Missing oil Mystery

Missing oil Mystery

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PlusOneToo

Original Poster:

65 posts

122 months

Tuesday 21st October 2014
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Backstory is, 2013 V8 Vantage bought Feb with 4100 miles on the clock. Having covered some 200 miles from delivery I checked oil everything ok.
In April car went into dealers for a routine service having done 300 miles from delivery.
In early October having covered 2100 miles from delivery, car went to Works for a free health check. Report shows everything ok ( no itemised invoice to see what they checked)
Yesterday, before I started it, I checked oil after a further 100 miles and nothing. Nada. Not a hint of oil. I have today put in 1 litre and its just about on the end of the dipstick.

I called Works and they assure me that the oil level would have been one of they things they checked on the "health check". So where has about 2 litres or more of oil gone in 100 miles? No warning lights, garage floor is clear and no excessive oil smoke from exhaust. If Works didn't check the oil is 2 litres of consumption normal over some 2000 miles?

mikey k

13,011 posts

215 months

Tuesday 21st October 2014
quotequote all
PlusOneToo said:
Backstory is, 2013 V8 Vantage bought Feb with 4100 miles on the clock. Having covered some 200 miles from delivery I checked oil everything ok.
In April car went into dealers for a routine service having done 300 miles from delivery.
In early October having covered 2100 miles from delivery, car went to Works for a free health check. Report shows everything ok ( no itemised invoice to see what they checked)
Yesterday, before I started it, I checked oil after a further 100 miles and nothing. Nada. Not a hint of oil. I have today put in 1 litre and its just about on the end of the dipstick.

I called Works and they assure me that the oil level would have been one of they things they checked on the "health check". So where has about 2 litres or more of oil gone in 100 miles? No warning lights, garage floor is clear and no excessive oil smoke from exhaust. If Works didn't check the oil is 2 litres of consumption normal over some 2000 miles?
As it is a dry sump you MUST stick to the manuals advice on dipping the oil or it WILL come up low.
If you did then pull the PCV/breather hose that clips on to the front right hand side of the inlet manifold
Any oil there suggests the PCV is dead and the oil is being pulled in to the fuel/air mix and burnt (you wouldn't see this amount in the exhaust fumes IME)

Jon1967x

7,175 posts

123 months

Tuesday 21st October 2014
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You need to check it pretty quick and hope you've not over filled it

telum01

987 posts

114 months

Tuesday 21st October 2014
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mikey k said:
If you did then pull the PCV/breather hose that clips on to the front right hand side of the inlet manifold
Any oil there suggests the PCV is dead and the oil is being pulled in to the fuel/air mix and burnt (you wouldn't see this amount in the exhaust fumes IME)
This happens with every V8V I've checked, regardless of the PCV's condition.

Speedraser

1,656 posts

182 months

Tuesday 21st October 2014
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The "missing" oil is in the engine -- where it's supposed to be when the engine isn't running. It's only "missing" from the dry sump tank.

As Mikey said, you MUST check it using the PROPER procedure for the dry sump system. Based on your post, you checked the level with the engine off -- which means you got an incorrect level reading. Read the manual (there may also be a sticker on the dry sump tank just under the cap) and follow the procedure. Hopefully it isn't over-full now.

PlusOneToo

Original Poster:

65 posts

122 months

Tuesday 21st October 2014
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Thank you for replying so promptly guys but following the book and watched the u tube video I think Im doing it correctly.

Tell me if I'm wrong but isn't the procedure 1) to dip the oil when the engine is cold and been standing for a while on level ground and check there is oil on the dip stick, then if there is oil to the correct level 2) start the car for a period at given revs and check it again. on BOTH occasions there should be oil. Your advice seems to be to ignore the zero reading when its cold and been standing and check it after its been started, surely that cant be right?




J12KJR

2,860 posts

242 months

Tuesday 21st October 2014
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Hand book states run engine at 2000 rpm for 20 seconds, turn off leave for 30 seconds and then check level.

Jon39

12,782 posts

142 months

Tuesday 21st October 2014
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OP,

Others have explained what you need to do, but there is a point I can add, which caused me confusion as a new owner.

I think (am doing this from memory), the oil checking instructions start by saying, 'Check there is oil on the dipstick - - -‘.

I found no oil on the dipstick, so added some before following the oil checking procedure. Then the oil level was too high, so I spent a long time sucking the excess out.

What the instructions do not explain, is that when a car is unused for about four weeks, there will not be any oil on the dipstick anyway, because it has drained away from the dry sump tank. The engine oil level though, may still remain perfectly correct. Presumably under those circumstances, it is then wise to use the engine crank feature to build oil pressure before statring the engine.





Edited by Jon39 on Tuesday 21st October 20:57

PlusOneToo

Original Poster:

65 posts

122 months

Tuesday 21st October 2014
quotequote all
Jon39, thank you, you have a good memory That has cleared up the confusion.

J12KJR and others have missed the section which you Jon39 point out and I have been trying to achieve i.e. the book says "Check the oil level when the engine is completely cold" and "before starting the engine……check that there is engine oil on the dipstick" Thats exactly what I did and there wasn't any so Ive put a full litre in it just to get it to show at the bottom.
What a daft system it is that if the car has been stood a while then its no good checking the oil before you start the engine because if it is the correct level there shouldn't be any indication of any, which is the same level as if you hadn't got any at all. Im learning a lot about Astons!!

mikey k

13,011 posts

215 months

Tuesday 21st October 2014
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Which is why none of the long standing owners ever go for " no oil from cold before starting"
Being a sort of dry sump system the dip stick is not sat in an area where the oil collects under gravity
It needs to be circulated and "pumped" into the dip stick reservoir

Edited by mikey k on Wednesday 22 October 09:26

Jon39

12,782 posts

142 months

Tuesday 21st October 2014
quotequote all

PlusOneToo said:
Jon39, thank you, you have a good memory That has cleared up the confusion.

Yes, the handbook does seem to ignore the, unused for a few weeks aspect.

Make sure you extract the overfilled oil, before driving your car.

I put a clear plastic tube into the dry sump tank, sucked briefly then finger over the end. Rather a slow method, but I could not think of a better way.



Mr Aston Martin

478 posts

159 months

Wednesday 22nd October 2014
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I had the same experience and a nice bill for my trouble.


In the immortal words of a service guy from Stratstone " I don't which is worse, owners who don't touch their cars or owners who do".

J12KJR

2,860 posts

242 months

Wednesday 22nd October 2014
quotequote all
PlusOneToo said:
Jon39, thank you, you have a good memory That has cleared up the confusion.

J12KJR and others have missed the section which you Jon39 point out and I have been trying to achieve i.e. the book says "Check the oil level when the engine is completely cold" and "before starting the engine……check that there is engine oil on the dipstick" Thats exactly what I did and there wasn't any so Ive put a full litre in it just to get it to show at the bottom.
What a daft system it is that if the car has been stood a while then its no good checking the oil before you start the engine because if it is the correct level there shouldn't be any indication of any, which is the same level as if you hadn't got any at all. Im learning a lot about Astons!!
Perhaps it works on the fact that no owner is going to put their car away for any period let alone an extended one when there was insufficient oil in it, to do that you were already running it without enough oil it which I am sure you wouldn't do.

V8 Animal

5,914 posts

209 months

Wednesday 22nd October 2014
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Having it serviced once a year should be enough not to have to check it.
Unless you do more than say 10k which most of us don't.

J12KJR

2,860 posts

242 months

Wednesday 22nd October 2014
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V8 Animal said:
Having it serviced once a year should be enough not to have to check it.
Unless you do more than say 10k which most of us don't.
I am going to assume you are joking, while there is a good chance you won't have to top it up between services on the basis of low mileages covered I would still be checking it on a regular basis.

PlusOneToo

Original Poster:

65 posts

122 months

Wednesday 22nd October 2014
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Many thanks everyone for helping me with this. I will take everything on board and do better next time and I will make sure I remove the potential overfill before I start the car.

Stuart




Neil1300r

5,487 posts

177 months

Wednesday 22nd October 2014
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J12KJR said:
V8 Animal said:
Having it serviced once a year should be enough not to have to check it.
Unless you do more than say 10k which most of us don't.
I am going to assume you are joking, while there is a good chance you won't have to top it up between services on the basis of low mileages covered I would still be checking it on a regular basis.
+1 Have topped up mine between services

Speedraser

1,656 posts

182 months

Wednesday 22nd October 2014
quotequote all
J12KJR said:
Perhaps it works on the fact that no owner is going to put their car away for any period let alone an extended one when there was insufficient oil in it, to do that you were already running it without enough oil it which I am sure you wouldn't do.
Assuming there was no indication of the level being too low when the car was last run, there shouldn't be much of a need to check the level before starting the engine and then checking the level. Unless there is a big puddle of oil under the car...

FWIW, dry-sumped (air-cooled) Porsche 911s also require the engine to be running (and with the oil at normal operating temperature) when checking the oil level.

J12KJR

2,860 posts

242 months

Wednesday 22nd October 2014
quotequote all
Speedraser said:
J12KJR said:
Perhaps it works on the fact that no owner is going to put their car away for any period let alone an extended one when there was insufficient oil in it, to do that you were already running it without enough oil it which I am sure you wouldn't do.
Assuming there was no indication of the level being too low when the car was last run, there shouldn't be much of a need to check the level before starting the engine and then checking the level. Unless there is a big puddle of oil under the car...

FWIW, dry-sumped (air-cooled) Porsche 911s also require the engine to be running (and with the oil at normal operating temperature) when checking the oil level.
I think we are both saying the same thing but in different ways.
With regard to the Porsche system the TVR Speed Six is exactly the same and as you say on the basis you aren't going to run your car with low oillevel shouldn't be a problem unless you slipped in the oil pool when entering the garage.
As with the AM system you have to check from cold I just tend to do this every few hundred miles or before a decent run out/hoon.

Quinny

15,814 posts

265 months

Thursday 23rd October 2014
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My view on the Aston lube system is that, it holds around 10 litres of oil... This is more than twice what an average car with a sump would carry.
So unless there's a massive pool of oil, or some sort of catastrophic engine failure that means it's burning it at an excessive rate, which even the most inattentive owner would notice, there should always be enough oil to in the tank to provide adequate lubrication...