Realistically, whats my chance of loosing this one?
Discussion
My car was stationary, unattended, legally and safely parked at the roadside (residential street)
TP's car rolled 20m down a hill and hit it. Its made a mess of the front of mine.
(Fag packet maths, impact speed 12mph, force taken by the front passenger chassis leg.)
TP's insurers are not accepting liability.
TP are saying they need time to respond until after a full mechanical inspection of their vehicle.
I sense they are revving up for a defence of
a) My client was not negligent your honour. He applied handbrake.
b) The vehicle has been badly maintained, my client was not negligent, you go persue their maintainers.
c) The vehcile has an indemic fault , my client was not negligent , you go persue the OEM manufacturer.
TP's insurers have indicated to my broker that they have had a "number of such indidents"
As they are not accepting liability, and in fact are not really in a "dialogue" with us, I was stuck on shank's pony until I kicked off and have now (after 2.5 working days) been presented with a rather diminutive hire car , by my insurers. (Not wishing to sound ungrateful it is transport, but there isnt room for the tools of my trade and hence is a little bit of a Bournville Fire Retention System)
For 2 of those days, sensing that small car might be incoming, but not confirmed, I have been threatening to hire an equivelant sized vehicle - but warned off doing so by all and sundry "in case we loose"
Can we?
My insurers (and I have no idea how they have come to this conclusion) have said mine might be a total loss. I concur theres probably is damage we cant see,and it probably wouldnt take much hidden damage for it to go "marginal" (especially when I add my phone bill to my "losses" ) - but to date it hasnt been assessed.
How can we press, formally, for that assessment to be made ?
Because at least if I knew mine was going to be written off I could source a replacement and crack on with life, work, saving for premiums - stuff like that, and then the TP's insurers can, within reason, take as long as they need to investigate to the far end of a fart - but atleast I'll be back working.
TP's car rolled 20m down a hill and hit it. Its made a mess of the front of mine.
(Fag packet maths, impact speed 12mph, force taken by the front passenger chassis leg.)
TP's insurers are not accepting liability.
TP are saying they need time to respond until after a full mechanical inspection of their vehicle.
I sense they are revving up for a defence of
a) My client was not negligent your honour. He applied handbrake.
b) The vehicle has been badly maintained, my client was not negligent, you go persue their maintainers.
c) The vehcile has an indemic fault , my client was not negligent , you go persue the OEM manufacturer.
TP's insurers have indicated to my broker that they have had a "number of such indidents"
As they are not accepting liability, and in fact are not really in a "dialogue" with us, I was stuck on shank's pony until I kicked off and have now (after 2.5 working days) been presented with a rather diminutive hire car , by my insurers. (Not wishing to sound ungrateful it is transport, but there isnt room for the tools of my trade and hence is a little bit of a Bournville Fire Retention System)
For 2 of those days, sensing that small car might be incoming, but not confirmed, I have been threatening to hire an equivelant sized vehicle - but warned off doing so by all and sundry "in case we loose"
Can we?
My insurers (and I have no idea how they have come to this conclusion) have said mine might be a total loss. I concur theres probably is damage we cant see,and it probably wouldnt take much hidden damage for it to go "marginal" (especially when I add my phone bill to my "losses" ) - but to date it hasnt been assessed.
How can we press, formally, for that assessment to be made ?
Because at least if I knew mine was going to be written off I could source a replacement and crack on with life, work, saving for premiums - stuff like that, and then the TP's insurers can, within reason, take as long as they need to investigate to the far end of a fart - but atleast I'll be back working.
jellypig said:
My insurers (and I have no idea how they have come to this conclusion) have said mine might be a total loss. I concur theres probably is damage we cant see,and it probably wouldnt take much hidden damage for it to go "marginal" (especially when I add my phone bill to my "losses" ) - but to date it hasnt been assessed.
How much is your car worth? They generally write of if it's going to cost more that 60% of its value, although having said that, the 3rd party's insurer recently fixed the car of some friends of ours to the complete amazement of the body-shop who said the repairs were at least equal to the car's value.Do a search of the internet & you'll find some cars - esp those with the handbrake operating on the rear discs - are well known for this. As the disc cools the pads lose their grip on the disc & off they go. My wife's 307 did this, fortunately just down the drive & missed anything else.
Here's a starter:
http://www.audi-forums.com/8p-forum/37111-handbrak...
Here's a starter:
http://www.audi-forums.com/8p-forum/37111-handbrak...
paintman said:
you'll find some cars - esp those with the handbrake operating on the rear discs - are well known for this. As the disc cools the pads lose their grip on the disc & off they go.
That's a very good point, but it happens more with the handbrake on the front discs, the rear ones don't (in normal driving) get very hot.Not a cat in hell's chance of losing (note the spelling).
Plenty of posturing around this, but no way will it stick. So you're sorted on liability, of course that doesn't mean you can get a credit hire car and be guaranteed to win. Quantum and liability are two very different things.
Plenty of posturing around this, but no way will it stick. So you're sorted on liability, of course that doesn't mean you can get a credit hire car and be guaranteed to win. Quantum and liability are two very different things.
TooMany2cvs said:
From a standing start, 20m roll, and you reckon it reached 12mph - enough to write your car off? <scratches head>
I have spent an enormous amount of time listening to hold music over the last 3 days - so I solved for v in this: mgh= 0.5 m v^2
and I measured the slope of our street - he lost about 1.5m in height.
which comes up with a v of 5 and a bit m/s = 12mph.
OK, its a massive simplification, no friction etc etc.. but I was bored
And the impact was all taken at one corner.
It attempted to push the whole vehicle back - except the front passenger side wheel jammed on the kerb - and so wouldnt move with the rest.
And a 70mm diameter bull bar is flat.
So he decelerated from 5.something m/s to zero in 70mm , so solving for a = (V^2 - Vo^2 )/2d = 200m/s^2
So from F=mA and allowing 200kg of equipment (car was laden) , the F was about 4500kN
(again another massive simplication, but anything to distract from the hold music)
And tell me, should the mudgaurd be scraping along the tyre on one side of the car but not the other?
IANAL but it's pretty clear cut. He didn't secure the vehicle well enough. As others have said it's very common for cars which haven't had the handbrake firmly applied to roll once the brakes cool down.
See the highway code - https://www.gov.uk/waiting-and-parking/parking-at-...
252 - Parking on hills. If you park on a hill you should:
See the highway code - https://www.gov.uk/waiting-and-parking/parking-at-...
252 - Parking on hills. If you park on a hill you should:
- park close to the kerb and apply the handbrake firmly
- select a forward gear and turn your steering wheel away from the kerb when facing uphill
- select reverse gear and turn your steering wheel towards the kerb when facing downhill
- use ‘park’ if your car has an automatic gearbox.
LoonR1 said:
Not a cat in hell's chance of losing (note the spelling).
Plenty of posturing around this, but no way will it stick. So you're sorted on liability, of course that doesn't mean you can get a credit hire car and be guaranteed to win. Quantum and liability are two very different things.
Sorry for the spelling. English is not my first language. I usually just grunt and mumble. Plenty of posturing around this, but no way will it stick. So you're sorted on liability, of course that doesn't mean you can get a credit hire car and be guaranteed to win. Quantum and liability are two very different things.
If this vehicle has an "issue" or there is a "training need" for the operators, I am very keen that the TP's insurance do a thorough investigation at their end - they are a big employer and operate plenty of similar vehicles.
But, my reasoning for the questions is all about getting back on the road in something suitable for me to go to work.
So, all I want is for them to tell me quickly if or not if on my vehicle. I am fortunate enough to have cash reserves to go source another- if thats going to be the final result - without having the wait for a "settlement"
OR if they want to do a prolonged dance, if I can go hire something - again to get me back to work.
I confess I am massively frustrated by it all so far.
Fastdruid said:
See the highway code - https://www.gov.uk/waiting-and-parking/parking-at-...
252 - Parking on hills. If you park on a hill you should:
Yeah, thanks. Sent my broker the link to Rule 252 not long after the impact. Just for their information! 252 - Parking on hills. If you park on a hill you should:
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