Alarms - motion sensors

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Discussion

Richyboy

Original Poster:

3,739 posts

217 months

Wednesday 1st October 2014
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House came with alarm system installed. When the alarm is not armed every time you walk in a room the motion sensors makes a slight clicking noise (almost like the press of a Casio digital watch beep plus a click), is this normal? Installer charged me a call out charge to come round and tell me it's normal but I've got sensitive hearing and its pissing me off. I'm told it's all hardwired so it's not a problem of low batteries as I first thought.

CoolHands

18,625 posts

195 months

Wednesday 1st October 2014
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my (yale alarm) wireless sensors are completely silent. I suspect it's the make of yours that means they click?

shtu

3,454 posts

146 months

Thursday 2nd October 2014
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The beep? Most alarms have a mode where the alarm "Chimes" when a sensor is triggered. Check the manual or the panel to see how to enable\disable.

Clicking sensors? My guess is they're ancient. You can replace a typical PIR with a good-quality one for a few quid each, eg, http://www.securitywarehouse.co.uk/catalog/index.p...

okie592

2,711 posts

167 months

Thursday 2nd October 2014
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They shouldn't click, pirs don't contain a relay that sound click, only resistors. Change them for something new

Westy Pre-Lit

5,087 posts

203 months

Thursday 2nd October 2014
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As said the clicking will be the relay on the alarm circuit within the PIR that shouldn't make a noise.

Unfortunately some can make a noise even when new but this is pretty rare, the only way of stopping it will be to change the PIR.

untruth

2,834 posts

189 months

Thursday 2nd October 2014
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We had an alarm when I was a kid that clicked, but this was about 1992.

I've not heard a 'relay' alarm for years, the alarm people are mad if they think it's "normal". Replace the PIR.

motco

15,947 posts

246 months

Thursday 2nd October 2014
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Westy Pre-Lit said:
As said the clicking will be the relay on the alarm circuit within the PIR that shouldn't make a noise.

Unfortunately some can make a noise even when new but this is pretty rare, the only way of stopping it will be to change the PIR.
I had a PIR in the hall of my last house and that clicked very loudly. I worked in conjunction with an alarm distributor at the time (ATH, now part of the Gardiner Group or its successors) and this PIR was a sample from a Spanish manufacturer and I'd been asked to evaluate it. Apart from the loud CLACK! when you passed it there was no problem. Well it was pug-ugly too...

Otispunkmeyer

12,588 posts

155 months

Thursday 2nd October 2014
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Out of interest, our new house has these everywhere except in the bedrooms. They also have a contact on the front door and you get that "bing bong" when someone comes in. Like a corner shop!

My question is, as we have a cat, would the IR detectors pick her up?

Would quite like to have the alarm on, especially when we go out. But if the cat decides to have its hour of mad running about whilst we are out, will I be getting angry letters from the neighbors?!

Richyboy

Original Poster:

3,739 posts

217 months

Thursday 2nd October 2014
quotequote all
The alarm guy said it was a click, but I don't think there are any moving parts. To me it sounds similar to a digital watch beep. Its a honeywell console.

I guess changing the PIRs is the only option. These are the PIRs I have at the moment:


motco

15,947 posts

246 months

Thursday 2nd October 2014
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Conventionally they have a voltage free relay that sits closed and opens when in alarm. Some relays are noisy, others, like reed relays, are near silent. I have never seen a PIR that beeps in a 'standard' alarm system. westy pre-lit knows better than I do, maybe he'll confirm it?

shtu

3,454 posts

146 months

Thursday 2nd October 2014
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A quick hunt suggests they are optex fx40 or similar. Not a brand I know of, but that doesn't mean much.

Fairly generic PIR. If it's bothering you that much, try changing one for a different brand.

untruth

2,834 posts

189 months

Thursday 2nd October 2014
quotequote all
Otispunkmeyer said:
Out of interest, our new house has these everywhere except in the bedrooms. They also have a contact on the front door and you get that "bing bong" when someone comes in. Like a corner shop!

My question is, as we have a cat, would the IR detectors pick her up?

Would quite like to have the alarm on, especially when we go out. But if the cat decides to have its hour of mad running about whilst we are out, will I be getting angry letters from the neighbors?!
Hey, we had exactly this problem. The angry letter was AMAZING, especially as we had no idea she was setting the alarm off. As far as I can tell there is simply no such thing as a pet-proof IR sensor, if the cat is in a certain position/proximity, they do still look like humans. Hell, I crawled around the lounge when we moved in and was convinced it wouldn't get set off after I wasn't picked up by it, but she still managed to set it off.

As a long term solution I recommend beam sensors, which splay across the room at a certain height. This works really well for us in another room as our cat isn't a climber.

shtu

3,454 posts

146 months

Thursday 2nd October 2014
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Try the pet-friendly version of,

http://resource.boschsecurity.com/documents/BlueLi...

No sensor is truely pet-proof, these use a combination of microwave and PIR detection to reduce false alarms. Odds are that they would work.

Otispunkmeyer

12,588 posts

155 months

Thursday 2nd October 2014
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untruth said:
Otispunkmeyer said:
Out of interest, our new house has these everywhere except in the bedrooms. They also have a contact on the front door and you get that "bing bong" when someone comes in. Like a corner shop!

My question is, as we have a cat, would the IR detectors pick her up?

Would quite like to have the alarm on, especially when we go out. But if the cat decides to have its hour of mad running about whilst we are out, will I be getting angry letters from the neighbors?!
Hey, we had exactly this problem. The angry letter was AMAZING, especially as we had no idea she was setting the alarm off. As far as I can tell there is simply no such thing as a pet-proof IR sensor, if the cat is in a certain position/proximity, they do still look like humans. Hell, I crawled around the lounge when we moved in and was convinced it wouldn't get set off after I wasn't picked up by it, but she still managed to set it off.

As a long term solution I recommend beam sensors, which splay across the room at a certain height. This works really well for us in another room as our cat isn't a climber.
Thought as much! Thanks for the tip on beam sensors. I shall look into those. Hopefully they are a straight swap plus some re positioning.

untruth

2,834 posts

189 months

Thursday 2nd October 2014
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Some people on here are more knowledgable about this, but we have an old one half way up the wall, so it faces the external door and window. Anyone entering there would get picked up.

tivver500

369 posts

270 months

Thursday 2nd October 2014
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Our house is fitted with combined IR and Microwave sensors (installed about 17 years ago) and to date we've not had a single false alarm caused by our four cats!!!
Believe the sensors are DI (Detection Instruments).
It was only a small local installer that knew about them - the big companies just told us to shut the cats in the kitchen when we went out

untruth

2,834 posts

189 months

Thursday 2nd October 2014
quotequote all
Well definitely see if you can find the model as there has been a lot of talk on here about people buying pet ones and them not working in the past.

(I still think a correctly positioned beam solves many of the issues for less uncertainty)

Gren

1,950 posts

252 months

Thursday 2nd October 2014
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Otispunkmeyer said:
Out of interest, our new house has these everywhere except in the bedrooms. They also have a contact on the front door and you get that "bing bong" when someone comes in. Like a corner shop!

My question is, as we have a cat, would the IR detectors pick her up?

Would quite like to have the alarm on, especially when we go out. But if the cat decides to have its hour of mad running about whilst we are out, will I be getting angry letters from the neighbors?!
We've had 'cat proof' sensors in our last 2 houses. Never once gone off and our 2 cats used to loon around the place, jumping over the furniture etc. Only thing we needed to cater for was one of them jumping on the top of the fridge freezer. Pretty sure they are the IR/Microwave ones mentioned above as there are a couple of colours of lights that they go when they sense you.

motco

15,947 posts

246 months

Thursday 2nd October 2014
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If you were to use only perimeter protection there would be no problem with cats or dogs, or people legitimately inside for that matter. Door contacts, window contacts, glass break detectors, and shock sensors are pretty fool proof. The downside is the installation is more complex and more wiring has to be hidden.

In the 1980s my company of the time was trying to promote a Canadian control panel which had automatic home and away settings but it depended on both perimeter protection and volumetric sensors. If the system was set and the exit door was used, the whole system set. If, however, the exit door was not used it set only the perimeter detection because the occupants were obviously still at home. A nice automatic concept but at variance with the growing dependence on space protection as the principal means of detection.