BMWs have no spare wheel, so what's this about?

BMWs have no spare wheel, so what's this about?

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Locknut

Original Poster:

653 posts

136 months

Thursday 28th August 2014
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I recently bought a 2013 320d F30. This is the "Efficient Dynamics" version which is tweaked to improve fuel consumption. One of those tweaks is a set of conventional tyres (60% profile) and a can of goo instead of a spare wheel. There is no place to put a spare if you wanted one.

Today I was checking the tyre pressures so I had a look at the information sticker in the passenger door frame, then I noticed that there are pressures given for a space-saver spare wheel, have a look:





So it seems that BMW must be giving a spare wheel in some markets. I wonder where they put it unless they change the entire floor of the boot, but more than that I wonder why we can't get it here.

E30M3SE

8,465 posts

195 months

Thursday 28th August 2014
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There's a Spare Tyre System available from BMW which you can just keep in your boot.


Jon1967x

7,175 posts

123 months

Thursday 28th August 2014
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Lots of cars don't fit them because they're dead weight and take up space. Lots on bmws also have different sized front and rear so it could only be a space saver not a fully sized wheel. And 82% of people aren't strong enough to undo the wheel nuts anyway and end up calling out the Breakdown companies.. (I made the percentage up but having tried once to swap over to winter wheels in my garage it was damn difficult to do)

R36vw

451 posts

145 months

Thursday 28th August 2014
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My e90 2005 doesn't even have a spare. Was originally on run flats but now I bought the compressor and can of goo. My e46 had a spaces aver in so I guess the change was between these 2 models. No room in the e90 bootwell for a spare. It would have to go in the normal boot space.

BE57 TOY

2,628 posts

146 months

Thursday 28th August 2014
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I wouldn't buy a car without a spare wheel. Don't like the idea of run flats or goo...

4rephill

5,040 posts

177 months

Thursday 28th August 2014
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Jon1967x said:
.....Lots on bmws also have different sized front and rear so it could only be a space saver not a fully sized wheel......
Wrong! nono

You can use a full size front wheel as a spare and fit it to the front or rear axle as required with no issues whatsoever! - The tyres are sized to ensure that the rolling radius remains equal front and rear.

The only real downside is the space that the spare takes up as the cars no longer come with a spare wheel well anymore, so the spare has to sit in the boot. Obviously, a full size spare will take up a lot room than space-saver.

tjlees

1,382 posts

236 months

Thursday 28th August 2014
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Jon1967x said:
Lots of cars don't fit them because they're dead weight and take up space. Lots on bmws also have different sized front and rear so it could only be a space saver not a fully sized wheel. And 82% of people aren't strong enough to undo the wheel nuts anyway and end up calling out the Breakdown companies.. (I made the percentage up but having tried once to swap over to winter wheels in my garage it was damn difficult to do)
I had the same problem. Try either an extending wheel wrench or a breaker bar. Both get your nuts off with at least 150nm wobble




nightwalker

3,553 posts

186 months

Thursday 28th August 2014
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Jon1967x said:
Lots of cars don't fit them because they're dead weight and take up space. Lots on bmws also have different sized front and rear so it could only be a space saver not a fully sized wheel. And 82% of people aren't strong enough to undo the wheel nuts anyway and end up calling out the Breakdown companies.. (I made the percentage up but having tried once to swap over to winter wheels in my garage it was damn difficult to do)
Bloody big girl! biggrin

Locknut

Original Poster:

653 posts

136 months

Thursday 28th August 2014
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As has been pointed out, there is no wheel well in the boot, so where do BMW put the space-saver when it's included?

redtwin

7,518 posts

181 months

Friday 29th August 2014
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If you scroll up you will see that E30M3SE kindly posted a pic of the space saver system which clearly shows the storage bag which is secured to the boot lashing points.

The space saver pressure listed on the door sticker is for the convenience of those who choose to buy the space saver system. If you haven't bought one, just ignore it, much as you would the pressures listed for the other tyre sizes not fitted to your particular car.

Jon1967x

7,175 posts

123 months

Friday 29th August 2014
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4rephill said:
Jon1967x said:
.....Lots on bmws also have different sized front and rear so it could only be a space saver not a fully sized wheel......
Wrong! nono

You can use a full size front wheel as a spare and fit it to the front or rear axle as required with no issues whatsoever! - The tyres are sized to ensure that the rolling radius remains equal front and rear.

The only real downside is the space that the spare takes up as the cars no longer come with a spare wheel well anymore, so the spare has to sit in the boot. Obviously, a full size spare will take up a lot room than space-saver.
If your point is you can carry a wheel that doesn't compromise driving if used, that's potentially true if used on the front, but you'd not leave it like that anyway as very few would ever buy an alloy wheel spare that matches the others although BMW used to do this way back. If you used a front wheel on the back you might not be limited to the lower speed and range, but you'd be crazy to think you can drive totally normally with different tyre widths on an axle.

So it's you who's wrong. You can't carry a full sized spare when the wheels are different sizes front and rear without carrying 2 spares.

And as they just fit in a bag in the boot and not hidden away, a space saver takes up less space

Edited by Jon1967x on Friday 29th August 05:42

Jon1967x

7,175 posts

123 months

Friday 29th August 2014
quotequote all
tjlees said:
Jon1967x said:
Lots of cars don't fit them because they're dead weight and take up space. Lots on bmws also have different sized front and rear so it could only be a space saver not a fully sized wheel. And 82% of people aren't strong enough to undo the wheel nuts anyway and end up calling out the Breakdown companies.. (I made the percentage up but having tried once to swap over to winter wheels in my garage it was damn difficult to do)
I had the same problem. Try either an extending wheel wrench or a breaker bar. Both get your nuts off with at least 150nm wobble



Yep, that's what I use. The ones that come with the car are too short. And alloys on steel hubs also often seem to glue themselves on through some chemical reaction making them hard to get off even after the bolts are out.

lufbramatt

5,317 posts

133 months

Friday 29th August 2014
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Jon1967x said:
4rephill said:
Jon1967x said:
.....Lots on bmws also have different sized front and rear so it could only be a space saver not a fully sized wheel......
Wrong! nono

You can use a full size front wheel as a spare and fit it to the front or rear axle as required with no issues whatsoever! - The tyres are sized to ensure that the rolling radius remains equal front and rear.

The only real downside is the space that the spare takes up as the cars no longer come with a spare wheel well anymore, so the spare has to sit in the boot. Obviously, a full size spare will take up a lot room than space-saver.
If your point is you can carry a wheel that doesn't compromise driving if used, that's potentially true if used on the front, but you'd not leave it like that anyway as very few would ever buy an alloy wheel spare that matches the others although BMW used to do this way back. If you used a front wheel on the back you might not be limited to the lower speed and range, but you'd be crazy to think you can drive totally normally with different tyre widths on an axle.

So it's you who's wrong. You can't carry a full sized spare when the wheels are different sizes front and rear without carrying 2 spares.

And as they just fit in a bag in the boot and not hidden away, a space saver takes up less space

Edited by Jon1967x on Friday 29th August 05:42
yep- my E39 came with staggered 18" alloys but has a "full size" 16" alloy with a 225 width tyre on it in the boot (standard tyre size on SE spec models), that will fit on either the front or rear, rather than a proper space saver. Obviously wouldn't want to run permanently on the smaller alloy but I'd feel a lot more confident driving on it than a tiny 135 width thing.

Locknut

Original Poster:

653 posts

136 months

Friday 29th August 2014
quotequote all
redtwin said:
If you scroll up you will see that E30M3SE kindly posted a pic of the space saver system which clearly shows the storage bag which is secured to the boot lashing points.

The space saver pressure listed on the door sticker is for the convenience of those who choose to buy the space saver system. If you haven't bought one, just ignore it, much as you would the pressures listed for the other tyre sizes not fitted to your particular car.
Yes, I had seen that but it struck me as an after-market accessory rather than a factory fitting. I wondered if there might be a better way of storing a spare even if it meant (for example) modifying the boot floor. However it now seems clear from this thread that the BMW way is to put the spare on the boot floor and let it use up luggage space. While I understand your point about ignoring information that does not apply, the fact that a space-saver is included on the door sticker lead me to hope there might be a proper spare wheel installation somewhere in the option list.

As for the other discussion that has arisen about full-size spare wheels: I have struggled to fit a full-size wheel in my own shed in daylight. I would hate to be fitting one on the side of the road on a dark, wet night. For that reason I think a space-saver is a better option for a car with big wheels. (However there is still the problem of where to put the full-size road wheel after you have fitted your space-saver on the roadside.)

northpolar

137 posts

135 months

Sunday 31st August 2014
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I have just changed my 2010 F11 530d touring. When launched, my understanding is that there was no option available for customers to purchase a space saver wheel. The logic which floated about at the time was that BMW had tremendous confidence in the run flat tyre robustness and, perhaps more pertinently, not having a spare wheel specified meant that the dead weight of the space saver did not have to be factored into such matters as economy and emission calculations. Perhaps when reported incidents of run flats being destroyed on the highway prompted BMW to reconsider.

I eventually bought and fitted the space saver (as illustrated above). Couple of points - it weighs a tonne and the wheel combined with the industrial quality securing straps completely destroy the practicality of the boot design. Even though I have not experienced a puncture in 15,000 miles, I think that BMW have been too clever by half in not designing the space capacity in the boot floor shells to accommodate a space saver. Crazy!

Peter

Cheib

23,110 posts

174 months

Sunday 31st August 2014
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The whole run flat thing is purely about economics....and fk all to do with customer conveniance/safety. BMW make circa 1mil cars a year....putting FRT's on means no spare wheel or jack in 1 million cars....think about that...£30 to £50mil saved probably. Might not sound much but that's enough to count.

Also I would bet that the trye manufacturers cut BMW a VERY good deal to fit them....RFT's are hugely profitable because a) they are replaced much more often "honest guv they can't be repaired" and b) they cost a lot more.

People wont buy them unless they are OEM so imagine how much Michelin etc "pay" BMW to fit them.........

Jon1967x

7,175 posts

123 months

Sunday 31st August 2014
quotequote all
Cheib said:
The whole run flat thing is purely about economics....and fk all to do with customer conveniance/safety. BMW make circa 1mil cars a year....putting FRT's on means no spare wheel or jack in 1 million cars....think about that...£30 to £50mil saved probably. Might not sound much but that's enough to count.
Nice theory but RFT tyres are 50-100 each more than normal tyres - even if they were only £10 more each then that would be as mcu as the cost of the spare.

(Pirelli P zero 255/35/18 as on my wifes car at kwikfit - regular are £137 each, RFT £229.)

Ultuous

2,247 posts

190 months

Sunday 31st August 2014
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Indeed.. I'm neither for nor against RFT's, but if it was an economic decision most OEMs (in an industry where margins are extremely tight) would surely be cracking on to the idea?

mybrainhurts

90,809 posts

254 months

Sunday 31st August 2014
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R36vw said:
but now I bought the compressor and can of goo.
Good luck with that when your tyre deflates at 70mph.

Cheib

23,110 posts

174 months

Monday 1st September 2014
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Jon1967x said:
Cheib said:
The whole run flat thing is purely about economics....and fk all to do with customer conveniance/safety. BMW make circa 1mil cars a year....putting FRT's on means no spare wheel or jack in 1 million cars....think about that...£30 to £50mil saved probably. Might not sound much but that's enough to count.
Nice theory but RFT tyres are 50-100 each more than normal tyres - even if they were only £10 more each then that would be as mcu as the cost of the spare.

(Pirelli P zero 255/35/18 as on my wifes car at kwikfit - regular are £137 each, RFT £229.)
Sure....do you think BMW pay anything close to RRP? The margins on RFT's are absolutely massive...manfacturing costs are not that much higher than regular tyres.

Put it this way do you think BMW would spec them if they cost them £100 extra each per tyre ? That would be £368mil a year in additonal costs..... 4 x £92 X 1mil. Not a chance.........

RFT are to tyre manufacturers what printer ink is to HP.....sell the printer at a loss and lock in massive cashflows on the ink.