RE: Ducati Monster 821: PH2 Review

RE: Ducati Monster 821: PH2 Review

Monday 22nd September 2014

Ducati Monster 821: PH2 Review

It's the end of an era for Ducati's Monster range - PH2 rides the water-cooled 821



Sadly, not only due to tightening emissions laws but also the launch of the water-cooled Monster 1200 (as bought by Harris), it was always on the cards. The release of the Monster 821 marks the end of a two-wheeled dynasty; no longer is air-cooling the future for the Ducati Monster.

True, the 696 and 796 are still in the model line-up, but these are existing models that are cheap to continue producing rather than the future. Should we be upset? It may be a controversial comment, but I won't miss the smaller capacity air-cooled Monsters at all. Don't get me wrong, I love the larger air-cooled bikes, but for me the small capacity bikes always felt a little insubstantial. I can appreciate their popularity but being over six feet tall I have never seen eye to eye with the 600, 620 or even the newer 696 and 796 bikes (the S2R 800, however, is bloody brilliant). Personal prejudices aired what's the new Monster 821 like?

Water-cooled yes, but not wanting for character
Water-cooled yes, but not wanting for character
New engine, same old feel
As soon as you fire the Monster 821 into life it sounds, feels and even vibrates like a Monster should. At tickover the exhaust emits a pleasing growl that you simply don't get on a Japanese in-line four or even the new Yamaha MT-09 or MT-07. The Ducati sounds raw and thumps out pulses of air as the V-twin idles away nicely. It may not quite have the rattle of the older Monsters due to it lacking a dry clutch, but other than that Ducati has done a fine job of recreating the air-cooled feel with the water-cooled motor.

And, best of all, the clutch is beautifully light and at low speed the throttle response is excellent, if also a little light. Yep, the new 821 comes with a digital throttle which as well as allowing it to have traction control and variable fuel maps, also gives an almost worryingly light throttle action. Next to the force required to open the carbs on older Monster 900 it's quite a shock, but it is just a feeling and you very quickly get used to it. And, personally, I like the feel of the 821 as with its larger stance, digital electronic assists and muscular look, the 821 gives the impression of being a 'proper' motorcycle, something the older small capacity bikes never quite did. It's a grown up Monster, despite its reduced capacity. And this feeling extends to the ride.

Far more composed than the smaller Monsters
Far more composed than the smaller Monsters
Bye-bye, skippy...
When you up the pace on the air-cooled small capacity Monsters the suspension is quite quick to complain and the handling soon becomes a little skittish. Despite weighing a fairly low 180kg, the 821 has none of this feel and the suspension is certainly a cut above the units on the older bikes. It's not as refined as on more expensive models, but I would say is a very impressive half way house between high quality and basic units and leaves little to complain about at high or low speed. The brakes, which come with ABS as standard, are also excellent but one simple factor ruins the entire ride - the foot pegs. Not the rider's pegs, the pillion's pegs.

Absolute insanity
I really can't understand how this has happened, but if you buy your boots in anything other than kids' sizes the Monster 821 will drive you to distraction. You simply can't ride it with the balls of your feet on the pegs and instead you are forced to ride flat-footed due to the pillion peg hangers getting in the way. If you ride in a sporty fashion, with the balls of your feet on the pegs, you have to angle your feet outwards and ride pigeon toed to avoid the hangers. Frustrating isn't the word, it's a stupid piece of design that ruins the whole bike for me, especially as you can't (from what I can tell) remove the hangers as they are a one-piece cast section with the rider's peg.

A very desirable bike with one major flaw
A very desirable bike with one major flaw
The Monster comes of age
I really want to recommend the Monster 821 as it is a great bike with a lovely engine, balanced handling and all the soul you would expect from a Monster. Compared to the older bikes it feels a more complete machine that is far from a toy, however the foot peg disaster of design drove me wild. If, and this is a big if, you can live with it then the Monster is a cracking bike that has a lot of trick kit as standard (although, annoyingly, not a fuel gauge) that makes its £8,995 price tag seem justified. Personally, I couldn't live with the pegs and I'd be forced to either get an angle grinder out and never take a pillion or look elsewhere towards the likes of the Yamaha MT-09 or Triumph Street Triple. Do any Monster 821 owners out there feel the same way?


DUCATI MONSTER 821
Engine:
821cc 8v desmo V-twin liquid cooled,
Power (hp): 112@9,250rpm
Torque (lb ft): 66@7,750rpm
Top speed: 120mph (est.)
Weight: 179.5kg (dry)
MPG: 43mpg (est.)
Price: £8,995 (£8,795 for the Dark)






 

 

Author
Discussion

CedricN

Original Poster:

819 posts

144 months

Monday 22nd September 2014
quotequote all
Everytime I see an old aircooled monster I get reminded of how nice they look compared to the messy design of the newer watercooled bikes. I doesnt look special anymore, or is it just me?

jamespink

1,218 posts

203 months

Monday 22nd September 2014
quotequote all
Foot pegs designed by the same chap that designs Italian car steering wheel/pedal layouts. Almost unusable but "look how pretty it is"! How can Ducati release it like that?

Harry H

3,379 posts

155 months

Monday 22nd September 2014
quotequote all
The foot peg issue is there as the Monster has always been a girls bike. It's not a problem when your feet are size 5.

moanthebairns

17,918 posts

197 months

Monday 22nd September 2014
quotequote all
what is the actual wheel base of one of these. I've seen one before in the flesh and was staggered just how long it was.

thatdude

2,654 posts

126 months

Monday 22nd September 2014
quotequote all
jamespink said:
Foot pegs designed by the same chap that designs Italian car steering wheel/pedal layouts. Almost unusable but "look how pretty it is"! How can Ducati release it like that?
It's like the multistrada with it's very-ill designed centre stand



it's character, apparently

Tannedbaldhead

2,952 posts

131 months

Monday 22nd September 2014
quotequote all
Ducati are the most over-rated bikes I've ever ridden. Years ago I test-road a 748 biposto. The engine was rough, didn't rev yet the torque I was expecting just wasn't there, the handling was more edgy than legend inspiring, the dry clutch rattled like a bd about town and was grabby as hell, being air cooled it cooks your balls if you were stationary for any time at traffic lights, it had next to no lock and the spring up sidestand was a drop looking for somewhere to happen. Let it go as a fashion victim's wet dream and purchased a far superior ZX6R instead.

LoonR1

26,988 posts

176 months

Monday 22nd September 2014
quotequote all
Where's the usual Ducati wkfest? Is it because the journalist slagged it off that you all have to join in?

Come on, surely someone can post some vomit inducing Ducati supporting drivel. "it's the Ferrari of the bike world" would be a good start.

dibblecorse

6,872 posts

191 months

Monday 22nd September 2014
quotequote all
LoonR1 said:
Where's the usual Ducati wkfest? Is it because the journalist slagged it off that you all have to join in?

Come on, surely someone can post some vomit inducing Ducati supporting drivel. "it's the Ferrari of the bike world" would be a good start.
OK, I'll start ....

Fecking awesome street machine, looks and sounds glorious like all Ducatis, especially with some Termis fitted ....

Nothing Ducati have ever made has been a bad bike, just a bad choice by the buyer if they buy something that doesn't fit.

I have had a Monster, I have size 10 feet and at the time weighed nearly 17st, there was nothing wrong with the riding position at all, had there been I would have bought something else !!!

In the article he says they feel insubstanstial because he is 6ft but the bigger engined ones are ok, is that because his cock is actually too small to allow him to buy the lesser engined machine thereby requiring the 'cc extension' ... as dmensionally they are all the fecking same !!!

The 748's were pants bikes, especially compared to ZX6Rs that raced alongside them, but never dominated them !!!!

I love all this 'design over function' bks, I've done well over 100k miles on Ducatis and not had an issue, you lot ride 2000 miles a year on your Yamakawaondssukis and think you are in a position to judge.

Stick to polishing and leave the riding the the well informed.

(That ok Loon ? Dibs x)

Mastodon2

13,818 posts

164 months

Monday 22nd September 2014
quotequote all
LoonR1 said:
Where's the usual Ducati wkfest? Is it because the journalist slagged it off that you all have to join in?

Come on, surely someone can post some vomit inducing Ducati supporting drivel. "it's the Ferrari of the bike world" would be a good start.
Chris Harris bought one, don't you know?

I did ask in another thread recently what makes Ducati special apart from marketing, but didn't actually get an answer.

dibblecorse

6,872 posts

191 months

Monday 22nd September 2014
quotequote all
Mastodon2 said:
LoonR1 said:
Where's the usual Ducati wkfest? Is it because the journalist slagged it off that you all have to join in?

Come on, surely someone can post some vomit inducing Ducati supporting drivel. "it's the Ferrari of the bike world" would be a good start.
Chris Harris bought one, don't you know?

I did ask in another thread recently what makes Ducati special apart from marketing, but didn't actually get an answer.
History, heritage, racing pedigree, leading edge designs, some often not understood until they mature as designs, think the 999, they evoke a sense of occasion, until recently rarity, but they are getting a bit like Porsches these days, the exclusivity doesn't really exist, they need to be ridden, you don't just get on a Ducati and go quick, makes them rewarding as you need to learn to ride them, also the sound, nothing comes close if you are a fan of V (or L) Twins.

I could go on .... but I think you get the drift.

In saying all that though, there are 'better' bikes out there, but not as special, Ducati doesn't make the best bike in any class, but it often makes the one that many many want.

Mastodon2

13,818 posts

164 months

Monday 22nd September 2014
quotequote all
What scale do you measure "special" on?


dibblecorse

6,872 posts

191 months

Monday 22nd September 2014
quotequote all
Mastodon2 said:
What scale do you measure "special" on?
There isn't a scale, one mans special is another mans mundane, also one mans mix of attributes that make something special may be different to anothers.

To me Ducatis are very special because of a few things, one i'm italian, two always aspired to one, I find the 9*6/8 bikes achingly beautiful and thats where it all started for me ....

castex

4,935 posts

272 months

Monday 22nd September 2014
quotequote all
It's the Ferrari of the bike world. All I have to compare mine to is the Honda 500 I passed my test on, but my Ducati is way better. Faster, raucous voice, absolutely beautiful to these eyes, and just so flickable - it dances into, around and out of corners in a way that I'd always dreamed a sporting motorcycle would.

LoonR1

26,988 posts

176 months

Monday 22nd September 2014
quotequote all
dibblecorse said:
OK, I'll start ....

Fecking awesome street machine, looks and sounds glorious like all Ducatis, especially with some Termis fitted ....

Nothing Ducati have ever made has been a bad bike, just a bad choice by the buyer if they buy something that doesn't fit.

I have had a Monster, I have size 10 feet and at the time weighed nearly 17st, there was nothing wrong with the riding position at all, had there been I would have bought something else !!!

In the article he says they feel insubstanstial because he is 6ft but the bigger engined ones are ok, is that because his cock is actually too small to allow him to buy the lesser engined machine thereby requiring the 'cc extension' ... as dmensionally they are all the fecking same !!!

The 748's were pants bikes, especially compared to ZX6Rs that raced alongside them, but never dominated them !!!!

I love all this 'design over function' bks, I've done well over 100k miles on Ducatis and not had an issue, you lot ride 2000 miles a year on your Yamakawaondssukis and think you are in a position to judge.

Stick to polishing and leave the riding the the well informed.

(That ok Loon ? Dibs x)
Better, but not quite there, it somehow feels a bit forced and justified. You're supposed to write stuff like this:

Riding a Ducati Is like making lurve to a beautiful woman. First you see it from a distance and get drawn in by her beauty. Then when you get up close you realise it's a bit tatty and bits are falling off, but you justify that as character. Then you take her for a ride and you realise it's uncomfortable, jerky and a bit rougher than you actually wanted. Still, you stick with her and after a few months she starts to drain your wallet and spend more time at her exes place than yours (the dealership).

Tannedbaldhead

2,952 posts

131 months

Monday 22nd September 2014
quotequote all
dibblecorse said:
Mastodon2 said:
What scale do you measure "special" on?
There isn't a scale, one mans special is another mans mundane, also one mans mix of attributes that make something special may be different to anothers.

To me Ducatis are very special because of a few things, one i'm italian, two always aspired to one, I find the 9*6/8 bikes achingly beautiful and thats where it all started for me ....
I'm half Italian. I find Ducatis beautiful. I want to love them in a way I do with no other bike. I concede that something that makes me want to love it is testament to something very special going on. Then again the fact that inspite of such an emotional connection with the brand I have never chosen a Duke over some soulless Japanese alternative is an indication that something is amiss when it comes to delivering what I desire from a bike.
The Monster is the sort of bike that could rekindle my desire to get myself back riding. Gave up over ten years ago and something slower, less focused, less oh my god I'm gonna die, lighter, easier to ride and more fun than the race reps I used to ride like a tt with a little bit of something special is the sort of bike that could rope me in. I have the feeling however that after test-riding the Monster I'd end up on an ER6N or an SV650.

Edited by Tannedbaldhead on Monday 22 September 20:07

stuckmojo

2,955 posts

187 months

Tuesday 23rd September 2014
quotequote all
Although I like some Ducatis, like the old Monster, water cooled plumbing on a naked bike will always look terrible.

Look at the left side of the bike, with those ugly rubber pipes. It's ghastly.


ikarus

32 posts

283 months

Tuesday 23rd September 2014
quotequote all
The first Ducati I rode was the 659 Monster (LAMS approved). Compared to my BMW G650GS, it was an eye opener. The sound, the power, and the way it handled was addictive; but it was way too small for me (1.87 metres, 100kg).

The BMW gave me an excruciating pain at the bottom of my spine after a couple of hours, and it had to go. I tried the BMW G1200GS (the water cooled version), and it was very nice. Smooth, powerful, balanced - really very nice. Then someone said try the Multistrada, and I was hooked. Why? Well, it sounds better, when you get the revs up there's a banshee howl that's just fantastic (I've ditched the standard pipes for some Italian carbon fibre pipes that must be only just legal), and the handling is truly sublime. I've had some quality issues, but they were all fixed without demurral by the dealer, and I've personalised it a bit. All in all, I'm very happy.

Would I have been happy with the Beemer? Probably, provided I didn't try the Ducati.

I've ridden the Hyperstrada with the 821 engine (I would lose my licence or my life very quickly on that bike), and it was a peach. Smooth, and linear power delivery. I liked it very much.

Earlier this year, I rented a Honda ST1300 and rode it from Miami (FLA, like the song) to Washington DC. Hated that bike. Heavy, uncomfortable, tiring and boring.

So, Ducati fan fest? Love mine. Would like to try the Monster 1200S. I suspect the Monster 821 is just too small for this fat bd!


Chris Harris

494 posts

152 months

Tuesday 23rd September 2014
quotequote all
Love my 1200, but then I'm just the kind of ignorant, new-to-bikes, slow-riding, looks-driven, almost-middle-aged wally that fits the Ducati cliché.

So that probably compounds the issue for those who hate them.


frumpytrickle

245 posts

116 months

Tuesday 23rd September 2014
quotequote all
Chris Harris said:
Love my 1200, but then I'm just the kind of ignorant, new-to-bikes, slow-riding, looks-driven, almost-middle-aged wally that fits the Ducati cliché.

So that probably compounds the issue for those who hate them.
You bought the wrong bike. First ride should be 600 or less (preferably 125..) 1200 is stupid. You wont use all the power and have chicken strips.

LoonR1

26,988 posts

176 months

Tuesday 23rd September 2014
quotequote all
Chris Harris said:
Love my 1200, but then I'm just the kind of ignorant, new-to-bikes, slow-riding, looks-driven, almost-middle-aged wally that fits the Ducati cliché.

So that probably compounds the issue for those who hate them.
Exactly. I chose a sensible R1 when I had my midlife crisis in my mid 30s.