Scottish Referendum / Independence - Vol 6

[Walford]

Have just watched F1 qualifying from Singapore, made me think
"this is what Scotland could have been like"

[Welshbeef]

Walford said:

Have just watched F1 qualifying from Singapore, made me think
"this is what Scotland could have been like"

Oh well - decision is made time to move on Mr Walfort

[skyrover]

Walford said:

Have just watched F1 qualifying from Singapore, made me think
"this is what Scotland could have been like"

Have you any idea what Singapore is like?

[jimmyjimjim]

What, expensive, overcrowded, low level of press freedom, suppressed civil liberties, high income inequality?

Yes, I agree with walford, it was a good thing to vote no and avoid that.

[r11co]

Jader1973 said:

This ongoing moaning from the Losers is further demonstration of Alex's lack of ability to lead.

He should have stayed and put his energy into uniting the country, which he would do if he cared about it and didn't only care about himself.

Instead he stands down while at the same time inferring that this isn't over. Pathetic.

Yep. He's stirring the pot already. He's a consummate trouble maker - both his biggest strength and biggest weakness as the results show. Salmond needs to take a look at himself as the one thing everyone I spoke to during the campaign agreed on, yes and no supporters alike, was their dislike of the man.

The most repeated phrase of the Yessers was 'it's not about Salmond' - almost apologetically.

So, it would seem his resignation was not the act of an honourable man but an intentional play to remove himself from the process of reconciliation and transfer of power in order to disrupt it.

He needs to accept the result, stand by his resignation and STFU. There is the real possibility of civil unrest in Scotland if this drags on and Salmond is intentionally stoking the fire now.

Edited by r11co on Sunday 21st September 08:28

[DanL]

Walford said:

Have just watched F1 qualifying from Singapore, made me think
"this is what Scotland could have been like"

The only similarity between Singapore and Scotland is the population size. You do realise Singapore is a tiny island, right? Scotland has over 100 times the landmass - the costs of running each country are wildly different.

[McWigglebum4th]

Walford said:

Have just watched F1 qualifying from Singapore, made me think
"this is what Scotland could have been like"

Suits me

I would love to live in a Scotland modelled on singapore

However


i don't think that turning scotland into a benign dictatorship with low taxes and zero benefits would go down too well with our freedom fighting friends

[Cobnapint]

johnxjsc1985 said:

I have to say that I was staggered at how good Gordon Brown's speech was, why was he not like that when he was PM he was head and shoulders above any of the main characters this week

Labour have been about as cynical as Salmond in this hole debate. Most of the 'No' placards we saw on TV were the red and yellow ones with 'Scottish Labour' emblazond at the bottom. And now Gordon 'clonking-fist' Brown has now been deployed as the great peacemaker to reunite Scotland and tell them that it is HE (ergo, Labour) that'll make sure London comes up with the goods they promised, or else.

This is as much about saving Labour's skin north of the border (and therefore in Westminster) as it was the union. And don't believe anything other.

[gruffalo]

Walford said:

Have just watched F1 qualifying from Singapore, made me think
"this is what Scotland could have been like"

fk me that is funny!

[Jader1973]

technodup said:

'd like to see a map based on religious leanings. As has been alluded to a couple of times above sectarianism is never far from the surface in the west of Scotland and three out of four Yes wards have high proportions of Catholics, Glasgow and N Lanarkshire particularly.

My FB is full of folk wanting Yes voters banned from Ibrox. As demonstrated by the Rangers flags and chants in George Sq, and the Irish tricolours at Yes events, to many people this was just another manifestation of the Protestant/Catholic, Unionist/Republican, (London)derry divide they could get worked up over.

This was never mentioned on the night by the BBC. What they also missed was that a huge number of football fans (particularly Rangers) have never forgiven Salmond for banning and criminalising many traditional songs sung at matches. They spoke of every other demographic, to omit (or avoid) the sectarian one in the west of Scotland was odd. It was a factor. In Glasgow it always is.

Unfortunately many of the Catholics see themselves as Irish and a Yes vote as an extension of the "Brits Out" mentality from NI. For many of them it was not about what is best for Scotland but rather getting one over on the British.

[Cobnapint]

McWigglebum4th said:

Fordy Bob said:

Give us a break,with the you couldnt aford to go it alone crap,do you realy think the only reason Cameron didnt want to loose us was because he loved us so much,I think not.Two types of people voted No, rich folk and scared folk,already they are regreting what they did.

I'm not rich

but i will admit i am fking terrified of you assholes and your ideas of fairness, freedom of speech, economics and democracy


i am sure in the name of fairness you would happily see me paying 99% tax and banned from voting or speaking as i disagree with king alex


You lost now fking deal with it


don't like the result then use your british passport and fk off out of my country


Oh and one more thing


Do please leave the saltire behind on the way out as it isn't yours its Scotlands

Edited by McWigglebum4th on Saturday 20th September 20:46

Here, fking, Here...

[Cobnapint]

FredericRobinson said:

The only thing that scared me about the whole business was the governing party in a western democracy staging a demonstration outside a broadcaster because it objected to the way it reported the news. That was deeply sinister and unprecedented, I'm not regretting the way I voted.

It was like a scene from a totalitarian state wasn't it. A totalitarian state with the political and economic policies of someone like Robert Mugabe.

Very disconcerting.

[DocJock]

All this bitterness and recrimination could have been avoided.

All it required was Cameron to say two years ago 'OK, you can have your referendum but let me make it clear right now.

1. No currency union
2. Oil reserves divided on a per capita basis
3. You WILL be expected to honour your share of UK debt.

And if he really wanted to put the boot in...

4. We will veto your EU application (should you ever meet the entry criteria)'

All of Salmond's bluster and obfuscation regarding finances would have been chopped of at the knees before he ever got a chance to peddle his lies to a gullible electorate.

[Blib]

Walford said:

Have just watched F1 qualifying from Singapore, made me think
"this is what Scotland could have been like"

You'd never be able to handle the humidity.

[anonymous-user]

ShaunTheSheep said:

wsurfa said:

Axionknight said:

ash73 said:

Actually I can, it's answered here

Would this be the paper that has as it's core assumptions that

... testiculation[1] snipped ...

No.

[1] testiculation: waving ones hands in the air while talking bks

So you haven't read it then...

- Assuming a 2.0% rate of real GDP growth against a backdrop of an immediate and permanent fiscal tightening of 5.4% may be optimistic.
If instead growth were at a still fairly robust 1.0% annually, then the primary surplus required in the geographic share of oil case would rise to 3.9%, for a total fiscal tightening of 6.2%.

- The main assumption in this paper is that Scotland becomes an EU member and commits to joining the euro zone at some unspecified future date.

- , this means that the Scottish government somehow makes a payment to the UK government for £153bn in 2016/17. Obviously this sum of money is not immediately available so the issue becomes how can this payment be effected.

- This would imply a fiscal tightening of 17.5%, as Scotland’s primary deficit with only a per capita share of oil revenues rises to 10.3% of GDP.78 The required tightening increases so much due to the increase in borrowing costs to 7.9% induced by the higher initial primary deficit of 10.3%. This underlines the crucial role of the division of both government liabilities and assets for Scotland’s initial fiscal position, and by extension for its currency choice

-We emphasize that our results should be seen as lower bounds on the amount of fiscal
tightening required to fulfill the 60% debt target


certainly looks like a more rosy picture when you read it.....

[Axionknight]

McWigglebum4th said:

Suits me

I would love to live in a Scotland modelled on singapore

However


i don't think that turning scotland into a benign dictatorship with low taxes and zero benefits would go down too well with our freedom fighting friends

You forgot the housing costs, second highest city in the world IIRC. This being Pistonheads it should also be noted that car ownership costs are huge.

[Cobnapint]

fandango_c said:

Thanks for the reply. I was aware of these questions that Nick Robinson had asked, but wanted to know what he had lied about and was hoping that Fordy Bob could answer that for me.

I think you'll be waiting a long time. Salmond tried to justify his position by saying that some of these companies threatening to leave stories were old ones being regenerated.

It doesn't matter how old they are you prick - they still exist. And they don't support your position either. It's a bit like saying 'those tossers at the Vineyard told us they have some vintage wine in their cellars. Och, it's the same vintage wine they told us about several weeks ago!'

He then read out the internal letter sent out by the RBS CE to RBS staff in a vain attempt to back up his 'brass-plaque' analogy. But he failed to notice the caveat in there... qoute: '...based on current strategy it is not the intention to move operations or jobs'.

For the whinging Yessers, numb of mind SNP voters, Alex Salmond and anybody else that didn't catch that, 'CURRENT STRATEGY' is business speak for 'right this second'. And 'if things change in a different 'second' that causes us to do a worry, we'll be having a different fking strategy. Bye now!'

[Moonhawk]

Blib said:

You'd never be able to handle the humidity.

Had to re-read that twice......I read it as "humility" - and thought - yep - you are right.

[Moonhawk]

r11co said:

Yep. He's stirring the pot already. He's a consummate trouble maker.....

His actions since the result are just showing that for Salmond this was all about political aims rather than the good of Scotland.

What benefit to Scotland is s#it stirring now. He should the trying to reunite Scotland and should be looking towards making the most of Scotland's future within the UK.

You just can't with with some people. Scotland asked for a referendum - so it was given. Now a minority are complaining "we didn't get the result we wanted".

As for Salmond's claim that the referendum was won on the back of No voters being "tricked" by the last minute promises by the No camp regarding the additional powers - that really is laughable.

Only two polls showed Yes ahead at any stage during 2014 - and one of them we know had a massive weighting applied to get that result. Virtually every poll and even the underlying data for one of the "Yes ahead" polls indicated that No were going to win by about the margin they did. The promises of extra powers appear to have had little if any difference on the poll results. Then again - basing statements on facts and figures really doesn't seem to be one of Salmond's strong points.

Edited by Moonhawk on Sunday 21st September 10:50

[Funk]

Cobnapint said:

johnxjsc1985 said:

I have to say that I was staggered at how good Gordon Brown's speech was, why was he not like that when he was PM he was head and shoulders above any of the main characters this week

Labour have been about as cynical as Salmond in this hole debate. Most of the 'No' placards we saw on TV were the red and yellow ones with 'Scottish Labour' emblazond at the bottom. And now Gordon 'clonking-fist' Brown has now been deployed as the great peacemaker to reunite Scotland and tell them that it is HE (ergo, Labour) that'll make sure London comes up with the goods they promised, or else.

This is as much about saving Labour's skin north of the border (and therefore in Westminster) as it was the union. And don't believe anything other.

Spot on, cob.

Labour are desperate to try and retain power at any costs. Under whose authority does Brown speak? He is in no position to be making any promises or guaranteeing any terms whatsoever.

Cameron has played a blinder here, the linking of English-only votes on English-only matters with further devo is a masterstroke.

It's got the backing of public opinion and any objection by Labour makes them look weak or anti-English.