Making the move - real world opinion
Discussion
I think you are missing the point on wage if you are earning slightly more than average and your wife is on a bit more again then as a family that puts you at $150 to $160k or more.
ETA I know someone who returned to the UK because she felt she couldn't afford to live there on $67k. The only accommodation she was able to afford was awful, according to her. So certainly she would dispute that you can live acceptably well in Perth on less than $70k. As a couple each on that, then yes, but as a single person? She didn't think so.
ETA I know someone who returned to the UK because she felt she couldn't afford to live there on $67k. The only accommodation she was able to afford was awful, according to her. So certainly she would dispute that you can live acceptably well in Perth on less than $70k. As a couple each on that, then yes, but as a single person? She didn't think so.
Edited by HenryJM on Thursday 28th August 06:31
madazrx7 said:
This is a good thread for me to read as I seriously consider moving back to England.
It has reminded me of and highlighted so many of the reasons I want to make the move.
I've just returned to Perth from England and I can't wait to get out of here.
I'll let you know when I'm leaving chaps, but this time I'm choosing the pub!
I'm with you. Must get out of here!It has reminded me of and highlighted so many of the reasons I want to make the move.
I've just returned to Perth from England and I can't wait to get out of here.
I'll let you know when I'm leaving chaps, but this time I'm choosing the pub!
Coatesy351 said:
madazrx7 said:
This is a good thread for me to read as I seriously consider moving back to England.
It has reminded me of and highlighted so many of the reasons I want to make the move.
I've just returned to Perth from England and I can't wait to get out of here.
I'll let you know when I'm leaving chaps, but this time I'm choosing the pub!
I'm with you. Must get out of here!It has reminded me of and highlighted so many of the reasons I want to make the move.
I've just returned to Perth from England and I can't wait to get out of here.
I'll let you know when I'm leaving chaps, but this time I'm choosing the pub!
speedysoprano said:
Coatesy351 said:
madazrx7 said:
This is a good thread for me to read as I seriously consider moving back to England.
It has reminded me of and highlighted so many of the reasons I want to make the move.
I've just returned to Perth from England and I can't wait to get out of here.
I'll let you know when I'm leaving chaps, but this time I'm choosing the pub!
I'm with you. Must get out of here!It has reminded me of and highlighted so many of the reasons I want to make the move.
I've just returned to Perth from England and I can't wait to get out of here.
I'll let you know when I'm leaving chaps, but this time I'm choosing the pub!
To the OP, wouldn't want to give advice but a biggy seems to be family. If you or the missus is close to family that are all in your home country then from what I've seen it tends not to work out.
custardtart said:
speedysoprano said:
Coatesy351 said:
madazrx7 said:
This is a good thread for me to read as I seriously consider moving back to England.
It has reminded me of and highlighted so many of the reasons I want to make the move.
I've just returned to Perth from England and I can't wait to get out of here.
I'll let you know when I'm leaving chaps, but this time I'm choosing the pub!
I'm with you. Must get out of here!It has reminded me of and highlighted so many of the reasons I want to make the move.
I've just returned to Perth from England and I can't wait to get out of here.
I'll let you know when I'm leaving chaps, but this time I'm choosing the pub!
To the OP, wouldn't want to give advice but a biggy seems to be family. If you or the missus is close to family that are all in your home country then from what I've seen it tends not to work out.
I recently went (sort of) the other way - from Wellington NZ to Brighton UK. This site was quite handy for getting a good comparision of living costs. http://www.numbeo.com/cost-of-living/compare_citie...
Another idea I haven't seen raised - if you aren't emigrating with a lot of cash backup, how about starting out on a smaller scale? A two bedroom apartment near the city centre, ideally within walking distance of work and shops. Cheaper living, less need for a car, and potentially a better social life.
This is exactly what I've done, gone from suburban to urban lifestyle, and it is great so far.
I can still see the double-garage suburban dream in my future though...
Another idea I haven't seen raised - if you aren't emigrating with a lot of cash backup, how about starting out on a smaller scale? A two bedroom apartment near the city centre, ideally within walking distance of work and shops. Cheaper living, less need for a car, and potentially a better social life.
This is exactly what I've done, gone from suburban to urban lifestyle, and it is great so far.
I can still see the double-garage suburban dream in my future though...
Living without a car in central-ish Brisbane was a piece of cake. Without kids... Once you have a child the social life will centre more around visiting friends' houses, which makes a car pretty much essential.
But to the chap in Brighton - it's London-on-sea and a lot of fun, and better without a car (unless you're a car nut that can't live without having a car as a plaything).
But to the chap in Brighton - it's London-on-sea and a lot of fun, and better without a car (unless you're a car nut that can't live without having a car as a plaything).
speedysoprano said:
'Tis indeed a funny old world. I guess it depends what your definition of a better lifestyle is - mine is being able to see lots of rock bands/theatre/opera/concerts without breaking the bank (they're SO much more expensive and infrequent in Australia), a short walk to several decent boozers and restaurants, and career prospects in the arts. None of which I had in Australia.
One thing to remember is that Perth is still a big country town, with quite high living expenses compared to the east coast, and fewer restaraunts / theaters / concerts than Melb/Sydney/Brisbane.If you are looking to move here permanently, consider Perth a starting point because of the work, but you may find the east coast more to your liking : cooler and cheaper, with better amenities, and a more cosmopolitan lifestyle.
I'm in Sydney so other people's direct experience of Perth is more pertinent, but I'd add to the argument that the cost of living is very very high. We term it 'relentlessly expensive' in our house as nothing is cheap. I've never earnt more, yet we spend all that we have each month and with two young ones we're not exactly out on the coke and hookers every night.
A lot of people I know keep their heads above water but do not feel like they're progressing in life and each month the prospect of owning a place and really settling down gets less likely as property is soaring. Property prices vs. income are one of the highest ratios in the world and unfortunatley the market is supported by tax incentives so a proper crash is unlikely.
Bear that in mind if your plans are long term and you're not in a career with big leaps in income likely in the next few years. I know a number of people who've left after spending a few years here because whilst they like it they're not keen on renting for life.
A lot of people I know keep their heads above water but do not feel like they're progressing in life and each month the prospect of owning a place and really settling down gets less likely as property is soaring. Property prices vs. income are one of the highest ratios in the world and unfortunatley the market is supported by tax incentives so a proper crash is unlikely.
Bear that in mind if your plans are long term and you're not in a career with big leaps in income likely in the next few years. I know a number of people who've left after spending a few years here because whilst they like it they're not keen on renting for life.
Edited by Hitch78 on Monday 1st September 07:39
We are fairly recent additions to Perth, been here about two months now. We left the UK and our Limited Company behind, I was a Freelance IT Security Consultant and earning around £160k per annum (turnover) and was offered a job here on the upper figures mentioned above.
So we did it for the lifestyle not any kind of salary increase! However, so far we are pretty comfortable, $600 rent a week, 3 of us in the family (my Son is 11) and we've had no issues so far.
To be honest we find living costs here not much higher than the South Coast of the UK, yep, for sure some stuff is eye wateringly expensive, some fruits for example, but other things like beef is massively cheaper than the UK, so it balances out.
The biggest thing we've noticed is that stuff has considerably longer shelf lives here compared to the UK, so we don't chuck food out at all compared to the UK.
We bought our cars out right, running costs seem cheaper than home, both of us had no issues getting the full no claims discount by showing our renewal letters from the UK.
We live in Mindarie, in the Northern suburbs and I commute in to Perth CBD by train, which is a 40 minute journey and costs the equivalent of about £8 a day return including car parking, in the UK for me to go to London, which granted, was double the journey time cost me £85 return.
Little things like a take away coffee is in my opinion a little cheaper here than the UK, $5 here for a large latte for example.
We are yet to get the gas and electric bills in, and whilst given the size and lack of insulation in our current rental, I'm not anticipating it being massively more than the cost of heating our old four bed detached in Southampton, that was about £1,400 a year!
We love it here, unfortunately I haven't been too well since arriving which has put a slight downer on things but everyone we have met has been brilliant, very helpful and very friendly, locals and fellow migrants!
We are just waiting for the warm weather now...............
Stef
So we did it for the lifestyle not any kind of salary increase! However, so far we are pretty comfortable, $600 rent a week, 3 of us in the family (my Son is 11) and we've had no issues so far.
To be honest we find living costs here not much higher than the South Coast of the UK, yep, for sure some stuff is eye wateringly expensive, some fruits for example, but other things like beef is massively cheaper than the UK, so it balances out.
The biggest thing we've noticed is that stuff has considerably longer shelf lives here compared to the UK, so we don't chuck food out at all compared to the UK.
We bought our cars out right, running costs seem cheaper than home, both of us had no issues getting the full no claims discount by showing our renewal letters from the UK.
We live in Mindarie, in the Northern suburbs and I commute in to Perth CBD by train, which is a 40 minute journey and costs the equivalent of about £8 a day return including car parking, in the UK for me to go to London, which granted, was double the journey time cost me £85 return.
Little things like a take away coffee is in my opinion a little cheaper here than the UK, $5 here for a large latte for example.
We are yet to get the gas and electric bills in, and whilst given the size and lack of insulation in our current rental, I'm not anticipating it being massively more than the cost of heating our old four bed detached in Southampton, that was about £1,400 a year!
We love it here, unfortunately I haven't been too well since arriving which has put a slight downer on things but everyone we have met has been brilliant, very helpful and very friendly, locals and fellow migrants!
We are just waiting for the warm weather now...............
Stef
Hi all, once again thank you to all that have contributed to the thread so far. It's hugely helpful and is really providing some food for thought and laying out the realities of life in Australia.
This has allowed us to take à more measured view of the offer we've received and put a plan in place to look at it in a little more detail. We're hoping to answer most of our questions in the next few months and then head over early next year to take a look around on the ground, look at a few areas to rent, some nurseries etc and just see how it feels. From that we'll return home and make the decision.
I'm certainly on the fence at the moment. A big concern is the ratio of income to property prices which suggests that renting would be a long term proposition. Similarly, it seems that 'getting by' financially in the UK is perhaps more comfortable, albeit not as nice
I'll update this thread as we progress as there is some really good info here that I, and I'm sure others will find useful. I'm sure I'll have more questions in due course too if you folks don't mind?
Thanks again!
This has allowed us to take à more measured view of the offer we've received and put a plan in place to look at it in a little more detail. We're hoping to answer most of our questions in the next few months and then head over early next year to take a look around on the ground, look at a few areas to rent, some nurseries etc and just see how it feels. From that we'll return home and make the decision.
I'm certainly on the fence at the moment. A big concern is the ratio of income to property prices which suggests that renting would be a long term proposition. Similarly, it seems that 'getting by' financially in the UK is perhaps more comfortable, albeit not as nice
I'll update this thread as we progress as there is some really good info here that I, and I'm sure others will find useful. I'm sure I'll have more questions in due course too if you folks don't mind?
Thanks again!
Good luck with what you decide.
When you visit try and take a realistic look - do the freeway at rush hour, try the public transport, go to a few rental viewings (not just new home display villages), look at a few car dealers etc.
A lot of people I think turn up on a 2 week jolly, lay in, venture our between 10 and 3 when the roads are quiet, sit by the sea in the sun, drink in the cappuccino strips, shop when its quiet and basically have a great relaxing holiday. Do enjoy it but sitting in 30 degrees by the beach not at work makes any feel great!
Obvious I know but just saying, you know...
When you visit try and take a realistic look - do the freeway at rush hour, try the public transport, go to a few rental viewings (not just new home display villages), look at a few car dealers etc.
A lot of people I think turn up on a 2 week jolly, lay in, venture our between 10 and 3 when the roads are quiet, sit by the sea in the sun, drink in the cappuccino strips, shop when its quiet and basically have a great relaxing holiday. Do enjoy it but sitting in 30 degrees by the beach not at work makes any feel great!
Obvious I know but just saying, you know...
I think you'll make the money situation work and this really isn't what will 'make or break' your emigration plans.
HASBEEN hit on the real issue and it's one of culture change.
There's been plenty of UK couples (and a Canadian pair) we know who've headed back home.
Mainly because they just didn't like or understand or enjoy the culture.
Newcastle to Perth is like comparing Eastenders to Home and Away. Lego to Duplo, Dickens to Ludlum etc... There is a culture in Australia, but it's different and certainly not as 'deep' as the UK.
If you're happy in Newcastle, enjoying your local pub or community, surrounded with friends, can put up with the weather and traffic. Happy to have your child grow up there. And just not itching to get out. Then you'll be heading back to the UK within 2 years.
If you're feeling none of the things I mentioned above, I think you should make the move.
Good luck either way.
HASBEEN hit on the real issue and it's one of culture change.
There's been plenty of UK couples (and a Canadian pair) we know who've headed back home.
Mainly because they just didn't like or understand or enjoy the culture.
Newcastle to Perth is like comparing Eastenders to Home and Away. Lego to Duplo, Dickens to Ludlum etc... There is a culture in Australia, but it's different and certainly not as 'deep' as the UK.
If you're happy in Newcastle, enjoying your local pub or community, surrounded with friends, can put up with the weather and traffic. Happy to have your child grow up there. And just not itching to get out. Then you'll be heading back to the UK within 2 years.
If you're feeling none of the things I mentioned above, I think you should make the move.
Good luck either way.
robm3 said:
If you're happy in Newcastle, enjoying your local pub or community, surrounded with friends, can put up with the weather and traffic. Happy to have your child grow up there. And just not itching to get out. Then you'll be heading back to the UK within 2 years.
If you're feeling none of the things I mentioned above, I think you should make the move.
This. This is a great comment.If you're feeling none of the things I mentioned above, I think you should make the move.
Sorry for missing the last few comments, thanks for the input. I think you're right about the depth of culture.
Making the move because we're a little pissed off here is a long term solution to a short term issue and I'm much more on the fence than I was previously.
But, not one for regret and I'd hate to say I never even looked, so we're booked up and will be out there in circa 8 weeks to have a good snoop around for a few weeks and see how it feels.
It's pretty much decision time for us, and new things are a'happening either here or there, so the house is going up for sale shortly and I've been looking at liquidating a few assets (that'll not take long).
Tally ho!
Making the move because we're a little pissed off here is a long term solution to a short term issue and I'm much more on the fence than I was previously.
But, not one for regret and I'd hate to say I never even looked, so we're booked up and will be out there in circa 8 weeks to have a good snoop around for a few weeks and see how it feels.
It's pretty much decision time for us, and new things are a'happening either here or there, so the house is going up for sale shortly and I've been looking at liquidating a few assets (that'll not take long).
Tally ho!
200bhp said:
Not much to add in the way of opinion as the others have said it all. There was something on TV the other day that said the average Perth salary was around $70k and the average FIFO (fly-in-fly-out) salary was $140k. I struggle to see how people survive on the average, and even how they would live comfortably on $140k. Maybe we just spend too much?
I was lucky because when we made the move I had a job to come to that pays every 2 weeks, we had our first 4 weeks accommodation paid for and had a work vehicle to use whilst we found our feet. I was also at the stage in my career when I was ready to take a big step up and the profession is better paid in Australia than the UK - Using the exchange rate alone for the sums, I more than tripled my salary by making the move.
Personally I know it's possible to start-up here with very little. We bought our UK house in 2004 and sold in 2008 meaning that we lost the best part of GBP14k. We had less than $10k to get us started here which we did, but only because I had the big bills taken care of and a job to come to.
We're on a 176 PR Visa and wouldnt do it any other way. I have seen people become stuck in a job they hate because they cant leave and find something else.
Our average costs per month for 2x Adults and 1x Dog. I consider this to be pretty accurate as I had to work it out for an application recently.
Rent $2,600.00
Electricity $133.00
Gas $139.00
Water $110.00 (our sprinkler system is like Niagra falls so this is high!)
Phone & Internet $65.49
Car Insurance $60.00
House insurance $59.00
Petrol $325.00
Food and groceries $925.00
Car Rego (tax) $42.67
Car servicing, tyres etc. $58.33
Car finance $562.90
Wife's hair $150.00
Vet bills $100.00
Dog food and flea treatment etc. $200.00
Clothing and shoes etc. $162.49
Medical bills $200.00
Mobile phone x1 $50.00
Total bills $5,942.88
Use paycalculator.com.au to see how much you'll take home after tax.
Get rid of the dog and the missus, is the first thing that occurs to me looking at that list I was lucky because when we made the move I had a job to come to that pays every 2 weeks, we had our first 4 weeks accommodation paid for and had a work vehicle to use whilst we found our feet. I was also at the stage in my career when I was ready to take a big step up and the profession is better paid in Australia than the UK - Using the exchange rate alone for the sums, I more than tripled my salary by making the move.
Personally I know it's possible to start-up here with very little. We bought our UK house in 2004 and sold in 2008 meaning that we lost the best part of GBP14k. We had less than $10k to get us started here which we did, but only because I had the big bills taken care of and a job to come to.
We're on a 176 PR Visa and wouldnt do it any other way. I have seen people become stuck in a job they hate because they cant leave and find something else.
Our average costs per month for 2x Adults and 1x Dog. I consider this to be pretty accurate as I had to work it out for an application recently.
Rent $2,600.00
Electricity $133.00
Gas $139.00
Water $110.00 (our sprinkler system is like Niagra falls so this is high!)
Phone & Internet $65.49
Car Insurance $60.00
House insurance $59.00
Petrol $325.00
Food and groceries $925.00
Car Rego (tax) $42.67
Car servicing, tyres etc. $58.33
Car finance $562.90
Wife's hair $150.00
Vet bills $100.00
Dog food and flea treatment etc. $200.00
Clothing and shoes etc. $162.49
Medical bills $200.00
Mobile phone x1 $50.00
Total bills $5,942.88
Use paycalculator.com.au to see how much you'll take home after tax.
Pommygranite said:
robm3 said:
If you're happy in Newcastle, enjoying your local pub or community, surrounded with friends, can put up with the weather and traffic. Happy to have your child grow up there. And just not itching to get out. Then you'll be heading back to the UK within 2 years.
If you're feeling none of the things I mentioned above, I think you should make the move.
This. This is a great comment.If you're feeling none of the things I mentioned above, I think you should make the move.
If you don't see all of Britain as an episode of Enders or the front page of the Mail, stay there.
I was born in Perth, moved back here from England recently and want to get out again. Give me back my Bournemouth beach (and air festival), New Forest mountain biking, Wiltshire Pubs, sensibly policed roads* and proper motorsport scene, ANY DAY.
As I don't care about weather (I like seasons i.e. cold then warm, not warm then f
king baking), I've no reason to be here.* I was just done in whilst on holiday in Victoria for doing an alledged 108kmh in a 100 zone. That was discounted to an actual 105kmh in a 100 zone. They chased me through the rental company of the truck I was driving back to WA and fined me $185.Plus the admin fee of $65 for Thrifty having to shuffle an extra piece of paper.
$185 f
king dollars. For 3mph over the limit in a 60pmh zone. Which was a 6 lane motorway.Enjoy your stay.
For the benefit of our UK readers... that's 4 MPH!!!!Morning all, well we're back - just about over the jet lag.
What a great time we had. We were careful to see the place 'warts and all' but it has been pretty hard to fault the place. For reference we were staying in Armadale.
We had a look at a few potential rental properties, the local schools etc and generally tried to imagine the long term there. We got stuck in the rush hours, shopped at Coles and KMart and talked to all the rele's who thankfully are spread across the income brackets it seems.
The upshot? Well it's still a tough call. I can see a whole range of benefits over there, but I'm not sure I can give up some of the family etc we have here. My biggest concern is that everyone tells me that there is perhaps a two year period where you tread water, or even step back before you see the progress.
Another is the housing market. It seems that your boom has been even greater than ours, and we were already on the wrong side of that one. My aunts house for example has increased by 300% in about 8 years.
I think what it boils down to is the risk and reward of a possible move. We're a bit old to come back and start again if we're not happy - so we're got to be certain. Financially we'd be all in the pot, albeit with family over there as a safety net.
As a result we've decided to test the job market and see if something with a higher salary can be found. From looking over there, it's not impossible to find a job of $180k and over in the field I'm in - but I'll need to look into it further, along with visas and the like.
So this Christmas break is really decision time. Blow the dust off the CV and bait the hook - see what bites.
Watch this space and thanks again for the advice and comments.
What a great time we had. We were careful to see the place 'warts and all' but it has been pretty hard to fault the place. For reference we were staying in Armadale.
We had a look at a few potential rental properties, the local schools etc and generally tried to imagine the long term there. We got stuck in the rush hours, shopped at Coles and KMart and talked to all the rele's who thankfully are spread across the income brackets it seems.
The upshot? Well it's still a tough call. I can see a whole range of benefits over there, but I'm not sure I can give up some of the family etc we have here. My biggest concern is that everyone tells me that there is perhaps a two year period where you tread water, or even step back before you see the progress.
Another is the housing market. It seems that your boom has been even greater than ours, and we were already on the wrong side of that one. My aunts house for example has increased by 300% in about 8 years.
I think what it boils down to is the risk and reward of a possible move. We're a bit old to come back and start again if we're not happy - so we're got to be certain. Financially we'd be all in the pot, albeit with family over there as a safety net.
As a result we've decided to test the job market and see if something with a higher salary can be found. From looking over there, it's not impossible to find a job of $180k and over in the field I'm in - but I'll need to look into it further, along with visas and the like.
So this Christmas break is really decision time. Blow the dust off the CV and bait the hook - see what bites.
Watch this space and thanks again for the advice and comments.
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