Discussion
Interesting to see what people think. Its very much about predictions. Here are my thoughts.
The low sales volumes and subsequent shortage of cars has been a benefit to residual values. This must change. A rise in sales through 2014 will inevitably lead to a rise in late second hand cars spring 2015. The two year price deal may delay their arrival but sooner or later the supply will rise. This will lead to Series 3 Exiges around the £42.5K with under 10K miles. Already seeing Series 3 Elises (220bhp)at around the £32k so perhaps £29 come springtime.
For the time being the series 2 Exige will probably remain stable at around the £30K for 2010 cars. The question needs to be asked, will people ultimately prefer a later model Exige once the prices dip or will a series 2 hold up. At the moment at least the price difference in my eyes is to great to contemplate and so I dismiss it instantly. I can't help thinking nevertheless that not far down the line depreciation will rise.
Having seen a 2014 roadster at £50K, thereby already showing a 10% plus fall (still reasonable) should one assume that the coupe will drop more quickly. Will demand for the roadster be greater or less than that of its coupe derivative
Perhaps the bigger impact will be on Series 2 Elises, notably 190 R and 220 SC cars. I already think a late series 2 SC will now be more difficult to sell at £21.5K-£23K. So a late R falls back under the £20K mark, perhaps not quite now, but after the summer.
As for the lesser powered models, I think they will suffer far more. Seeing the latest offer of series 3, brand new at £30K just leads me to think we'll be seeing these cars at under £20K very shortly.
The question also needs to be asked that if a Lotus loses its label as a brand that holds its value relatively well, will that ultimately deter buyers.
Only time will tell. Who knows, rising demand for the new cars may ultimately raise demand for second hand cars, thus maintaining the status quo.
My final thought for the day. I've just seen a series 3 in Type 23 colour scheme. Strangely enough I found it less stunning than the original series 2 cars circa 2003. Either poor photos or perhaps it just doesn't work so well on the later cars. Probably means that we'll also be seeing Jim Clark series 3 cars in the not too distant future!
Anyway, the debate is launched
The low sales volumes and subsequent shortage of cars has been a benefit to residual values. This must change. A rise in sales through 2014 will inevitably lead to a rise in late second hand cars spring 2015. The two year price deal may delay their arrival but sooner or later the supply will rise. This will lead to Series 3 Exiges around the £42.5K with under 10K miles. Already seeing Series 3 Elises (220bhp)at around the £32k so perhaps £29 come springtime.
For the time being the series 2 Exige will probably remain stable at around the £30K for 2010 cars. The question needs to be asked, will people ultimately prefer a later model Exige once the prices dip or will a series 2 hold up. At the moment at least the price difference in my eyes is to great to contemplate and so I dismiss it instantly. I can't help thinking nevertheless that not far down the line depreciation will rise.
Having seen a 2014 roadster at £50K, thereby already showing a 10% plus fall (still reasonable) should one assume that the coupe will drop more quickly. Will demand for the roadster be greater or less than that of its coupe derivative
Perhaps the bigger impact will be on Series 2 Elises, notably 190 R and 220 SC cars. I already think a late series 2 SC will now be more difficult to sell at £21.5K-£23K. So a late R falls back under the £20K mark, perhaps not quite now, but after the summer.
As for the lesser powered models, I think they will suffer far more. Seeing the latest offer of series 3, brand new at £30K just leads me to think we'll be seeing these cars at under £20K very shortly.
The question also needs to be asked that if a Lotus loses its label as a brand that holds its value relatively well, will that ultimately deter buyers.
Only time will tell. Who knows, rising demand for the new cars may ultimately raise demand for second hand cars, thus maintaining the status quo.
My final thought for the day. I've just seen a series 3 in Type 23 colour scheme. Strangely enough I found it less stunning than the original series 2 cars circa 2003. Either poor photos or perhaps it just doesn't work so well on the later cars. Probably means that we'll also be seeing Jim Clark series 3 cars in the not too distant future!
Anyway, the debate is launched
I think you are a bit pessimistic. Exige v6 will remain strong as there will be stronger demand than supply once they get down in the low/mid £40k's.... I can't see it being Evora levels of demand that would warrant a quick fall.
Supply all knocks on - production was very low for a long while having shown new cars, put dealers on notice and general destruction of the supply chain. Gives people the choice of going older maybe paying more for low mileage or high spec car - or moving up and paying more for the likes of the sc/v6.
People taking cars to France has gobbled up lots of supply too
s1 has been going up in value - everyone tipping it as a future classic....
Supply all knocks on - production was very low for a long while having shown new cars, put dealers on notice and general destruction of the supply chain. Gives people the choice of going older maybe paying more for low mileage or high spec car - or moving up and paying more for the likes of the sc/v6.
People taking cars to France has gobbled up lots of supply too
s1 has been going up in value - everyone tipping it as a future classic....
It's all relative. Production is still very low, there are still no real alternatives in the marketplace and the number of drivers bored with numb and overly assisted daily drivers must be the highest it's ever been. Plus some of the classic Porsche and other weekend cars have been priced out of many peoples pockets so perhaps 2nd hand Loti might fill that gap too.
Early S2 Elise's are still worth 30%+ of original list price at 14 years old so there must be solid demand. I agree the S3 Elise will mix things up a bit, to my eyes they are very pretty and personally I prefer them to the late S2's they compete with but that would be true of most cars as they go through facelifts.
Early S2 Elise's are still worth 30%+ of original list price at 14 years old so there must be solid demand. I agree the S3 Elise will mix things up a bit, to my eyes they are very pretty and personally I prefer them to the late S2's they compete with but that would be true of most cars as they go through facelifts.
This car illustrates to me where I think things are moving on series 3 cars
http://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/2014...
At £30K for a 2012 car it makes more sense to me than a 2009 SC series 2 for example at around the £23K mark, so prices moving downwards.
This car however defies all logic. Fabulous looking car but the price is the wrong side of what I would consider to be attainable, by a long way.
http://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/l...
The RGB that featured in the classifieds last week was far far better.
And the following two cars show that Exige series 3 cars are creeping downwards. I'd take either, but haven't got the necessary dosh. If these are customers cars, they've sold for less
http://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/l...
http://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/l...
http://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/2014...
At £30K for a 2012 car it makes more sense to me than a 2009 SC series 2 for example at around the £23K mark, so prices moving downwards.
This car however defies all logic. Fabulous looking car but the price is the wrong side of what I would consider to be attainable, by a long way.
http://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/l...
The RGB that featured in the classifieds last week was far far better.
And the following two cars show that Exige series 3 cars are creeping downwards. I'd take either, but haven't got the necessary dosh. If these are customers cars, they've sold for less
http://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/l...
http://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/l...
Interesting, to the extent that the market in Europe has taken advantage of the EUR:GBP exchange rate then what happens if sterling strengthens further. The rate got down to EUR1.06 to GBP1, but is now heading to 1.27. Will the continental buyers dissappear as UK cars are now 25% more expensive for them, hence lowering the market price as there are fewer buyers?
It appears that a RHD car sold here in France is always worth less than a LHD, so will these RHD cars start flowing back to the UK if sterling strengthens putting more pressure on the price?
On the other hand if sterling starts dropping again (Scottish independence anyone) then more European buyers might be tempted to acquire a RHD Lotus from the UK.
It appears that a RHD car sold here in France is always worth less than a LHD, so will these RHD cars start flowing back to the UK if sterling strengthens putting more pressure on the price?
On the other hand if sterling starts dropping again (Scottish independence anyone) then more European buyers might be tempted to acquire a RHD Lotus from the UK.
trunnie said:
Interesting, to the extent that the market in Europe has taken advantage of the EUR:GBP exchange rate then what happens if sterling strengthens further. The rate got down to EUR1.06 to GBP1, but is now heading to 1.27. Will the continental buyers dissappear as UK cars are now 25% more expensive for them, hence lowering the market price as there are fewer buyers?
It appears that a RHD car sold here in France is always worth less than a LHD, so will these RHD cars start flowing back to the UK if sterling strengthens putting more pressure on the price?
On the other hand if sterling starts dropping again (Scottish independence anyone) then more European buyers might be tempted to acquire a RHD Lotus from the UK.
As a Brit in France its interesting to follow prices here and in the UK. As stated, the GBP is now too strong and so UK sourced cars are far less attractive. Current rates could well see a reverse, with RHD cars returning to the UK. I might even consider marketing mine as it would perhaps enable me to get a LHD example (The only reason I would want to change as I absolutely adore my current car) LHD cars are around £6/7 K more expensive even now, but I'd probably get at least half of that back by selling now which makes it an option to consider. This having been said, its the devil I know so perhaps wiser to keep it. It appears that a RHD car sold here in France is always worth less than a LHD, so will these RHD cars start flowing back to the UK if sterling strengthens putting more pressure on the price?
On the other hand if sterling starts dropping again (Scottish independence anyone) then more European buyers might be tempted to acquire a RHD Lotus from the UK.
All the same UK buyers should perhaps consider looking abroad to repatriate cars. Perhaps just the hassle of paperwork but that works both ways. My Elise when I imported it to France was straightforward with the COC. No added costs. Don't know how it would work in the opposite direction.
With France still suffering from the crisis, with no visible signs of a recovery, It is more than likely that French prices will fall.
Strangely enough Lotus say sales in Europe, notably France are increasing. Don't know where they are. I go for months without seeing another Lotus.
hamzamian said:
That yellow one is lovely
If only I could justify the extra £20k to buy it over mine...
It is, but I am not sure I could drive around in a fake Cup, no matter how gorgeous it looks.If only I could justify the extra £20k to buy it over mine...
Talking of yellow ones, there's a 2005 yellow S2 Exige that's popped up in the classifieds at £26.5k which seems a tad high.
Shnozz said:
It is, but I am not sure I could drive around in a fake Cup, no matter how gorgeous it looks.
Talking of yellow ones, there's a 2005 yellow S2 Exige that's popped up in the classifieds at £26.5k which seems a tad high.
Agree its OTT on the price and find the description ambiguos. Doesn't detail the model. Theres no photo of the engine. Talks about a power upgrade but doesn't say how much. Love the colour but the private seller offering his 2008 220 at £21500, seems far far far better value-its just black. Talking of yellow ones, there's a 2005 yellow S2 Exige that's popped up in the classifieds at £26.5k which seems a tad high.
simpo555 said:
Agree its OTT on the price and find the description ambiguos. Doesn't detail the model. Theres no photo of the engine. Talks about a power upgrade but doesn't say how much. Love the colour but the private seller offering his 2008 220 at £21500, seems far far far better value-its just black.
That's a CAT D...gashead1105 said:
That's a CAT D...
Agreed. Wouldn't discount it though. Sometimes to much attention paid to this sort of thing. I visited a dealer recently. Several cars in various states of repair after accidents. I think a lot more cars than revealed have been repaired. Obviously diffent levels. I find that almost normal. Asides from road accidents the number of track accidents seem quite high. At the time I thought, wouldn't buy that but then when you see the parts replaced and the end result its perhaps not so bad. Properly repaired by specialists and not cowboys then why not.
At the end of the day its always down to condition, history and price. Starting price £21.5 for a 2008 low mileage, 218Bhp car doesnt seem unreasonable even for Cat D. Interesting to see what people think its worth.
simpo555 said:
Agreed. Wouldn't discount it though. Sometimes to much attention paid to this sort of thing. I visited a dealer recently. Several cars in various states of repair after accidents. I think a lot more cars than revealed have been repaired. Obviously diffent levels. I find that almost normal. Asides from road accidents the number of track accidents seem quite high.
At the time I thought, wouldn't buy that but then when you see the parts replaced and the end result its perhaps not so bad. Properly repaired by specialists and not cowboys then why not.
At the end of the day its always down to condition, history and price. Starting price £21.5 for a 2008 low mileage, 218Bhp car doesnt seem unreasonable even for Cat D. Interesting to see what people think its worth.
Something doesn't quite add up with that car. Sept 2008 but with old dash and old style key...? Ride height doesn't look quite right either. At the time I thought, wouldn't buy that but then when you see the parts replaced and the end result its perhaps not so bad. Properly repaired by specialists and not cowboys then why not.
At the end of the day its always down to condition, history and price. Starting price £21.5 for a 2008 low mileage, 218Bhp car doesnt seem unreasonable even for Cat D. Interesting to see what people think its worth.
Interesting post
As a Lotus trader (www.lotushardtops.com) more so in the slightly older stuff but I think we have probably sold almost the most through the last year of any independent so my 2p:
Mileage is and always will be king. The red S3 highlighted as an indication of the tumble of S2 SC cars is a red herring as 18k is very high mileage for a car of that age. We just sold an S3 1.6 this week for £27000 in 2 days so there is clearly a demand for the newer cars which is understandable given the woeful production numbers since 20009.
The SC cars are probably the most sought after variant when we come to S2. They sold so few of these cars that they are always in incredibly high demand. 23-25k is very easily achievable again as long as you have nice low miles.
The Exige S2 is always a bit of a niche this model seems to be even more mileage sensitive than any other Lotus. Sub 20k mile cars will always command a strong premium with prices dropping of considerably at 30k+
The regular S2s continue to do well we have sold allsorts this year from 44k Sport tourers to 111R's nothing has really been in stock too long. We usually have sub 30k cars in stock which helps but if priced well you can still trade in the higher mileage cars.
It may be a shocker but as ever low miles is the key to keeping prices buoyant. We have achieved some strong prices this year on good clean low mileage S2 on both Rover and Toyota cars.
My tip for this year/next year is to snaffle yourself a 20k 111S. These will be 20k next year.
As a Lotus trader (www.lotushardtops.com) more so in the slightly older stuff but I think we have probably sold almost the most through the last year of any independent so my 2p:
Mileage is and always will be king. The red S3 highlighted as an indication of the tumble of S2 SC cars is a red herring as 18k is very high mileage for a car of that age. We just sold an S3 1.6 this week for £27000 in 2 days so there is clearly a demand for the newer cars which is understandable given the woeful production numbers since 20009.
The SC cars are probably the most sought after variant when we come to S2. They sold so few of these cars that they are always in incredibly high demand. 23-25k is very easily achievable again as long as you have nice low miles.
The Exige S2 is always a bit of a niche this model seems to be even more mileage sensitive than any other Lotus. Sub 20k mile cars will always command a strong premium with prices dropping of considerably at 30k+
The regular S2s continue to do well we have sold allsorts this year from 44k Sport tourers to 111R's nothing has really been in stock too long. We usually have sub 30k cars in stock which helps but if priced well you can still trade in the higher mileage cars.
It may be a shocker but as ever low miles is the key to keeping prices buoyant. We have achieved some strong prices this year on good clean low mileage S2 on both Rover and Toyota cars.
My tip for this year/next year is to snaffle yourself a 20k 111S. These will be 20k next year.
Edited by fridaypassion on Wednesday 30th July 21:24
Seems to me that the summer market is over. Prices moving downwards on all fronts. I still think we'll see series 3 Exiges at around the £42.5 (private sale) in the not too distant future. B+C have £48K 2012 Exige and they tend to be at the top end. Series 3 Elises (S) are cropping up far more often at around the £31/32 mark with H-tops inc in the price. Series 2 Exiges that were flying out the doors in spring at premium prices are hanging around a lot longer. There are series 3 Elises (134) at £20K now which has a knock on effect. I think low mileage 111R's that were hitting the £20k mark not long ago will drop to around the £17.5K level which will see the return of the higher mileage 111R (50/60k miles) in the £13/14K price band.
Remains nothing but predictions. The only certainty is that prices are moving downwards and that perhaps the downward spiral is stronger than we have seen in the last couple of years. Time will tell.
Remains nothing but predictions. The only certainty is that prices are moving downwards and that perhaps the downward spiral is stronger than we have seen in the last couple of years. Time will tell.
What is the point of this thread?? Talking down prices?? Why??
I bought my Exige as a great drivers car and not an investment. At the end of the day most cars lose money, this is not a surprise to anyone, but for sure a Lotus loses less than most.
If you are worried about the value of yours sell it.
I bought my Exige as a great drivers car and not an investment. At the end of the day most cars lose money, this is not a surprise to anyone, but for sure a Lotus loses less than most.
If you are worried about the value of yours sell it.
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