TVR News

Author
Discussion

Gazzab

21,061 posts

281 months

Thursday 21st May 2015
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Have driven a V8 RS4 Avant and find the Golf R more exciting (whilst performance is pretty similar the Golf feels faster). But do agree the TVR is much more of an event.

Milky400

1,960 posts

177 months

Thursday 21st May 2015
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RetroWheels said:
TVR as a Marque isn't complete without some form of racing association.

I remember writing that on a PH forum nearly a decade ago (at a time when N.S had already dismantled TVR Motorsport) and IMO it still holds true today.

AFAIK the new owners have had sports car racing involvement before,so im finding it difficult to imagine a re-born TVR from these guys that doesn't include a race car.

So with no actual facts whatsoever (in true PH forum style hehe) im going to predict here and now, that the next big TVR announcment will (or should !) be a new Race Car.
I was thinking the very same. Les was heavily involved in the AM Le Mans efforts, maybe from the outside looking in it was purely financial. I was thinking of a TVR Le Man entry of sorts (then i woke up)Although not to sure whether you need to be producing road cars to enter.

Also another thought i had was that the former Caterham F1 HQ and factory is for sale? not that im saying they would enter F1, but could be a good set up to start reproduction with..

5.0ltr

2,750 posts

198 months

Thursday 21st May 2015
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RetroWheels said:
TVR as a Marque isn't complete without some form of racing association.

I remember writing that on a PH forum nearly a decade ago (at a time when N.S had already dismantled TVR Motorsport) and IMO it still holds true today.

AFAIK the new owners have had sports car racing involvement before,so im finding it difficult to imagine a re-born TVR from these guys that doesn't include a race car.

So with no actual facts whatsoever (in true PH forum style hehe) im going to predict here and now, that the next big TVR announcment will (or should !) be a new Race Car.

RetroWheels

3,384 posts

270 months

Thursday 21st May 2015
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5.0ltr said:
RetroWheels said:
TVR as a Marque isn't complete without some form of racing association.

I remember writing that on a PH forum nearly a decade ago (at a time when N.S had already dismantled TVR Motorsport) and IMO it still holds true today.

AFAIK the new owners have had sports car racing involvement before,so im finding it difficult to imagine a re-born TVR from these guys that doesn't include a race car.

So with no actual facts whatsoever (in true PH forum style hehe) im going to predict here and now, that the next big TVR announcment will (or should !) be a new Race Car.
Yep, well aware of all that, but im betting we will see a new , built and ready to drive TVR race car Before we see a road car.

350Matt

3,733 posts

278 months

Thursday 21st May 2015
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Really?
I'd have thought if Les wants to make money then he's going to want get a saleable product to market as soon as he can

as any project of this size is going to need outside help / contractors etc etc

so it can't just rumble on forever there has to be some fruition

fatbutt

2,631 posts

263 months

Thursday 21st May 2015
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W, the, F! Guys, TVR does not need to take on anyone to succeed. They need to make a decent enough return on a handfull of cars that will go to people who want to buy them. They don't need to be the fastest, best handling, or anything else other than a product that people want to buy. If cars were only successful because they ruled the roost on one particular performance item then everyone would be buying boxsters.

I personally hope the new cars will have a strong V8 (my vote is still for a Ford 5.0), stiff chassis, simple yet effective styling and plenty of noise. If they build enough to stay in business then great.

They will never be Porsche/ Audi/ etc.; that arguably was the failing of the 90's. People bought them because of all the attention they were getting and thought they were buying something mainstream.

As long as its a decent enough TVR and the company maintains the attitude (Remember the motor shows? Always interesting to be around the TVR stand), I'll have one.

V8 GRF

7,294 posts

209 months

Thursday 21st May 2015
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5.0ltr said:
I was reliably told that Les never actually said any of that....


... by Les himself.

Milky400

1,960 posts

177 months

Thursday 21st May 2015
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Does he still have contacts at/with AM?

V8 GRF

7,294 posts

209 months

Thursday 21st May 2015
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Milky400 said:
Does he still have contacts at/with AM?
He's certainly a good customer.

5.0ltr

2,750 posts

198 months

Thursday 21st May 2015
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V8 GRF said:
I was reliably told that Les never actually said any of that....


... by Les himself.
Journo's eh?

Bluebottle

3,498 posts

239 months

Thursday 21st May 2015
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RetroWheels said:
...So with no actual facts whatsoever (in true PH forum style hehe) im going to predict here and now, that the next big TVR announcment will (or should !) be a new Race Car...
Initially I laughed at that...then I thought about it, and it does actually make sound business imho, assuming his rich financial backers can play the long game (financially).
Set up a race series, build 24 race cars which show the kind of style they intend for the production car (which you sell at a reduced price to the teams to keep your costs down) and use the race series to market the reborn Brand...by the end of the season you've shown that TVR is reliable again (hopefully) you've tested the market on the new style/build methods...etc etc.
Basically use the race series as the launch pad and viral marketing tool first...Its a darn site cheaper than building 500 cars you're not sure anyone wont's or likes and everything that goes with that?

Milky400

1,960 posts

177 months

Thursday 21st May 2015
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Bluebottle said:
Initially I laughed at that...then I thought about it, and it does actually make sound business imho, assuming his rich financial backers can play the long game (financially).
Set up a race series, build 24 race cars which show the kind of style they intend for the production car (which you sell at a reduced price to the teams to keep your costs down) and use the race series to market the reborn Brand...by the end of the season you've shown that TVR is reliable again (hopefully) you've tested the market on the new style/build methods...etc etc.
Basically use the race series as the launch pad and viral marketing tool first...Its a darn site cheaper than building 500 cars you're not sure anyone wont's or likes and everything that goes with that?
Spot on in my opinion, but it is that, an opinion.

There is only a handful of people that know, all the other ste that's spouted on here and other mediums is pure guess work.... Most of which is from people who have no idea how to run/set up such a venture. Me being one of them.

RetroWheels

3,384 posts

270 months

Thursday 21st May 2015
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ste is the V Power of the Internet biggrin

DonkeyApple

54,924 posts

168 months

Thursday 21st May 2015
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Willtl said:
Gazzab said:
Golf R, Mercedes AMG A class....
The acceleration thrill of the golf is pretty awesome.
My quick Google showed Golf over 5 seconds and Mercedes at 4.5 so unless I found the wrong models, TVR still maintains bragging rights.
I honestly don't think TVR times are as low as you have mentioned. And on too of that, the hatchbacks will bang in their times all day, every day, regardless of conditions and with a retarded chimp at the wheel.

And on the open road it's the same story. All day, every day, in any conditions and with no skill required those new hatchbacks will deliver.

Mass produced, generic cars are today, faster than our Tivs in standard form.

The performance arms race is in a very different place now and you need very, very deep pockets to hand build something that can compete against some really generic, mass produced people's wagons.

m4tti

5,426 posts

154 months

Thursday 21st May 2015
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Although a golf R does a 1:29 ish lap round the top gear test track, and a Tuscan or Sagaris 1:24..... and that's before they've had any sort of uprated rebuild.

dvs_dave

8,581 posts

224 months

Friday 22nd May 2015
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They need to accidentally on purpose get caught running a test mule around the ring. That would light the fires!

DonkeyApple

54,924 posts

168 months

Friday 22nd May 2015
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m4tti said:
Although a golf R does a 1:29 ish lap round the top gear test track, and a Tuscan or Sagaris 1:24..... and that's before they've had any sort of uprated rebuild.
Doesn't matter. On the road, most drivers do not have the skill to eek out the last bit of performance and so the car with the electronics will be faster.

Besides, when we look back at the days of the Griff there simply wasn't any basic car that could stick to the back of it in the early 90s. That was the size of the performance differential. Today, there isn't that differential and in most cases it's reversed.

Building a reliable and safe 500bhp TVR means everything in the drivetrain has to be beefed up adding both weight and cost. By sticking at 300 then generic, cheap, off the shelf parts will do the job and the end product becomes an awful lot cheaper.

If people want a new TVR that can outperform modern hatchbacks, have a nice, premium interior and for the product to work then people just have to be prepared to pay an awful lot of money for such a product.

R7EBO

501 posts

141 months

Friday 22nd May 2015
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I seem to remember reading a while back that Les was the man responsible for bringing Aston Martin back to GT racing? As soon as I read that I discussed it at our local monthly club meet and suggested that perhaps he had had enough of ploughing his cash into watching someone else' brand racing and perhaps wanted his own.

Insert a now defunct but still in existence TVR brand, which has a pedigree or sorts and is sat in purgatory awaiting it's fate from a Russian with too much money and hey-presto. I'm fairly sure though that in order to enter certain GT racing series that there must be a minimum number of road-going versions in production to base the race car on?

This may not be rocket science, but my guess for a new road car would be:
- low production numbers (no EU safety crash testing etc required),
- still 2 seats,
- an outsourced well established engine, perhaps a form of 3.0 V6?
- similar but more substantial box section/space frame chassis put under a lightweight body, still all put together by hand (all sound familiar?!), but in a more organised environment! With design software available now such as CAD it wouldn't be overly difficult to design & run simulations all at relatively low cost before even thinking about building one.

It's pointless comparing to today's hot hatches - not least because of the age gap and advances in technology resulting in more power and efficiency, but they are completely different animals. We as humans are better at almost everything than a Lion for example, but one-on-one it'll still rip your head off!! Forget the Golf R's etc and look more towards the like of Noble or even Weissman. I've been to the Weissman factory and as you would expect from ze Germans it's very clean, very cool and of course very well organised. It's a small, hand-built sports car and they sell for £100k plus!

Before I bought my Tuscan I always viewed TVR's as the annoying teenager with ADHD, running around poking the more sensible adults with a stick and running away. A bit of an unpredictable rebel making faces & flipping the bird at everyone else. So adding electronic aids such as ABS & traction control is kind of taking that sense of rebelliousness away, & I for one wouldn't have it any other way. Besides, we've all done just fine without it until now! I think that is also partly the reason for a lot of the respect we get from passers by & other car folk, for driving a car purely for the unaided driving experience. That and 'enthusiastically' maintaining the things to keep them on the road!

I could be talking bcensoredks of course, but it makes sense to me at least wink

Milky400

1,960 posts

177 months

Friday 22nd May 2015
quotequote all
R7EBO said:
I seem to remember reading a while back that Les was the man responsible for bringing Aston Martin back to GT racing? As soon as I read that I discussed it at our local monthly club meet and suggested that perhaps he had had enough of ploughing his cash into watching someone else' brand racing and perhaps wanted his own.

Insert a now defunct but still in existence TVR brand, which has a pedigree or sorts and is sat in purgatory awaiting it's fate from a Russian with too much money and hey-presto. I'm fairly sure though that in order to enter certain GT racing series that there must be a minimum number of road-going versions in production to base the race car on?

This may not be rocket science, but my guess for a new road car would be:
- low production numbers (no EU safety crash testing etc required),
- still 2 seats,
- an outsourced well established engine, perhaps a form of 3.0 V6?
- similar but more substantial box section/space frame chassis put under a lightweight body, still all put together by hand (all sound familiar?!), but in a more organised environment! With design software available now such as CAD it wouldn't be overly difficult to design & run simulations all at relatively low cost before even thinking about building one.

It's pointless comparing to today's hot hatches - not least because of the age gap and advances in technology resulting in more power and efficiency, but they are completely different animals. We as humans are better at almost everything than a Lion for example, but one-on-one it'll still rip your head off!! Forget the Golf R's etc and look more towards the like of Noble or even Weissman. I've been to the Weissman factory and as you would expect from ze Germans it's very clean, very cool and of course very well organised. It's a small, hand-built sports car and they sell for £100k plus!

Before I bought my Tuscan I always viewed TVR's as the annoying teenager with ADHD, running around poking the more sensible adults with a stick and running away. A bit of an unpredictable rebel making faces & flipping the bird at everyone else. So adding electronic aids such as ABS & traction control is kind of taking that sense of rebelliousness away, & I for one wouldn't have it any other way. Besides, we've all done just fine without it until now! I think that is also partly the reason for a lot of the respect we get from passers by & other car folk, for driving a car purely for the unaided driving experience. That and 'enthusiastically' maintaining the things to keep them on the road!

I could be talking bcensoredks of course, but it makes sense to me at least wink
think thats pretty much spot on, love your analogy about the Tuscan

harry henderson

358 posts

107 months

Friday 22nd May 2015
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I personally don't drive my Cerbera on the limit or at full throttle all the time, does it really matter if X, Y or Z is a fraction faster. I'd struggle to spend nearly 30k on a fast Golf or Focus when an 18yr old new driver can have an identical looking car with a teeny weeny engine for 14k, 99% of people wouldn't be able to tell the difference in traffic. I didn't buy mine because it was the fastest etc, it just looks and sounds amazing, it's a genuine sports car, not a family hatchback with a body kit. As long as they look and sound like nothing else, are good value compared to a 911 and are still built in Britain there won't be a problem selling them. Only my opinion.