HANS to be mandatory from 2016

[NJH]

Its mentioned about 1/2 dozen times in the MSA mag which should have landed on yer mats by today.

[ginettajoe]

staceyboy said:

Trev450 said:

I thought I read somewhere that they had to be fitted by the helmet manufacturer either at the time of production, or if post production, then by an 'authorised' organisation.

Pretty sure as long as it's got the captive nuts fitted to the helmet, you can fit the posts after.

I'm not too sure about that! I bought the kit from Demon Tweeks to fit to my helmet, which already had the inserts fitted. I was told that I could use the helmet in the UK, but if I went to Spa, it wouldn't be acceptable at scrutineering. They said that the helmet would have to be returned to the manufacturer, for them to fit the kit, and the helmet would then be marked with the FIA standard! Now whether the chap at Demon Tweeks was at cross purposes, I'm not sure, because you can just screw the fittings in, just as capably as someone at the helmet manufacturer! Also, if you purchased a helmet with the fittings already in place, and sent it for painting, the painter would unscrew the fittings, and refit later!! Perhaps someone would be kind enough to clarify the situation, please?

[CDP]

As previously mentioned it's not just reducing the risk of death but also lessening injuries. If an injury means time off work it would take very little time to exceed the cost of the HANS device; that's before considering the pain and possible long term effects amy injuries might cause.

A HANS device cost little more than the cheapest set of tyres or a race entry.

A couple of months ago my wife had a big impact at Cadwell; she had whiplash, a cracked rib and the bruising hasn't gone yet. While it can only be an informed opinion the medics thought HANS prevented serious injuries. I don't think I'd want to race without it and she certainly won't.

[Bertrum]

ginettajoe said:

I'm not too sure about that! I bought the kit from Demon Tweeks to fit to my helmet, which already had the inserts fitted. I was told that I could use the helmet in the UK, but if I went to Spa, it wouldn't be acceptable at scrutineering. They said that the helmet would have to be returned to the manufacturer, for them to fit the kit, and the helmet would then be marked with the FIA standard! Now whether the chap at Demon Tweeks was at cross purposes, I'm not sure, because you can just screw the fittings in, just as capably as someone at the helmet manufacturer! Also, if you purchased a helmet with the fittings already in place, and sent it for painting, the painter would unscrew the fittings, and refit later!! Perhaps someone would be kind enough to clarify the situation, please?

This keeps coming up. In simple terms it needs the FIA sticker on the inside. If it has that you can screw in yourself most if the ones with the inserts have the sticker.

No sticker then it needs to go back to the factory. Scrutes check the sticker

[teletubby]

andy97 said:

In the same time frame how many people have suffered burns and how many have suffered difficulties through whiplash?

It's not just death that Hans are designed to prevent.

In the same period, 2 drivers that I remember have suffered (minor) burns, far more mechanics! In terms of whiplash, that's tricky as it may not present at the circuit but generally speaking nobody has complained of specific neck pain (plenty have complained of feeling like they had done 10 rounds with Mike Tyson though).

[Dan Friel]

Think this video is a useful example of HANS in action...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g40YatgE_CE

[spikey78]

Bertrum said:

This keeps coming up. In simple terms it needs the FIA sticker on the inside. If it has that you can screw in yourself most if the ones with the inserts have the sticker.

No sticker then it needs to go back to the factory. Scrutes check the sticker

I'm not sure that's correct-i bought a pre-drilled for HANS helmet, and the HANS clips separately and fitted them myself back in 2011. I can't remember the exact wording in the blue book at the time, but this was seen as acceptable even though it wasn't particularly clear (yeah, who'd have thought it-an ambiguous reg in the blue book!)
Anyway this lid has been scrutineered many times in the UK (and twice in Europe) and it's never been mentioned. I don't recall there being an FIA sticker in it, just the snell one.
I don't know what the latest blue book says, and I can't really be bothered to check as it's unlikely that i'll be doing any more racing now anyway

Edited by spikey78 on Tuesday 18th November 15:22

[Trev450]

The current Blue Book makes reference to a specific sticker that has to be in place when HANS clips are fitted.

As an aside, I note that the rule change also requires all post 2000 built single seater drivers to wear a HANS device from 2015, irrespective of the discipline.

[Dr JonboyG]

indigorallye said:

My point is, I've used both. 2" is more suited.
2" is even more suited when doing driver changes as the harness sits on the device quicker and easier.

FWIW, I wont race without HANS.

Agree 100% with all of this. We ran 3" belts for 2012 and 2013 with no problems, switched to a Schroth enduro harness with 2" shoulder belts for this year and it makes driver changes much easier, and somewhat more comfortable. And I'd also never get in a race car without a HANS now.

[With these feet]

We had the issue with one driver running a Hans, the other not. You shouldnt run 2" belts without Hans so we ran with 3" but the trick was to cross the belts behind the seat. This then causes the belts to ride towards the centre of the Hans rather than off the edge.

There are many people that would disagree with the Hans winged seats not making a difference, some say the Hans in a side impact can cause injury as it acts as leverage trying to lift the helmet and head over the top.
The Hans wings may well defer some of the sideways movement - though Im no expert and the jury is out!

[graemel]

Well I need new belts for 2015. I guess the lap and crotch belts remain at 3" just the shoulder straps are 2". Interesting take on the winged seat for side protection. Had not thought of that. I guess I ought to fit the right seat as well.

[NJH]

Graeme nothing to stop you using all 3" belts, something like the a stand21 HANS and no wings on the seat. I had a big glancing blow into the barriers at Brands back in 2012, the sort of thing which many would think HANS wouldn't help but I got out with not a scratch or injury on me and was signed off by the chief MO to race that day, car wasn't up for it though.

[BertBert]

Interestingly schroth have harnesses with 2 inch lap belts too with rationale about how they are a better fit in the pelvis and can be done up tighter
Bert

[R TOY]

Dan Friel said:

Think this video is a useful example of HANS in action...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g40YatgE_CE

Sold it to me !

Will certainly be using one next season, will make driver change more difficult tho'

How do 2 driver teams work it ? Can one device be shared ?

[andy97]

I must admit that I only find the driver change marginally more difficult and that's because of the need to make sure the belts are fitted correctly over the Hans. Practice makes perfect!

The fastest changes in CSCC races with both drivers wearing a d Hans has been 22 secs so it can be done!!!

You could share a HANS but your change will be so slow I really would not recommend it. You really should have one each in my view.

Edited by andy97 on Monday 24th November 08:20

[Dr JonboyG]

R TOY said:

Sold it to me !

Will certainly be using one next season, will make driver change more difficult tho'

How do 2 driver teams work it ? Can one device be shared ?

We've shared two HANS devices between four of us on a team, but you really need at least two (one for whomever is in the car and another for the next person in).

[R TOY]

Dr JonboyG said:

We've shared two HANS devices between four of us on a team, but you really need at least two (one for whomever is in the car and another for the next person in).

Letter to Santa then . Think I may be on his naughty list tho !

[With these feet]

There budget versions out not made in carbon, Schroth make some that are £230.
The real cost is in the helmet fixings thankfully karting does not require them!

[bicycleshorts]

CDP said:

A HANS device cost little more than the cheapest set of tyres or a race entry.

Set of tyres for the brscc mx5 championship: £160

Cheapest hans device: £257
Cheapest helmet with hans posts: £252
Cheapest hans 2" harness: £160
Total: £670 (Prices from Demon Tweeks)

Or for reference... 4 sets of tyres.

I appreciate the device, how it works and the reason for it's mandatory requirement but without some cheaper options/solutions, it's appears to be just another money making scheme like the life of seats/harnesses. Particularly so with only 1 year of notice given.

[woof]

A hans device is probably cheaper than a good wheelchair.

I'm not the biggest fan of the MSA and some of their policies but making Hans devices mandatory can only be a positive rule change.