will it take a death, as per Allan Simonsen last year at Tertre Rouge, before the ACO and Peter Auto react and a different class of licence is applied, properly graded? I had complained about Tertre Rouge for years since the last modification, but was ignored. I just hope and pray I am not able to say I told you so in the future. Alex Buncombe and Alain de Cadenet, for example, drive somewhat better than your average classic owner.