Rochester By-Election. Consequences of UKIP Win on Tory/Lab

[carinaman]

Eddie Mair is skewering Gove on PM.

[XJ Flyer]

Yazar said:

XJ Flyer said:

Which would explain why UKIP is just another party fighting over the same pro immigration 51% of the total electorate.The immigrant vote now obviously holding the balance of power over the indigenous one.

Edited by XJ Flyer on Friday 21st November 16:52

Apologies if you have stated before.

But in simple terms, what do you want?

Say day after UKIP got in power
- do you want all Eu migrants out?
- just Eu migrants with no jobs?
- eu migrants with a salary lower than x?

What is your position exactly? And what do you class as indigenous?

In the case of a UKIP vote 'indigenous' obviously means foreign entrants who have been allowed entry and a work permit on the basis of EU membership status who otherwise wouldn't have been.

While my 'personal' view of the definition of 'indigenous' obviously goes a lot further than that concerning so called Commonwealth immigration and/or our erroneous definition of nationality based on place of birth.Which is why we have a so called 'British' Jihadist problem.

It seems obvious that if UKIP can't even get its head around the former,which 'would have' been a good start and at least a case of doing what it actually says on the label,it was never going to be able to sort out the latter.

[Zod]

WinstonWolf said:

UKIP are not the party for you, the BNP would better suit your aspirations.

Indeed.

[s2art]

Yazar said:

XJ Flyer said:

What is the point if that policy 'also' includes the idea of letting them all in and letting them all stay to the point where all those who were coming are already here on the date of withdrawal

Retrospective legislation is unsettling and complicated.

You don't really need to do it either.

State any EU migrant caught homeless in the future will be immediately deported and that solves that.
State any low paid/'self employed' big issue seller EU migrant is not entitled to in-work benefits/housing benefit/free nhs/free schools unless they do a job with a severe shortage/worked for x amount of years and those on low incomes will leave themselves.
State all Eu residents to be checked for Criminal convictions in the past here and abroad and deport.

And so on.

Make a set of sensible rules going forward and the migrant that we don't need will leave themselves. There is no need to say 'deport first then points test on re-entry', makes no sense.

Agreed. Just to add; we will need to leave the ECHR as well, otherwise it will be difficult to deport some of the undesirables.

[McWigglebum4th]

Zod said:

WinstonWolf said:

UKIP are not the party for you, the BNP would better suit your aspirations.

Indeed.

or the tory party

As they want to flood the country with whites

[XJ Flyer]

Yazar said:

XJ Flyer said:

What is the point if that policy 'also' includes the idea of letting them all in and letting them all stay to the point where all those who were coming are already here on the date of withdrawal

Retrospective legislation is unsettling and complicated.

That isn't how Canada or New Zealand sees it when deporting immigrant labour,including British,for numerous reasons either retrosepctive administrative 'changes' or any number of other arbitrary reasons.

[Yazar]

XJ Flyer said:

In the case of a UKIP vote 'indigenous' obviously means foreign entrants who have been allowed entry and a work permit on the basis of EU membership status who otherwise wouldn't have been.

If in-work benefits/free nhs/free school places are withdrawn from your local Romanian big issue seller family, do you think

A) They will suddenly find the money to pay the bills down the back of the sofa.
B) Go off to another EU country.

Choose an option.

[XJ Flyer]

McWigglebum4th said:

Zod said:

WinstonWolf said:

UKIP are not the party for you, the BNP would better suit your aspirations.

Indeed.

or the tory party

As they want to flood the country with whites

No the Cons are all about flooding the country with immigration of whatever colour in order to over supply the labour market.While my argument is the opposite in stopping the situation still regardless of 'colour'.

[XJ Flyer]

Yazar said:

XJ Flyer said:

In the case of a UKIP vote 'indigenous' obviously means foreign entrants who have been allowed entry and a work permit on the basis of EU membership status who otherwise wouldn't have been.

If in-work benefits/free nhs/free school places are withdrawn from your local Romanian big issue seller family, do you think

A) They will suddenly find the money to pay the bills down the back of the sofa.
B) Go off to another EU country.

Choose an option.

The issue is more a case of will the vacancies and therefore wages for bus drivers or truck drivers and numerous other similar types of jobs for example,increase if the option of importing non indigenous labour is stopped,applying retrospectively,for the employers.

[Yazar]

XJ Flyer said:

Yazar said:

XJ Flyer said:

What is the point if that policy 'also' includes the idea of letting them all in and letting them all stay to the point where all those who were coming are already here on the date of withdrawal

Retrospective legislation is unsettling and complicated.

That isn't how Canada or New Zealand sees it when deporting immigrant labour,including British,for numerous reasons either retrosepctive administrative 'changes' or any number of other arbitrary reasons.

Canada is Canada due to its natural resources.
New Zealand are a little country and not comparable.

One of the UK's biggest assets, and top USP, is its stability in its laws. This is a major reason why the rich flood here and companies invest here.

[McWigglebum4th]

XJ Flyer said:

McWigglebum4th said:

Zod said:

WinstonWolf said:

UKIP are not the party for you, the BNP would better suit your aspirations.

Indeed.

or the tory party

As they want to flood the country with whites

No the Cons are all about flooding the country with immigration of whatever colour in order to over supply the labour market.While my argument is the opposite in stopping the situation still regardless of 'colour'.

no that is labour who want to completely destroy any kind of englishness by unlimited immigration

The tory just want the country full of polish plumbers

You really really want to vote BNP as they hate everyone apart from the english and want everyone who isn't english and white thrown out of the UK

[XJ Flyer]

oyster said:

WinstonWolf said:

XJ Flyer said:

Yazar said:

XJ Flyer said:

The fact is we need another Powell when all we've got in the form of UKIP is Cameron with more attitude at least in regard to the immigration question.Which leaves the question if UKIP has gone soft on immigration then what is to say it won't do the same in terms of a Brexit.

The reason for UKIP being the size it now is, if due to Farage having a intuitive grasp of the workings of the media.

What reckless said on the video i.e. deport after a period new migrants of little benefit but look sympathetically at a working migrant who has been here a while', mass media twisted into a 'deport them all' attack.

In the 10 seconds Farage had to reply, all he has is a soundbite that would then be repeated every half hour on the news on the day before the elections.

So there was no room of explanation in detail, the message had to be simple and ensure this was not the time that the 'racist' tag that the lefties have been trying so hard in vain for the last few years to pin to UKIP, would have any chance of sticking.

In this case that would be exactly the same issue as any Labour supporter,who supported Powell's policies in the day,had to deal with on a daily basis.IE deal with it don't surrender or pander to it.

No, what we need now is Farage. I'm not against immigration per-se, but it needs to be in the best interests of everyone who lives here.

Immigration can add to the Great in Britain, but it won't if we let ungrateful tossers in.

Which ones are ungrateful?

The eastern European guys who worked from 7am to 8pm last year to re-paint the outside of my house, and offered to do the work for much less than a 'British' person?

The team of IT consultants working for me from India?

The doctor who came here from Nigeria 3 years ago, and helped treat my 10 month old for dehydration?

Most of the ungrateful tossers I see in the UK are not immigrants, but the lazy, feckless and workshy thugs that populate our sink estates.

That contains the proof of reverse racism being applied against the indigenous community by the cheap labour agenda.

[XJ Flyer]

McWigglebum4th said:

XJ Flyer said:

McWigglebum4th said:

Zod said:

WinstonWolf said:

UKIP are not the party for you, the BNP would better suit your aspirations.

Indeed.

or the tory party

As they want to flood the country with whites

No the Cons are all about flooding the country with immigration of whatever colour in order to over supply the labour market.While my argument is the opposite in stopping the situation still regardless of 'colour'.

no that is labour who want to completely destroy any kind of englishness by unlimited immigration

The tory just want the country full of polish plumbers

You really really want to vote BNP as they hate everyone apart from the english and want everyone who isn't english and white thrown out of the UK

If the BNP were all about 'the English' then it would obviously be the ENP with a policy of English independence to suit.As I've said the jury is also out as to the question are they just a nationalist/nativist party or a racist one.

As for the Cons they don't care where the labour comes from just so long as its cheap.As for UKIP maybe its now turning from an anti EU anti immigration Party into a similarly questionable racist one to the BNP.In this case on the basis of a non white UK immigrant vote that has problems with a large scale influx of a white one.

[Yazar]

XJ Flyer said:

The issue is more a case of will the vacancies and therefore wages for bus drivers or truck drivers and numerous other similar types of jobs for example,increase if the option of importing non indigenous labour is stopped,applying retrospectively,for the employers.

If you take the min wage of £13,124 and then ask a migrant family to pay from this our inflated rent, expensive public transport costs, health insurance and school fees. Do you think he will say 'yes please' or say 'sorry I can't live on that, I need x amount more'?

This 'eu migrants are working hard' con is only working due to the top up benefits, if these are removed than the free market will adjust itself.

[Yazar]

XJ Flyer said:

If the BNP were all about 'the English' then it would obviously be the ENP with a policy of English independence to suit.As I've said the jury is also out as to the question are they just a nationalist/nativist party or a racist one.

I give up.

[XJ Flyer]

Yazar said:

XJ Flyer said:

If the BNP were all about 'the English' then it would obviously be the ENP with a policy of English independence to suit.As I've said the jury is also out as to the question are they just a nationalist/nativist party or a racist one.

I give up.

That usually happens when the difference between nationalism/nativism as opposed to racism is raised.Being the inconvenient truth which stops those who view any form of anti immigration policy as racist.

[XJ Flyer]

Yazar said:

XJ Flyer said:

The issue is more a case of will the vacancies and therefore wages for bus drivers or truck drivers and numerous other similar types of jobs for example,increase if the option of importing non indigenous labour is stopped,applying retrospectively,for the employers.

If you take the min wage of £13,124 and then ask a migrant family to pay from this our inflated rent, expensive public transport costs, health insurance and school fees. Do you think he will say 'yes please' or say 'sorry I can't live on that, I need x amount more'?

This 'eu migrants are working hard' con is only working due to the top up benefits, if these are removed than the free market will adjust itself.

That isn't really going to help in the case of mass occupancy of a rented house and sending the still relatively higher wage home to their families who are living in a cheap rented east european house.

As for the 'top up' benefits if they are removed they also affect the indigenous workforce who do have to support a family in a British house at British housing costs with only two wage earners to pay for it.That wage remaining the same because as UKIP has said all the cheap east Euro labour we've got up to the point of a Brexit can stay and even after that it isn't clear if UKIP intends to close the door in that regard.No doubt to pander to the immigrant vote that sees 'implications' in the case of any precedents of 'repatriation' being set.

[mrpurple]

How nice of Nigel to take the time to thank me personally.

---

In the early hours of this morning I witnessed Mark Reckless win the by-election in Rochester and Strood to become UKIP's second directly elected Member of Parliament.

It is because of your continued support that we achieved victory in what was potentially the most important by-election in the last 50 years.

Kind regards,

Nigel Farage MEP

Leader of the UK Independence Party

[McWigglebum4th]

XJ Flyer said:

If the BNP were all about 'the English' then it would obviously be the ENP with a policy of English independence to suit.As I've said the jury is also out as to the question are they just a nationalist/nativist party or a racist one.

As for the Cons they don't care where the labour comes from just so long as its cheap.As for UKIP maybe its now turning from an anti EU anti immigration Party into a similarly questionable racist one to the BNP.In this case on the basis of a non white UK immigrant vote that has problems with a large scale influx of a white one.

Ah but most of their supporters are too dim to realise that English is not British

But I haven't got a clue what you want

but I guess that makes two of us

[XJ Flyer]

Yazar said:

XJ Flyer said:

Yazar said:

XJ Flyer said:

What is the point if that policy 'also' includes the idea of letting them all in and letting them all stay to the point where all those who were coming are already here on the date of withdrawal

Retrospective legislation is unsettling and complicated.

That isn't how Canada or New Zealand sees it when deporting immigrant labour,including British,for numerous reasons either retrosepctive administrative 'changes' or any number of other arbitrary reasons.

One of the UK's biggest assets, and top USP, is its stability in its laws. This is a major reason why the rich flood here and companies invest here.

Canada and NZ aren't exactly known for their instability and poverty.

It doesn't seem to be 'the rich' who are 'flooding here' by hiding in the back of trucks from Calais.Nor the average east European worker.Having said that even the idea of 'rich' foreign immigration just puts more demand on housing supply and costs for the indigenous population.