Harvard reckon Pluto should be a planet...
Discussion
'''' let the argument begin 
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/world-news/pluto-plan...
Some argue that allowing Pluto to qualify as a planet would also allow various large moons e.g. Titan to qualify too, though my view is that as they orbit a planet not the sun then they aren't planets. Ceres however would be a planet
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/world-news/pluto-plan...
Some argue that allowing Pluto to qualify as a planet would also allow various large moons e.g. Titan to qualify too, though my view is that as they orbit a planet not the sun then they aren't planets. Ceres however would be a planet
I think the removal of Pluto from the "planets" list is correct. There are too many Pluto like objects, probably hundreds, if not thousands. If Pluto was retained as a planet, it would have left the astronomical community with a real problem of finding names for all these objects. Pluto is a Kuiper Belt Object (KBO) rather than a planet and we will probably find that it shares more commonality with comets than moons or planets.
The New Horizons probe should answer some of these issues - although, no doubt, it will raise a few new ones too.
The New Horizons probe should answer some of these issues - although, no doubt, it will raise a few new ones too.
Eric Mc said:
I think the removal of Pluto from the "planets" list is correct. There are too many Pluto like objects, probably hundreds, if not thousands. If Pluto was retained as a planet, it would have left the astronomical community with a real problem of finding names for all these objects. Pluto is a Kuiper Belt Object (KBO) rather than a planet and we will probably find that it shares more commonality with comets than moons or planets.
The New Horizons probe should answer some of these issues - although, no doubt, it will raise a few new ones too.
It'll be interesting to see how Pluto compares to Ceres.The New Horizons probe should answer some of these issues - although, no doubt, it will raise a few new ones too.
MartG said:
'''' let the argument begin
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/world-news/pluto-plan...
Some argue that allowing Pluto to qualify as a planet would also allow various large moons e.g. Titan to qualify too, though my view is that as they orbit a planet not the sun then they aren't planets. Ceres however would be a planet
Pluto orbits a point outside itself...http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/world-news/pluto-plan...
Some argue that allowing Pluto to qualify as a planet would also allow various large moons e.g. Titan to qualify too, though my view is that as they orbit a planet not the sun then they aren't planets. Ceres however would be a planet
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pluto#mediaviewer/Fil...
So I'm not sure if that makes Pluto orbit its own moon?
FunkyNige said:
Pluto orbits a point outside itself...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pluto#mediaviewer/Fil...
So I'm not sure if that makes Pluto orbit its own moon?
Nope - they bot orbit the common centre of mass, known as a barycentre. The Earth & moon do the same, the only difference being their barycentre is within the Earth. In the future it is entirely possible we'll discover a pair of exoplanets of similar size to each other orbiting a barycentre in between them - they'll still be planets though.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pluto#mediaviewer/Fil...
So I'm not sure if that makes Pluto orbit its own moon?
CGP Grey has a great video which explains why Pluto is no longer recognised as a planet:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z_2gbGXzFbs
Hard to argue against....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z_2gbGXzFbs
Hard to argue against....
Pluto to me should be a planet as someone found it with the eye and a bit of guesswork / maths, like all the planets before.
So it is kin to Neptune, Uranus etc.
Of course that is a rather historical and romantic view, but I think in the vast cosmos where man doesn't actually mean that much that is quite a nice distinction.
So to me Pluto is a planet, from a human centric viewpoint.
I can live with that. I am happy if you class it as a planetoid or such or whatever though. You dry dry boring old c***s ..
heh heh
So it is kin to Neptune, Uranus etc.
Of course that is a rather historical and romantic view, but I think in the vast cosmos where man doesn't actually mean that much that is quite a nice distinction.
So to me Pluto is a planet, from a human centric viewpoint.
I can live with that. I am happy if you class it as a planetoid or such or whatever though. You dry dry boring old c***s ..
heh heh
We know far more about planets, moons, comets etc than we did in 1930. Sometimes we have to change our ideas based on better knowledge.
Do you also think the sun still goes around the earth - because that conclusion was drawn from poor and incorrect knowledge but by your opinion we should retain outmoded views on things because of sentiment?
Do you also think the sun still goes around the earth - because that conclusion was drawn from poor and incorrect knowledge but by your opinion we should retain outmoded views on things because of sentiment?
Eric Mc said:
We know far more about planets, moons, comets etc than we did in 1930. Sometimes we have to change our ideas based on better knowledge.
Do you also think the sun still goes around the earth - because that conclusion was drawn from poor and incorrect knowledge but by your opinion we should retain outmoded views on things because of sentiment?
Almost always I love your posts. On this occasion, however, you might be wrong. Recalibrate all you like - Pluto is a part of things. That's what they told me long ago and I believe it to this day.Do you also think the sun still goes around the earth - because that conclusion was drawn from poor and incorrect knowledge but by your opinion we should retain outmoded views on things because of sentiment?
Not sure what you mean by "a part of things".
Pluto is definitely part of the Solar System. Unfortunately for the "Pluto is a proper planet" supporters, it appears to be a type of object of which there could be at least another 800 similar objects. These objects are a half way house between what we would normally consider a "planet" and what we consider to be comets.
In its own way, it is another class of object, which have been christened Kuiper Belt Objects. If Pluto is classed as a planet, we have the dilemma of treating the other 800 plus similar objects as planets too. That was what prompted its change of status.
None of this diminishes the work carried out by Clyde Tombaugh 80 plus years ago. In some ways, it enhances it. Tombaugh can now be hailed, not as the person who discovered the last of the planets, but the man who discovered the first of a whole new class of object.
Pluto is definitely part of the Solar System. Unfortunately for the "Pluto is a proper planet" supporters, it appears to be a type of object of which there could be at least another 800 similar objects. These objects are a half way house between what we would normally consider a "planet" and what we consider to be comets.
In its own way, it is another class of object, which have been christened Kuiper Belt Objects. If Pluto is classed as a planet, we have the dilemma of treating the other 800 plus similar objects as planets too. That was what prompted its change of status.
None of this diminishes the work carried out by Clyde Tombaugh 80 plus years ago. In some ways, it enhances it. Tombaugh can now be hailed, not as the person who discovered the last of the planets, but the man who discovered the first of a whole new class of object.
Eric Mc said:
In its own way, it is another class of object, which have been christened Kuiper Belt Objects. If Pluto is classed as a planet, we have the dilemma of treating the other 800 plus similar objects as planets too. That was what prompted its change of status.
Pluto was de-planeted because of 800 things we haven't found yet?That's what I call the 'Local Council defence'. You prove your point, then they say 'Ah yes but if we did it for you we'd have to do it for everyone'. Which may be true but it's not a valid defence. Personally I think that if the first decision is correct, then that's how it should be for all others that qualify.
Perhaps we need a referendum!
The estimate is that there are AT LEAST 800 objects. It could be thousands - even tens of thousands. So far dozens have been discovered, tracked and orbits established. A number of these objects are actually BIGGER than Pluto.
We only started pinpointing these new objects in the 1990s - although astronomers had speculated since the 1940s that the solar system most probably didn't end with Pluto and that billions of objects must exist in belts or clouds further out. The two most vociferous voices in this debate were Dutch astronomer Jan Oort and American astronomer Gerard Kuiper.
Oort postulated a shell of icy objects surrounding the sun at a vast distance and it was from this "cloud " (named the Oort Cloud) that comets occasionally fell in towards the solar system proper.
Gerard Kuiper postulated that larger icy worlds existed beyond Pluto - left over from the formation of the solar system. Unlike the Oort Cloud, which surrounds the solar system like a shell, the belt imagined by Kuiper was on the same plane as the planets (the Ecliptic).
In the 1990s, the first of these Kuiper Belt Objects (KBOs) were found and since then quite a few more have been discovered. It was realised that Pluto, rather than being a full blown planet, was actually one of these KBOs - hence the reclassification.
It will be interesting to see what transpires when then New Horizons probe whizzes past Pluto next year and we get a good look at at for the first time.
Don't forget that Pluto is actually two objects, not one. So it is therefore quite a bit smaller than originally calculated by Tombaugh and his team. It consists of Pluto itself and an almost as large companion, Charon.
We only started pinpointing these new objects in the 1990s - although astronomers had speculated since the 1940s that the solar system most probably didn't end with Pluto and that billions of objects must exist in belts or clouds further out. The two most vociferous voices in this debate were Dutch astronomer Jan Oort and American astronomer Gerard Kuiper.
Oort postulated a shell of icy objects surrounding the sun at a vast distance and it was from this "cloud " (named the Oort Cloud) that comets occasionally fell in towards the solar system proper.
Gerard Kuiper postulated that larger icy worlds existed beyond Pluto - left over from the formation of the solar system. Unlike the Oort Cloud, which surrounds the solar system like a shell, the belt imagined by Kuiper was on the same plane as the planets (the Ecliptic).
In the 1990s, the first of these Kuiper Belt Objects (KBOs) were found and since then quite a few more have been discovered. It was realised that Pluto, rather than being a full blown planet, was actually one of these KBOs - hence the reclassification.
It will be interesting to see what transpires when then New Horizons probe whizzes past Pluto next year and we get a good look at at for the first time.
Don't forget that Pluto is actually two objects, not one. So it is therefore quite a bit smaller than originally calculated by Tombaugh and his team. It consists of Pluto itself and an almost as large companion, Charon.
ash73 said:
Eric Mc said:
A number of these objects are actually BIGGER than Pluto.
Only Eris... and they are almost exactly the same in diameter, but Eris is more massive.Pluto is a planet, so is Eris, imo.
We'll know better next year.
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