New house - tennant - massive debt by owner :-(

[DickusMaximus]

Just moved in to a lovely cottage. 12 month Short Hold Tenancy. All standard. The lass who owns the place has left behind a tatty, untaxed and uninsured Focus and… a few letters demanding sums over £12000 from creditors talking about bankruptcy and asking why she hasn’t contacted them in months. It's through an agency and the deposit's with the TDS. All above board apart from the car and the personal debt.

If they repossess the place will the first I know be when I come home and the locks are changed?

(The motor and the house are on a private road btw so I don’t think I can get the car towed by DVLA if she doesn’t answer the agent’s question about shifting it)

[Centurion07]

Someone who knows what they're talking about will be along in a minute but in the meantime.....I'M almost certain as a tenant you're pretty much safe as regards to being turfed out by the bank. In fact, I would go so far as to say they have to give you 2 or 3 months to find a new place, or they may even have to let you complete your tenancy.

Like I said, someone who actually knows the facts will be along soon enough to confirm or ridicule what I've just said..

[jrinns]

I purchased a repo from a bank last month at auction, the tenant stayed in all the way from the owner being made bankrupt in March.

[Simpo Two]

£12K is worth some effort to recover so you can expect summonses in the owner's name and bailiff visits - but the good news is that they are not for you. You may like to write to each creditor explaining the situation - there's nothing guaranteed to get the recovery ball rolling than no response. County Court bailiffs are relatively powerless but High Court sheriffs are another matter and can take the car if they can prove it belongs to the creditor and it's worth anything (not your problem, it will tidy the place up!). As for the house and contents, they are well used to the occupants saying 'Nah mate that's not me, must be some other geezah' so you will need to prove you're who you say you are and that you rent it from the creditor. If you've paid your rent they can't just evict you.

So expect some choppy waters, but you are not the target.

[DickusMaximus]

Simpo Two said:

£12K is worth some effort to recover so you can expect summonses in the owner's name and bailiff visits - but the good news is that they are not for you. You may like to write to each creditor explaining the situation - there's nothing guaranteed to get the recovery ball rolling than no response. County Court bailiffs are relatively powerless but High Court sheriffs are another matter and can take the car if they can prove it belongs to the creditor and it's worth anything (not your problem, it will tidy the place up!). As for the house and contents, they are well used to the occupants saying 'Nah mate that's not me, must be some other geezah' so you will need to prove you're who you say you are and that you rent it from the creditor. If you've paid your rent they can't just evict you.

So expect some choppy waters, but you are not the target.

Phew. Thank you so much folks :-)

[Phateuk]

Simpo Two said:

£12K is worth some effort to recover so you can expect summonses in the owner's name and bailiff visits - but the good news is that they are not for you. You may like to write to each creditor explaining the situation - there's nothing guaranteed to get the recovery ball rolling than no response. County Court bailiffs are relatively powerless but High Court sheriffs are another matter and can take the car if they can prove it belongs to the creditor and it's worth anything (not your problem, it will tidy the place up!). As for the house and contents, they are well used to the occupants saying 'Nah mate that's not me, must be some other geezah' so you will need to prove you're who you say you are and that you rent it from the creditor. If you've paid your rent they can't just evict you.

So expect some choppy waters, but you are not the target.

This. The high court enforcers will try for open windows/unlocked doors etc and can legally enter a property through such means (for business premises they can legally force entry). Also, if they knock the door and you open it they will put a foot in the door preventing you closing it and at that point you can't legally kick them out.

[Simpo Two]

DickusMaximus said:

Phew. Thank you so much folks :-)

I'm glad it was helpful. I'm not an expert, but having been on the 'dishing out' end and I have some knowledge... You may find it interesting to watch 'The Sheriffs are coming' or ' Can't pay - we'll take it away' to see how firm but fair such people are. I think they're brilliant, and show what the police should be doing if they weren't obsessed with speeding.

[ben5732]

Happened to my other half a few years back. Repossessed in around March she was allowed to stay till September, moved out August with no issues.

[DickusMaximus]

The High Court stuff is what I was concerned about. If they take my stuff isn't that dodgy though? If they don't know it's not the owner's stuff?

I think an email to the agent is needed to explain that I found the letters and am concerned. She's clearly done something of a runner. The phone's still connected!

[Simpo Two]

DickusMaximus said:

The High Court stuff is what I was concerned about. If they take my stuff isn't that dodgy though? If they don't know it's not the owner's stuff?

I think an email to the agent is needed to explain that I found the letters and am concerned. She's clearly done something of a runner. The phone's still connected!

Sheriffs will only be involved if the case has already gone to court and a CCJ awarded. If you're getting all the post then you should know how it's progressing! As for the contents being yours and not the debtor's, does your contract state furnished or unfurnished? If the latter then everything inside must be yours...

And yes, contact everyone you can about what's happening and your position.

[djfaulkner]

DickusMaximus said:

It's through an agency and the deposit's with the TDS. All above board apart from the car and the personal debt.

Have you spoken to the agency, They might have experience of dealing with this type of thing.
Also - If the letters are coming to the house, Does the OP need to forward them on somewhere?, If not could the owner just say she hasnt received any letters?

[Sheepshanks]

Centurion07 said:

Someone who knows what they're talking about will be along in a minute but in the meantime.....I'M almost certain as a tenant you're pretty much safe as regards to being turfed out by the bank.

I wonder if the lender knows the house is let?

I think being turfed out with no notice is one of those things that in theory shouldn't happen - but in practice it does.

[DickusMaximus]

Sheepshanks said:

I wonder if the lender knows the house is let?

I think being turfed out with no notice is one of those things that in theory shouldn't happen - but in practice it does.

Do you know of any examples?

[Sheepshanks]

I'm aware of it as it happened to a family in our village - although that was a cock-up all round as they forced entry and changed the locks on the wrong house. Which is why it makes me laugh when people say what can and can't happen - they just went ahead and did it.


There was another thread a couple of weeks ago about your issue - http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?t=145...

[Welshbeef]

Sheepshanks said:

I wonder if the lender knows the house is let?

I think being turfed out with no notice is one of those things that in theory shouldn't happen - but in practice it does.

I guess its possible that some landlords do not get formal permission to let changing a residential mortgage or having a buy to let product. Why is it possible - given letters are going to the house address it would seem odd, none of my let properties have any correspondence going to those properties they come directly to my main residence.

What happens in that situation no idea I guess would you be deemed squatting by no fault of your own? A question for those who know a lot more I'd say.

[PurpleMoonlight]

Why are you opening someone elses mail?

[Welshbeef]

PurpleMoonlight said:

Why are you opening someone elses mail?

Easy go get around simply in error opened without checking- prove otherwise

[DickusMaximus]

Well, this is escalating nicely.

Letter from the mortgage firm* stating the arrangement to pay the mortgage is £6k behind and 'as you are aware we have a possession order against the property...'

So she's deliberately gone to a lettings agent in the happy knowledge that the place is very likely due for reposession. Nice.

And at 2am this morning she invited me to Connect on LinkedIn.

The agent says 'I've not dealt with anything like this before so I will speak with my manager'

I called the mortgage folks who were polite and nice enough to say that the owner had recently been in contact so either:

(a) she will use my 1000 a month to pay the 900 mortgage

or

(b) she'll pay sod all and keep my 1000 until I get turfed out

And the flipping Focus is still untaxed and uninsured on the private drive so my sports car stays on a public road in full view.

• hand-delivered / not opened by me / opened in error etc etc

[Welshbeef]

The mortgage co will rightly not speak to you.



I had an issue once where by a tenant didn't change his address once he moved out - one problem was a mobile phone bill. I called them stating he had moved out months/a year ago so please stop sending them as I was simply returning them to Vodaphone in the post. They said there is nothing they can do... In which case I replied if you do not stop sending them I am going to open each and every bill you send to this address. They didn't send anymore after that - I assume they called the chap directly to verify but what a hassle to deal with.
They got quite irate about it not being allowed to open another persons mail - to which I replied try stopping me (they didn't know who I was no name given and a number of people living at the premises at the time)

[DickusMaximus]

Sorted thanks Welshbeef et al.

Agency owner called. They’re livid. They already called Halifax to volunteer the rent direct to them. Nothing to do with 'owner' anymore she’s broken the contract. Assuming mortgage bank agree (and he’s sure they will) then I can stay for as long as the agreement is in place. Might even buy the gaff down the line.

Colleague pointed out that I’m entitled to live ‘withough fear’ and as I work from home I have a duty of care to my employer so I can change the locks and agency should pay half. Worth thinking about. 

PLUS - agency says I can withhold rent until she moves the car!