Average/low earners Porsche discussion!

Average/low earners Porsche discussion!

Author
Discussion

V8KSN

4,711 posts

183 months

Monday 20th October 2014
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I think its important to ensure you have a 'financial cushion' to guard yourself against any 'unplanned event' ........... and there is no point having a nice car if you are still living at home wink

SEE YA

3,522 posts

244 months

Monday 20th October 2014
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I think with most people in life, wife and kids and a house come first then your dream car later on.

It did with me anyway, was it worth the wait yes.

edc

9,231 posts

250 months

Monday 20th October 2014
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anonymous said:
[redacted]
You should try a tidy 550 Anniversary perhaps.

colnagoglyn

51 posts

132 months

Monday 20th October 2014
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One point to remember about depreciation is that it isn't a problem when buying as it can work in your favour, it can be a problem when selling though. Then again if you buy the right car that you are happy with and intend to keep it a good few years, depreciation becomes less relevant.
Depreciation and pricing seem to be a bit of an obsession on this forum, this I can understand for those who are buying for an investment or those that change their cars frequently. However for those at the lower price range of Porsche ownership and especially younger drivers I would say that running costs and a slush fund for unexpected repairs are a far greater consideration for someone like the OP.

My 2005 997s costs less than 20p to run excluding depreciation but I have recently had a new battery, new clutch and and two new cooling fan units fitted, £2000 including a minor service and MOT. They are the first costs over and above consumables in nearly ten years so I don't begrudge the money at all. I was fortunate to have the money in my "911 slush fund" but as I said above you do need to bear the running costs in mind (I dread to think how much the repairs would have cost at an OPC).

Personally I think a late 996 or early 997 represent great value, particularly if you hold onto them for a few years but you must be aware of the risks involved.

I love mine and as I am 59 years old intend to keep it for several more years so in my case depreciation isn't so important in my case but surely my 997will have some value when it's say 20 years old?

Edited by colnagoglyn on Monday 20th October 11:52

Mad March Taffy

508 posts

118 months

Monday 20th October 2014
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Based on experience I would also suggest that you try to find a solid, recommended Independent Porsche service/repair garage near you - they will prove invaluable in the long run and potentially save you a lot of headaches and money.

Homer J

789 posts

217 months

Monday 20th October 2014
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Great post OP.

If you want a Porsche hard enough, just keep working and saving. Nobody will give you that money. And as mentioned, the "dream" of one day having that Porsche will keep you motivated.

I got a 986 Boxster S at 26. Then a Carrera at 28. Then Turbo at 32, which i still have now, 5 years later. From my experience I would say try to drive a Boxster / Cayman, Carrera and possibly Turbo first. You may find once you've driven a Carrera or Turbo that's really where you want to be going.

I probably wasted my time and a few 1000 in depreciation with the Boxster S (As nice a car as it was), as I found out pretty soon what I really wanted was a Carrera. THe Turbo was just natural progression.

It may add a few years to the plan, but it's best to really go for the full fat dream smile IMO

hondansx

4,562 posts

224 months

Monday 20th October 2014
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It's nice to see a commitment to saving; a scarce concept these days when young 'uns believe being successful starts with a few selfies on Twitter.

As commendable as it is that you are saving, out of interest, what are your job plans? Jumping pay scales would help shortcut the need to save; have you looked at what you need to do in terms of performance or qualifications to achieve this? I appreciate you wouldn't want to go into huge detail, but on face value it seemed like you were settling for your current wage over the next 3 years.

Certainly encourage you to live for the moment though; when i was young and living at home with a girlfriend at university i spent ALL of my money on cars! I bought intelligently though; a VX220 at 19 (fantastic car, low insurance group, cheap to run) and an M3 CSL at 21 (stretched me significantly, but i had a plan and sold it for what i paid).

People are right, a lot can happen in 3 years, but you are young, make the most of it! There's no need to tie yourself into a mortgage as soon as you're earning decent money; make the most of having no responsibilities.

Don't use all your freedom on cars though; travel, see the world. Now i'm firmly in the hamster wheel, that's my biggest regret.

delays

786 posts

214 months

Monday 20th October 2014
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I bought my 986 2.5 when I was still a student earlier this year.

It cost less than £5k. It had had a lot of work done to it - perhaps I was lucky, but besides servicing most main consumables have been sorted by the previous owner inc rads, clutch, RMS.

I'll refurb the GT3 alloys and sort the hood in the summer, treat it to a service and maybe re-fresh the suspension coffin arms over next year. These 2.5s are still great propositions, and with the work done to it, I'll get my original cash back no problem. I mean - they can't get much lower IMO.

Instead of "spending" on depreciation, I'm spending on maintenance. As I move up the ranks in my career, I'll stash some cash and hop up the Pork ladder.

R1nur

1,086 posts

249 months

Monday 20th October 2014
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delays said:
Instead of "spending" on depreciation, I'm spending on maintenance.
That is a really good way of looking at it.

Dave Thornton

218 posts

148 months

Tuesday 21st October 2014
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R1nur said:
delays said:
Instead of "spending" on depreciation, I'm spending on maintenance.
That is a really good way of looking at it.
Exactly. Some people seem to think you only get depreciation when you sell. That's because they don't account for it correctly. In simplistic terms, depreciation is broken down into 2 parts: age and mileage. A car is usually a depreciating capital asset and depreciation is a running cost. Yes, it's a very boring subject, but I can never understand people who buy a newer, more economical car on the basis that it's got better mpg, only to spend 3x the saving on the extra depreciation. An understanding of this subject is useful for man-maths!

Nobbles

585 posts

259 months

Tuesday 21st October 2014
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I spent most of my savings (well what was left after a divorce) on a 996tt. I still remember the Car - performance car of the year magazine articles. In my time I lost a lot of money on depreciation and decided for a keeper. Anyway - my salary is not so bad - but obviously all outgoings are relative - bigger mortgage etc. Anyway with an 'in case' pot my fingers were seriously burnt in the first two years. Clutch, exhaust, rads etc... not even replaced the tyres and brakes yet. Things have now 'settled'. What I would suggest if you are going in for this: mechanical skills - for example if you can change your battery, or do basic things like take off the front bumper to clean out the rads - basically fairly simple jobs that just take time so that you do not have to pay a specialist/dealer. Even brakes as long as you fit the good parts and keep the receipts. Unfortunately/fortunately a Porsche in my view must have the service book stamped and kept up to date - specialist or OPC. I know it's forward thinking but I had a boxster previously and as the family grew the 996 rear seats are vital, if you anticipate this, then possibly get straight into a 996 therefore not losing your hard earned on the boxster and then trading it in. I would also anticipate some time off the road, this will enable if there is any problems that you have the time to get the good solution at the good price.

After all that I have to admit that after Sally from Cars I had a big dislike to early slim bodied fried egg lamped 996's, but now they have this very simple elegance - it's where I would put my money if I was in your position.

OvalOwl

924 posts

130 months

Tuesday 21st October 2014
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I've been looking at poverty pork for a few months. My car history consists of practical mile munchers that were cheap to insure (living in the South London badlands makes it expensive) which I typically bought at about £3,000 and ran until they were worth about £500 when bills to get them through the MOT were likely to be going beyond what the car was worth. Recently I shifted my price point to £5,000 - having accumulated that much by the time it came for a new to me car. Then I discovered Le Mans and thought it would be nice to have something more sporty to drive down there in. That was when I discovered a 986 Boxster could be had for about £5,000.

The insurance costs don't seem too steep, if I shop around I can get it for just a little more than I am paying now. Of course I realise I need a contingency fund to cover things like clutch replacement and the other well documented problems. I figure if I get one on 17" wheels the tyre costs remain in the realms of sensibility. Most of the available cars have long since gone to independent specialists and I figure that is the way to go with a bit of DIY.

IMI A

9,410 posts

200 months

Tuesday 21st October 2014
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OP do not listen to the nay sayers re Boxsters. In your shoes I'd buy the best 986 Boxster S you find. Fab car and all the Porsche you will ever need. In my first one which did not have TC had some fun oversteer moments at 1.5 leptons which made my passenger (and myself) have a new underwear needed moment. Cracking cars and much more difficult to catch/drive once you reach the cars limits especially in the wet! Every bit as good as a 911 if not better in many ways.

richneedsacar

Original Poster:

45 posts

119 months

Thursday 23rd October 2014
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Thanks for the replies guys - all of the advice given is good and I can see why each suggestion makes sense to different people! Over the past few months, I've probably considered pretty much everyone option that's been mentioned!

My thought pattern has been something like this - I originally thought it would definitely be a 987 gen 1 Cayman, then I moved to a 987 Boxter because they were cheaper, then I thought I may as well pay a bit more and get a Cayman because that's what I really want, then I thought for a bit more I could get a 997 and so on! From then, I've gone back to each model a 1000 times.

I do really like 986 Boxters, I just don't think I want one because it's a bit of a step backwards in terms of interior from Cooper Si. I know the R56 Mini's have a bad reputation for their interior but my car has the lounge leather and sat nav and the interior is brilliant! I do have a long term girlfriend and to appease her, it needs to be a nice-ish place to be - so I think 987 is as old as i'll go.

I take the points that I coulld pretty much sell the Mini and get a Boxter now - I've been a car nut my whole life but a late bloomer driving, so the Mini Cooper S is actually my first car. So I'm wanting to have more driving experience before I get into the Porsche.


Thanks for all the replies fellas, it's made my brain spin even faster considering all of my options! Today, it's 987 Boxter.


AvonRise

50 posts

113 months

Thursday 23rd October 2014
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Have you looked at and properly compared a 987 with a 986?

I ask, because, in my opinion, the 986 feels more 'Porsche', whilst the 987, if you blanked the badges, feels like it's just a generic German car interior.

If you're concerned by lack of stuff like integrated navigation, this is easily fixed by installing a double-din head unit, like a Pioneer App Radio.



Also, in my opinion, the interiors with silver highlights look a lot better than those without.

Edited by AvonRise on Thursday 23 October 21:02

rouge59

332 posts

126 months

Thursday 23rd October 2014
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We bought a 986 3 1/2 years ago with a view to dipping our toe in the Porsche brand then upgrading to a 987/996/7 in a year or two, but it's cost us nothing other than routine maintenance & consumables, & my missus adores her little guards Red Boxster as a daily which ticked over 80k last week.

I went to an open day at the indy I use & saw the 986, 987 & 991 lined up together & was struck just how flabby & bloated the newer models are, & certainly not roadsters, which leads me to believe we'll keep the 986 until it dies & I'll scratch the 911 itch in a year or two.

As for the reliability issue, my indy is very busy & has only ever seen 1 IMS failure since the allegedly chocolate engines came out.


davidc1

1,544 posts

161 months

Thursday 23rd October 2014
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Good luck , I will scratch the same Porsche itch at some stage.
Just don't leave yourself short in order to do it.
Also do it before you have to get a green light from the other half!

stuckmojo

2,955 posts

187 months

Friday 24th October 2014
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When I bought my 996 I had a few golden rules I would not break:

Must have - Car must be Carrera 2, Manual.
Nice to have - No sunroof, standard seats (the sport seats are uncomfortable for my shoulders)
Mileage - Less than 120,000 miles
Cost - 10,000 GBP Max
Service history - Full but ok with OPC and Specialists.
No Cat D

I bought it in cash and budgeted a 2,000GBP per year running costs at 20,000 per year.

First expenses (one week after purchase)
- Pelican Parts updated IMS
- Lower temperature thermostat
- oil change

The rest was mostly routine maintenance. The only thing which went wrong was the key fob(s). Had to buy new keys and get them coded. Indie did that for not much money.

I have never thought of depreciation as I expected the car to be at or near the bottom of its depreciation curve. Plus I don't plan to ever sell it. Currently it sits in storage waiting for me to get back from Asia.

OP. Buy one now if you have the budget. Smart advice above to think about the depreciation of your mini.

richardalanlee

1,733 posts

136 months

Saturday 25th October 2014
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Great discussions here.
My advice, like those who've said it before, is early 996.

I like your savings plan, but I think you're probably closer than you think. If you get a 10k 996, you can probably get there in cash. However, I'd trade the mini, sit on the cash, and borrow 5k over three years from the bank to get initial items sorted/bridge the gap. You've then got a fund for when things need doing, you won't feel too stretched, and the interest per year is pretty tiny. The repayments will be less than you're saving in cash, and it don't think the car will be dipping in value, probably going up as much as the interest cost if anything.

If you're local then I'd gladly let you see why the 996 works so well for me.
I'd avoid a turbo. Having run a more premium 911, the costs can get big quickly, at which point you might find yourself out of your depth.

Also, I like the advice re: careers. However, don't underestimate the leg up than turning up to the office in a nice car can give you!

richardalanlee

1,733 posts

136 months

Saturday 25th October 2014
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Great list. My addition was that it had to be an early one on ambers, with no bodykit.

There are great deals about on Rainforrest and Ocean Blue cars, with Savannah interiors. Fortunately that's what I was looking for, although some refer to them as colour scheme of death. If that means resale value then I'm sorted. I can't lose what I didn't pay!

I'd also say that the number of 996 C2s at the low end is diminishing, which doesn't mean you're going to make money, but certainly makes selling a good one easier.


stuckmojo said:
When I bought my 996 I had a few golden rules I would not break:

Must have - Car must be Carrera 2, Manual.
Nice to have - No sunroof, standard seats (the sport seats are uncomfortable for my shoulders)
Mileage - Less than 120,000 miles
Cost - 10,000 GBP Max
Service history - Full but ok with OPC and Specialists.
No Cat D

I bought it in cash and budgeted a 2,000GBP per year running costs at 20,000 per year.

First expenses (one week after purchase)
- Pelican Parts updated IMS
- Lower temperature thermostat
- oil change

The rest was mostly routine maintenance. The only thing which went wrong was the key fob(s). Had to buy new keys and get them coded. Indie did that for not much money.

I have never thought of depreciation as I expected the car to be at or near the bottom of its depreciation curve. Plus I don't plan to ever sell it. Currently it sits in storage waiting for me to get back from Asia.

OP. Buy one now if you have the budget. Smart advice above to think about the depreciation of your mini.