Engine Oil Quality

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Discussion

Bluehawk

Original Poster:

494 posts

165 months

Friday 1st August 2014
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Prompted by another ongoing thread i got thinking about Engine Oil Quality...

Obviously i know the differences between the Engine oil grades etc...
5W 30
5W 40
10W 30
10W 40 etc....

But how does your cheap Euro Car Parts TripleQX engine oil stack up to the likes of Castrol in terms of Quality...

For example, if you ran an engine full of 1, then switched straight to another, would you notice any difference when driving it?
Do the cheaper brands ultimately reduce engine life?

As i can only assume (i don't know much about it) that the bigger brands perhaps add life enhancing additives perhaps?

Or is it another case of ultimately they all get it from the same place, stick their label on it and sell it?

kambites

67,461 posts

220 months

Friday 1st August 2014
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Bluehawk said:
But how does your cheap Euro Car Parts TripleQX engine oil stack up to the likes of Castrol in terms of Quality...
I can't see it now, but I did find a proper group test of a load of oils (carried out in the US) and the results were... interesting to say the least. Some of the big-brand fully synthetics were appalling compared to some much cheaper ones.

ETA: Ah here we go: http://www.animegame.com/cars/Oil%20Tests.pdf

Edited by kambites on Friday 1st August 11:59

Noesph

1,148 posts

148 months

Friday 1st August 2014
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Interesting read, although its make me a bit worried as I use elf evolution 5w40 in my own car and it didn't do to well in that test.

anonymous-user

53 months

Friday 1st August 2014
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That is an interesting read, but from my limited knowledge I would have thought that performance in one test is really not indicative of all the characteristics of the oil.

Frankthered

1,619 posts

179 months

Friday 1st August 2014
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dme123 said:
That is an interesting read, but from my limited knowledge I would have thought that performance in one test is really not indicative of all the characteristics of the oil.
I didn't read the full article - don't have time just now at work, but I must admit my first thought was what test did they do and how representative is it?

At first glance the test rig does look like something I saw Royal Purple used in some marketing videos.

I'll try to give it a proper read later!

kambites

67,461 posts

220 months

Friday 1st August 2014
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Yeah, I have no idea of the validity of the test. I'm not an oil expert.

Hasbeen

2,073 posts

220 months

Friday 1st August 2014
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Todays oils make the stuff from 50 years ago look like dirty water. Most of them are very good, even the cheap stuff.

I raced a Morgan +4 in the early 60s, using BP corse, their top racing oil of the day. Racing at Bathurst, where we were getting 6250 RPM down Conrod straight, we had to change big end slippers between practice & racing. We could not get more than 60 miles before the slipper in the rod cap was down to copper.

Today people racing the same cars & engines in classic racing, using a range of modern oils, revving somewhat higher, get a full season with no wear showing.

anonymous-user

53 months

Friday 1st August 2014
quotequote all
Hasbeen said:
Todays oils make the stuff from 50 years ago look like dirty water. Most of them are very good, even the cheap stuff.

I raced a Morgan +4 in the early 60s, using BP corse, their top racing oil of the day. Racing at Bathurst, where we were getting 6250 RPM down Conrod straight, we had to change big end slippers between practice & racing. We could not get more than 60 miles before the slipper in the rod cap was down to copper.

Today people racing the same cars & engines in classic racing, using a range of modern oils, revving somewhat higher, get a full season with no wear showing.
That really does say a lot. I want to find a way to say "cool story bro" that actually means that's a really cool story. It also makes you realise that the long service intervals are probably completely sensible.

kambites

67,461 posts

220 months

Friday 1st August 2014
quotequote all
dme123 said:
That really does say a lot. I want to find a way to say "cool story bro" that actually means that's a really cool story. It also makes you realise that the long service intervals are probably completely sensible.
There's no particular reason that longevity and lubrication properties when young should be linked, although personally I'm unconvinced that changing oil even as frequently as manufacturers tend to recommend now is really necessary under normal usage.

cheesesliceking

1,571 posts

239 months

Friday 1st August 2014
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kambites said:
There's no particular reason that longevity and lubrication properties when young should be linked, although personally I'm unconvinced that changing oil even as frequently as manufacturers tend to recommend now is really necessary under normal usage.
What makes you unconvinced?

oilslick

901 posts

185 months

Friday 1st August 2014
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kambites said:
I can't see it now, but I did find a proper group test of a load of oils (carried out in the US) and the results were... interesting to say the least. Some of the big-brand fully synthetics were appalling compared to some much cheaper ones.

ETA: Ah here we go: http://www.animegame.com/cars/Oil%20Tests.pdf

Edited by kambites on Friday 1st August 11:59
Looks like one of those test benches they use to demo snake oil teflon additives. Not sure how much stock I'd put in the results.

kambites

67,461 posts

220 months

Friday 1st August 2014
quotequote all
cheesesliceking said:
kambites said:
There's no particular reason that longevity and lubrication properties when young should be linked, although personally I'm unconvinced that changing oil even as frequently as manufacturers tend to recommend now is really necessary under normal usage.
What makes you unconvinced?
The fact that the only people who say regular oil changes are necessary are those who have a financial interest in people doing regular oil changes, and the fact that I ran the OH's old shed of a Fiat Punto without an oil change for over five years and about 30k miles, then stripped the engine down and could find absolutely no signs of wear. It was still running fine until the MoT rules changed so the dead power steering motor put it beyond economical repair.

I still change the oil in my car regularly because it's cheap and I don't have enough evidence that it's not necessary, but I remain sceptical.

Edited by kambites on Friday 1st August 15:27

cheesesliceking

1,571 posts

239 months

Friday 1st August 2014
quotequote all
kambites said:
The fact that the only people who say regular oil changes are necessary are those who have a financial interest in people doing regular oil changes, and the fact that I ran the OH's old shed of a Fiat Punto without an oil change for over five years and about 30k miles, then stripped the engine down and could find absolutely no signs of wear.

I still change the oil in my car regularly because it's cheap and I don't have enough evidence that it's not necessary, but I remain sceptical.
Fair enough, I dont disagree, in fact I did similar to you but with a 205 not a Punto with no ill effects.
However now I have one still relatively new car and one with an engine thats prone to kabooming, so like yourself i still change regularly, it's cheap enough and simple to do so why not smile

Jimmyarm

1,962 posts

177 months

Friday 1st August 2014
quotequote all
dme123 said:
That really does say a lot. I want to find a way to say "cool story bro" that actually means that's a really cool story. It also makes you realise that the long service intervals are probably completely sensible.
Isn't this in part down to better component manufacturing/material quality though, or are they using all 'old stock' parts ?

I suspect it is a combination of the oil and better quality components rather than just the higher quality oil blends.


As for never changing the oil on the Punto, I'll counter that with a 80,000 mile Kia thing that the lady owner had never had serviced since new. She bought it in as it was making funny noises, the piston rings had pretty much dissapeared on one cylinder and the cam lobes were fecked wink

Limpet

6,293 posts

160 months

Friday 1st August 2014
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On joining a former employer, I took over a mk1 Focus TDDi from another employee that had never been serviced in the 63,000 miles it had covered. I had it serviced immediately, and put another 40k on it with no drama at all. Felt or sounded no different to one that had been serviced by the book, even at over 100k.

On my own cars, I tend to follow manufacturer's advice. Necessary or not, it makes me feel better.



Spare tyre

9,458 posts

129 months

Friday 1st August 2014
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i ran my 406 to 330 thousand when i sold it with with 12 month mot

about 290 of those miles were run on eurocarparts cheapo oil

it was changed every 6k mind

anonymous-user

53 months

Friday 1st August 2014
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I can't help but feel that the UK population in general (pistonheaders excluded perhaps) has an unhealthy relationship with oil and oil changes.

If you come over to the US you can drive into a garage and get an oil change for 30 quid. The Americans I've spoken to are horrified at the oil change intervals we use.

I think in the UK people get their oil changed when going for a service, whereas a quick mid service oil change may well do wonders for the life of your engine. And after all its only a 30 minute job and most of that time is waiting for the oil to drain.

That article was interesting. I only know a small amount about oil grades, viscosities etc and I was a little concerned also with the validity of the test.

As mentioned modern oils have come a long way, but perhaps in the UK the general public need to worry less about the quality and more about the intervals?

anonymous-user

53 months

Friday 1st August 2014
quotequote all
Spare tyre said:
i ran my 406 to 330 thousand when i sold it with with 12 month mot

about 290 of those miles were run on eurocarparts cheapo oil

it was changed every 6k mind
Backed up my argument nicely!

littleredrooster

5,523 posts

195 months

Friday 1st August 2014
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I used to use a pool car - a Mk I Astra 1600 - which had over 140,000 miles on it. The service book had one stamp at 10,000 miles. It was used and abused by every Tom, Dick and Harry and went like the absolute clappers. Maybe once a year, somebody would put half-a-pint of fork-lift universal oil in it.

Unlike most other Vauxhalls of the era, this one had NOT had cam failure.

opieoilman

4,408 posts

235 months

Friday 1st August 2014
quotequote all
kambites said:
I can't see it now, but I did find a proper group test of a load of oils (carried out in the US) and the results were... interesting to say the least. Some of the big-brand fully synthetics were appalling compared to some much cheaper ones.

ETA: Ah here we go: http://www.animegame.com/cars/Oil%20Tests.pdf

Edited by kambites on Friday 1st August 11:59
Hi

This test comes up on various forums every month or so, but unfortunately it's not really of any use.

The method of testing they use is the Falex machine and it doesn't replicate what the oil goes through in an engine. High temperatures, combustion by products etc are not considered, they just measure how much wear occurs when two pieces of metal are forced together. There have been demonstrations with the Falex machine showing that beer, milk and urine have provided better protection than an oil.

The oils used in that test are old, I think they have all been either replaced or updated since that test took place.

Apparently, one of the oil companies that did very well was behind that test and article, so it was potentially biased.

Cheers

Tim