What am I doing wrong? Changing Lanes on a Motorway
Discussion
silentbrown said:
RobM77 said:
They really were quite a way back.
What - roughly - was the gap between the two cars (i.e. the gap you were slotting into) in case 1? I assume traffic was moving at around 70ish...RobM77 said:
9mm said:
RobM77 said:
9mm said:
watchnut said:
If the traffic is heavy, the gaps will be shorter, therefore those that have been patient and are over in lane 1 earlier may feel a little aggrieved when some one over takes, and jumps into the "gap" they created for themselves causing them to lift off the gas or brake.
It'll be this. ANYTHING that causes another driver to lift (out of caution) if not to slow, let alone brake, risks a negative reaction. Let's face it, last minute exits are commonplace and a frequent cause of near misses and accidents. I suspect you're perceived to be in that group of drivers who seem to leave exits as late as possible to make progress.1. My wife and I are driving down the M27 on Sunday and coming off at the next slip road; I'm driving. We're in lane 2 overtaking a range of vehicles in lane 1, and I spot quite a good sized gap in lane 1, which, by the time I get to it, will be about half a mile to a quarter of a mile from the exit. Perfect. When I get alongside the car at the back of the gap, I check all is still well and indicate. Then, after a polite pause and when my car is in a suitable safe place in the gap, I check and the car at the rear hasn't sped up and all is still safe, so I slowly move over and cancel the indicator when all four wheels are within the lane. Not much slowing down needed and the gap was perfectly safe.
It doesn't sound as if traffic was light. If it was, why the need for so much road positioning and and slowing at all? Secondly, if you start the move at the lower end of your distance estimate, you are only going to get into the ns lane a hundred yards or so before the exit and that is going to be very late in the eyes of some drivers. It does appear you don't believe you did anything wrong but if you are getting reactions from other drivers you must be doing something wrong, at least in their eyes.
I see people making what I would call unnecessary and last minute exits all the time. Whilst I never feel the need to admonish them in any way, I can see why others would, especially if they are very risk averse, or, as I say, they have to make any adjustment at all to accommodate what they regard as a poor bit of driving. I think what goes through their mind, is what goes through mine - why couldn't you have got into the right lane a lot further back up the road?
half a mile = 880 yards
quarter of a mile = 440 yards
If it's a polite pause before the III marker, I see no problem on a lightly trafficed motorway if there's a nice big gap. This wasn't a last minute dash on a crowded rush hour motorway, we were coming back from the coast from a day out - there were a few cars in lane one and a very light scattering in lanes two and three.
So, if traffic was light, and ASSUMING you knew the road, why give yourself less than half a mile to get into the right lane at motorway speeds?
9mm said:
RobM77 said:
9mm said:
RobM77 said:
9mm said:
watchnut said:
If the traffic is heavy, the gaps will be shorter, therefore those that have been patient and are over in lane 1 earlier may feel a little aggrieved when some one over takes, and jumps into the "gap" they created for themselves causing them to lift off the gas or brake.
It'll be this. ANYTHING that causes another driver to lift (out of caution) if not to slow, let alone brake, risks a negative reaction. Let's face it, last minute exits are commonplace and a frequent cause of near misses and accidents. I suspect you're perceived to be in that group of drivers who seem to leave exits as late as possible to make progress.1. My wife and I are driving down the M27 on Sunday and coming off at the next slip road; I'm driving. We're in lane 2 overtaking a range of vehicles in lane 1, and I spot quite a good sized gap in lane 1, which, by the time I get to it, will be about half a mile to a quarter of a mile from the exit. Perfect. When I get alongside the car at the back of the gap, I check all is still well and indicate. Then, after a polite pause and when my car is in a suitable safe place in the gap, I check and the car at the rear hasn't sped up and all is still safe, so I slowly move over and cancel the indicator when all four wheels are within the lane. Not much slowing down needed and the gap was perfectly safe.
It doesn't sound as if traffic was light. If it was, why the need for so much road positioning and and slowing at all? Secondly, if you start the move at the lower end of your distance estimate, you are only going to get into the ns lane a hundred yards or so before the exit and that is going to be very late in the eyes of some drivers. It does appear you don't believe you did anything wrong but if you are getting reactions from other drivers you must be doing something wrong, at least in their eyes.
I see people making what I would call unnecessary and last minute exits all the time. Whilst I never feel the need to admonish them in any way, I can see why others would, especially if they are very risk averse, or, as I say, they have to make any adjustment at all to accommodate what they regard as a poor bit of driving. I think what goes through their mind, is what goes through mine - why couldn't you have got into the right lane a lot further back up the road?
half a mile = 880 yards
quarter of a mile = 440 yards
If it's a polite pause before the III marker, I see no problem on a lightly trafficed motorway if there's a nice big gap. This wasn't a last minute dash on a crowded rush hour motorway, we were coming back from the coast from a day out - there were a few cars in lane one and a very light scattering in lanes two and three.
So, if traffic was light, and ASSUMING you knew the road, why give yourself less than half a mile to get into the right lane at motorway speeds?
RobM77 said:
9mm said:
RobM77 said:
9mm said:
RobM77 said:
9mm said:
watchnut said:
If the traffic is heavy, the gaps will be shorter, therefore those that have been patient and are over in lane 1 earlier may feel a little aggrieved when some one over takes, and jumps into the "gap" they created for themselves causing them to lift off the gas or brake.
It'll be this. ANYTHING that causes another driver to lift (out of caution) if not to slow, let alone brake, risks a negative reaction. Let's face it, last minute exits are commonplace and a frequent cause of near misses and accidents. I suspect you're perceived to be in that group of drivers who seem to leave exits as late as possible to make progress.1. My wife and I are driving down the M27 on Sunday and coming off at the next slip road; I'm driving. We're in lane 2 overtaking a range of vehicles in lane 1, and I spot quite a good sized gap in lane 1, which, by the time I get to it, will be about half a mile to a quarter of a mile from the exit. Perfect. When I get alongside the car at the back of the gap, I check all is still well and indicate. Then, after a polite pause and when my car is in a suitable safe place in the gap, I check and the car at the rear hasn't sped up and all is still safe, so I slowly move over and cancel the indicator when all four wheels are within the lane. Not much slowing down needed and the gap was perfectly safe.
It doesn't sound as if traffic was light. If it was, why the need for so much road positioning and and slowing at all? Secondly, if you start the move at the lower end of your distance estimate, you are only going to get into the ns lane a hundred yards or so before the exit and that is going to be very late in the eyes of some drivers. It does appear you don't believe you did anything wrong but if you are getting reactions from other drivers you must be doing something wrong, at least in their eyes.
I see people making what I would call unnecessary and last minute exits all the time. Whilst I never feel the need to admonish them in any way, I can see why others would, especially if they are very risk averse, or, as I say, they have to make any adjustment at all to accommodate what they regard as a poor bit of driving. I think what goes through their mind, is what goes through mine - why couldn't you have got into the right lane a lot further back up the road?
half a mile = 880 yards
quarter of a mile = 440 yards
If it's a polite pause before the III marker, I see no problem on a lightly trafficed motorway if there's a nice big gap. This wasn't a last minute dash on a crowded rush hour motorway, we were coming back from the coast from a day out - there were a few cars in lane one and a very light scattering in lanes two and three.
So, if traffic was light, and ASSUMING you knew the road, why give yourself less than half a mile to get into the right lane at motorway speeds?
9mm said:
RobM77 said:
9mm said:
RobM77 said:
9mm said:
RobM77 said:
9mm said:
watchnut said:
If the traffic is heavy, the gaps will be shorter, therefore those that have been patient and are over in lane 1 earlier may feel a little aggrieved when some one over takes, and jumps into the "gap" they created for themselves causing them to lift off the gas or brake.
It'll be this. ANYTHING that causes another driver to lift (out of caution) if not to slow, let alone brake, risks a negative reaction. Let's face it, last minute exits are commonplace and a frequent cause of near misses and accidents. I suspect you're perceived to be in that group of drivers who seem to leave exits as late as possible to make progress.1. My wife and I are driving down the M27 on Sunday and coming off at the next slip road; I'm driving. We're in lane 2 overtaking a range of vehicles in lane 1, and I spot quite a good sized gap in lane 1, which, by the time I get to it, will be about half a mile to a quarter of a mile from the exit. Perfect. When I get alongside the car at the back of the gap, I check all is still well and indicate. Then, after a polite pause and when my car is in a suitable safe place in the gap, I check and the car at the rear hasn't sped up and all is still safe, so I slowly move over and cancel the indicator when all four wheels are within the lane. Not much slowing down needed and the gap was perfectly safe.
It doesn't sound as if traffic was light. If it was, why the need for so much road positioning and and slowing at all? Secondly, if you start the move at the lower end of your distance estimate, you are only going to get into the ns lane a hundred yards or so before the exit and that is going to be very late in the eyes of some drivers. It does appear you don't believe you did anything wrong but if you are getting reactions from other drivers you must be doing something wrong, at least in their eyes.
I see people making what I would call unnecessary and last minute exits all the time. Whilst I never feel the need to admonish them in any way, I can see why others would, especially if they are very risk averse, or, as I say, they have to make any adjustment at all to accommodate what they regard as a poor bit of driving. I think what goes through their mind, is what goes through mine - why couldn't you have got into the right lane a lot further back up the road?
half a mile = 880 yards
quarter of a mile = 440 yards
If it's a polite pause before the III marker, I see no problem on a lightly trafficed motorway if there's a nice big gap. This wasn't a last minute dash on a crowded rush hour motorway, we were coming back from the coast from a day out - there were a few cars in lane one and a very light scattering in lanes two and three.
So, if traffic was light, and ASSUMING you knew the road, why give yourself less than half a mile to get into the right lane at motorway speeds?
If someone can explain this properly then I'm all ears - being wrong is wonderful, as it's how you learn and I'm certainy not scared of being wrong, which is why I made the post asking the queston in the first place.RobM77 said:
Gosh - we're talking three months ago! I do remember the Honda Civic one quoted above and it was quite a distance - certainly not enough to cause alarm and a very standard distance, plus some, to change lanes on a motorway.
No total recall? DISMISSED I meant to ask what would you normally consider 'quite a distance' when pulling in L, rather than the specifics.
My point is that everyone has a different view of what constitutes a safe distance. If I was leaving a 5 car-length gap (hint: at 70mph, I wouldn't be happy with that), and you pull into the middle of it, I've suddenly lost 60% of my gap. You've matched speed, so I don't need to lift to avoid a collision, but I do need to lift to re-establish my idea of a safe gap. And that effect concertinas back.
silentbrown said:
RobM77 said:
Gosh - we're talking three months ago! I do remember the Honda Civic one quoted above and it was quite a distance - certainly not enough to cause alarm and a very standard distance, plus some, to change lanes on a motorway.
No total recall? DISMISSED I meant to ask what would you normally consider 'quite a distance' when pulling in L, rather than the specifics.
My point is that everyone has a different view of what constitutes a safe distance. If I was leaving a 5 car-length gap (hint: at 70mph, I wouldn't be happy with that), and you pull into the middle of it, I've suddenly lost 60% of my gap. You've matched speed, so I don't need to lift to avoid a collision, but I do need to lift to re-establish my idea of a safe gap. And that effect concertinas back.
9mm said:
So, if traffic was light, and ASSUMING you knew the road, why give yourself less than half a mile to get into the right lane at motorway speeds?
It sounded to me like he gave himself more than that.RobM77 said:
We're in lane 2 overtaking a range of vehicles in lane 1, and I spot quite a good sized gap in lane 1, which, by the time I get to it, will be about half a mile to a quarter of a mile from the exit.
To me, that sounds like he's identified his spot in lane 1 with somewhat more than half a mile to go, albeit his plan has him still in lane 2 as he passes the half mile marker. I don't think that's a problem. The planning is the important bit - the way to cock it up is to leave it until half a mile before starting to think about where you might move into lane 1. And why your comment about light traffic? I think the general correlation is: the lighter the traffic, the later you're likely to be able to make a comfortable, polite move into lane 1.SK425 said:
9mm said:
So, if traffic was light, and ASSUMING you knew the road, why give yourself less than half a mile to get into the right lane at motorway speeds?
It sounded to me like he gave himself more than that.RobM77 said:
We're in lane 2 overtaking a range of vehicles in lane 1, and I spot quite a good sized gap in lane 1, which, by the time I get to it, will be about half a mile to a quarter of a mile from the exit.
To me, that sounds like he's identified his spot in lane 1 with somewhat more than half a mile to go, albeit his plan has him still in lane 2 as he passes the half mile marker. I don't think that's a problem. The planning is the important bit - the way to cock it up is to leave it until half a mile before starting to think about where you might move into lane 1. And why your comment about light traffic? I think the general correlation is: the lighter the traffic, the later you're likely to be able to make a comfortable, polite move into lane 1.He says "by the time I get to it, will be about half a mile to a quarter of a mile from the exit."
If that's at the lower end of the range, that's 400yds from the exit.
Travelling at motorway speeds (we have to assume he's not travelling at 40mph, not least because he states other traffic was going at a speed below what he wanted to carry) I think that's leaving it unnecessarily late to be going from the middle lane to the inner lane for the exit and that it would inevitably upset some drivers.
Whether they are right or wrong to be upset is irrelevant. The OP asked for an explanation and I think mine is the most likely one. Perceived late moves upset some people. End of.
1. My wife and I are driving down the M27 on Sunday and coming off at the next slip road; I'm driving. We're in lane 2 overtaking a range of vehicles in lane 1, and I spot quite a good sized gap in lane 1, which, by the time I get to it, will be about half a mile to a quarter of a mile from the exit.
So he didn't leave
I think it's the most likely explanation. Personally I think 440 yards is fine as a minimum to get into lane 1 before an exit, provided you're not causing anyone to change their speed, course or plan. I guess people vary on that one.9mm said:
As I said, I'm out of the discussion with the OP but in response to your questions.
He says "by the time I get to it, will be about half a mile to a quarter of a mile from the exit."
If that's at the lower end of the range, that's 400yds from the exit.
Travelling at motorway speeds (we have to assume he's not travelling at 40mph, not least because he states other traffic was going at a speed below what he wanted to carry) I think that's leaving it unnecessarily late to be going from the middle lane to the inner lane for the exit
I think it can be plenty of time. The lighter the traffic, the more likely it is there will be an opportunity where changing lanes at that point is a non-issue.He says "by the time I get to it, will be about half a mile to a quarter of a mile from the exit."
If that's at the lower end of the range, that's 400yds from the exit.
Travelling at motorway speeds (we have to assume he's not travelling at 40mph, not least because he states other traffic was going at a speed below what he wanted to carry) I think that's leaving it unnecessarily late to be going from the middle lane to the inner lane for the exit
9mm said:
and that it would inevitably upset some drivers.
I suppose it might. In the same way that some drivers are upset by the simple fact that you overtake them, no matter how safe and legal your manoeuvre. I don't think we need waste time pandering to such irrational prejudices though.9mm said:
Whether they are right or wrong to be upset is irrelevant. The OP asked for an explanation and I think mine is the most likely one. Perceived late moves upset some people. End of.
I would suggest that how late the move appears is influenced not just by how close to the exit you are, but also by how late you left it before you started planning and - probably most importantly - whether you cause the driver behind to have to slow down at all.
Gassing Station | Advanced Driving | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff