Super Pro ET. It's time....
Discussion
The class which has slowly gone from strength to strength over recent years. Any legal car, anyone can win (with a bit of skill and know-how), super hot rods of all shapes and sizes, close competition, in fact, it has everything going for it except heads-up starts in eliminations. Is it time to speed up the slow end to 7.99 and create an "elite" (horrible word but you get my drift) class capable of headlining any domestic race. It's also very big in Germany so international stuff could happen.
Discuss....
Discuss....
Top Sportsman and Top Dragster would be a good way to go - 6.00 - 8.00. It also has the advantage of combining heads up and bracket in the same race so could act as a feeder class for Pro Mod and Top Methanol. You might find it had a detrimental effect on some of the other classes though, Comp Eliminator could lose a few entrants. Top Doorslammer seems to attract a lot of entrants in Scandanavia so vwhy not over here?
My thought is some sort of Quick 16 class would be cool... Or a heads up class. Heads up will be hard to make rules for to include a variety of machines, and could become a place where the guy with the biggest wallet wins. Quick 16 can give close and fast racing while still being accessible to more people i think. Would be great to open things up so that the 5 second sportsman cars have somewhere to race without getting off the loud pedal so quick.
At the minute the Nostalgia classes in the US is where its at - but i dont think it would be right to restrict over here to just nostalgia cars. Might be an idea to see just what those classes offer that is so appealing. Close fast racing, without the same expense as the pro classes in the big show, and a huge number of cars.
At the minute the Nostalgia classes in the US is where its at - but i dont think it would be right to restrict over here to just nostalgia cars. Might be an idea to see just what those classes offer that is so appealing. Close fast racing, without the same expense as the pro classes in the big show, and a huge number of cars.
"Quick 16," designed to showcase the 16 quickest cars at an event that may not be eligible for any of the Heads Up classes.
Quick 16 also provides an alternative to standard ET Bracket racing for these competitors. A handicapped start, no-breakout format equalizes competition among the 16 cars while preserving the "first one to the finish line wins" concept.
Here's how it works:
The class features a 16 car, qualified field. Cars are qualified based on e.t., from quickest to slowest. (Non-qualifiers may move to ET Bracket eliminations.)
In first round of Quick 16 eliminations, each pair of cars will utilize a handicapped start, where the handicap is based upon each competitor's quickest qualifying time. This is similar to a "dial-in" for bracket racing, except you don't chose your "dial-in", it's automatically determined by your qualifying time.
There is no break-out at the finish line as in bracket racing. The first car to cross the finish line wins the round.
Your "dial-in" is always based upon your quickest run of the day. For example, if your qualifying time is a 9.50, your first round "dial-in" will be a 9.50. If you win first round but run a 9.45, your second round "dial-in" will be lowered to a 9.45.
First round eliminations are based on a 16 car "Sportsman" ladder, where the number 1 qualifier competes against number 9, number 2 qualifier against number 10, and so on until number 8 competes against 16.
To avoid excessive "sand bagging," any racer who runs .5-second quicker than his/her quickest qualifying time will be disqualified.
This a great class to showcase your tuning and driving skills, while the handicapped start and Sportsman ladder format equalizes competition between slower and faster cars. Do you have what it takes to be one of the Quick 16?
Quick 16 also provides an alternative to standard ET Bracket racing for these competitors. A handicapped start, no-breakout format equalizes competition among the 16 cars while preserving the "first one to the finish line wins" concept.
Here's how it works:
The class features a 16 car, qualified field. Cars are qualified based on e.t., from quickest to slowest. (Non-qualifiers may move to ET Bracket eliminations.)
In first round of Quick 16 eliminations, each pair of cars will utilize a handicapped start, where the handicap is based upon each competitor's quickest qualifying time. This is similar to a "dial-in" for bracket racing, except you don't chose your "dial-in", it's automatically determined by your qualifying time.
There is no break-out at the finish line as in bracket racing. The first car to cross the finish line wins the round.
Your "dial-in" is always based upon your quickest run of the day. For example, if your qualifying time is a 9.50, your first round "dial-in" will be a 9.50. If you win first round but run a 9.45, your second round "dial-in" will be lowered to a 9.45.
First round eliminations are based on a 16 car "Sportsman" ladder, where the number 1 qualifier competes against number 9, number 2 qualifier against number 10, and so on until number 8 competes against 16.
To avoid excessive "sand bagging," any racer who runs .5-second quicker than his/her quickest qualifying time will be disqualified.
This a great class to showcase your tuning and driving skills, while the handicapped start and Sportsman ladder format equalizes competition between slower and faster cars. Do you have what it takes to be one of the Quick 16?
Why would anyone want to race something so utterly complicated?
That's far worse for the average spectator than complicated eliminator. Top Dragster, Top Sportsman to the NHRA rules but with either our own weight breaks or no weight breaks would be an interesting diversion at an event where SuPro wasn't running. Qualify heads up, race to your dial-in. Other than that I don't see there is a problem with the current state of play.
That's far worse for the average spectator than complicated eliminator. Top Dragster, Top Sportsman to the NHRA rules but with either our own weight breaks or no weight breaks would be an interesting diversion at an event where SuPro wasn't running. Qualify heads up, race to your dial-in. Other than that I don't see there is a problem with the current state of play.
Edited by TheMighty on Friday 29th August 17:58
There's nothing wrong with SuperPro, Pete. Only issue is the speed differential at the big end, but we tried to change it 4 years ago, and the powers that be wouldn't have it.
Quick 16 would be too confusing. And "control excessive sandbagging"? We've got SuperPro with NO sandbagging.
In Quick 16, everyone would sandbag. They'd be damn fools not to.
As for heads up, until someone gets their car to run like mine, I'd be really disappointed not to win every event. But I'd get no pleasure from winning in those circumstances.
Quick 16 would be too confusing. And "control excessive sandbagging"? We've got SuperPro with NO sandbagging.
In Quick 16, everyone would sandbag. They'd be damn fools not to.
As for heads up, until someone gets their car to run like mine, I'd be really disappointed not to win every event. But I'd get no pleasure from winning in those circumstances.
Theres not a lot wrong with Super Pro. Its a great bunch of folks, tight racing and thanks to the sponsorship scheme some great prizes / bonus's. I do think though that there are racers in super pro who bracket race because theres no alternative for their car. Where people have not got the correct car or budget for Pro Mod, TMD, TMFC or Pro Stock. Or even not even the time to commit.
I think there is a place for a class where first to the finish line wins, but its tough to make rules for such a class that would allow for a variety of cars and where its not about who has the biggest wallet. Staggered starts evens the playing fields so that a larger variety of cars / budgets stand a chance of winning. Where the guy with the biggest wallet isn't necessarily going to win. I think staggered starts with first to the finish line wins could be a great alternative, but there needs to be a way to stop people sandbagging and then blitzing the field. It could be a good stepping stone to a pro / heads up class. Needs to be less complicated than comp eliminator though.
I think there is a place for a class where first to the finish line wins, but its tough to make rules for such a class that would allow for a variety of cars and where its not about who has the biggest wallet. Staggered starts evens the playing fields so that a larger variety of cars / budgets stand a chance of winning. Where the guy with the biggest wallet isn't necessarily going to win. I think staggered starts with first to the finish line wins could be a great alternative, but there needs to be a way to stop people sandbagging and then blitzing the field. It could be a good stepping stone to a pro / heads up class. Needs to be less complicated than comp eliminator though.
There's nothing wrong with SuperPro, Pete. Only issue is the speed differential at the big end, but we tried to change it 4 years ago, and the powers that be wouldn't have it.
Quick 16 would be too confusing. And "control excessive sandbagging"? We've got SuperPro with NO sandbagging.
In Quick 16, everyone would sandbag. They'd be damn fools not to.
As for heads up, until someone gets their car to run like mine, I'd be really disappointed not to win every event. But I'd get no pleasure from winning in those circumstances.
Quick 16 would be too confusing. And "control excessive sandbagging"? We've got SuperPro with NO sandbagging.
In Quick 16, everyone would sandbag. They'd be damn fools not to.
As for heads up, until someone gets their car to run like mine, I'd be really disappointed not to win every event. But I'd get no pleasure from winning in those circumstances.
The old comp altered classes had the system Dorris is talking about and, as Martyn points out, it was a sand-bag fest and still over-complicated. I just feel that everything has been tried, sometime numerous times but Super-Pro, as-is, but with a quicker cut-off will do it best. A slow end limit of 7.99 shouts "seriously quick" and would do several things... It would provide a target for racers to aspire to without spending anything like the money needed for any Pro class (including comp-eliminator), it would reduce the closing speeds at the top end to a manageable 2 seconds maximum - and that's only when Martyn races the slowest entrant.
The same reasons which attracted me and so many others to the class, all still apply. The days when anyone looked down their noses at the ET classes are long gone.
The same reasons which attracted me and so many others to the class, all still apply. The days when anyone looked down their noses at the ET classes are long gone.
I think the only thing wrong with the class at the moment is the closing speeds at the top end. I'd gladly see the upper ET limit dropped to 8.49 or yes, maybe even 7.99 to try and fix that. Otherwise I wouldn't touch a thing. I definitely wouldn't want to see anything that restricted the car type (e.g., Top Dragster or Top Sportsman). I *like* seeing doorslammers, altereds and dragsters racing together. In theory, Comp Eliminator should be a good alternative and it genuinely isn't as complex as people make it out to be (although I guess perhaps it is for the casual spectator). But Comp Eliminator rapidly becomes very expensive if you want to be competitive and I'm not sure we get enough track time over here for CIC to work properly.
Leaving aside the index argument for a while, I just saw the last SuPro qualifying session for today (Friday) on the DoYouSeeMe thingy. 0.029 seconds off your dial could get you into the field ... at No 30.
Whoever wins SuPro is going to have to produce the goods, time and time again. Faaaantastic!
Whoever wins SuPro is going to have to produce the goods, time and time again. Faaaantastic!
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