Dislocating shoulder problem.
Discussion
My daughter has a shoulder problem where it dislocates with fairly minimal effort.
One of our dogs pulling for example.
The injury is the result of a Netball accident.
She has had two operations on it already, the last being about four years ago.
The frequency of dislocation is now more or less weekly and our local hospital have basically washed their hands so so wont even attempt to relocate it.
This means that she has to go to the neighbouring Authority for help.
The Surgeon there, at first, said that he would operate. My daughter was thrilled because this guy has a very good reputation but he has now changed his mind and said he would refer her to an intensive physiotherapy clinic.
5 months down the line my daughter has discovered that the referral has not taken place and so she is no closer to getting anything done.
I recently paid for a private consultation but quite frankly that was a complete waste of time and money.
My private medical insurance doesn't cover this existing problem.
Today she went to Manchester to attend an interview and then ended up in a Manchester hospital.
This turned into a nightmare as they gave her an anesthetic that basically temporarily paralyzed her such that the doctor was poking her in the eye etc and she couldnt respond and so ended up extremely upset and with her shoulder still not back in.
The whole situation has been going on so long now that my Wife is struggling to deal with it and we have no idea what to do.
Half the people she deals with, GP, Physio etc say she needs a third operation but the local specialists wont touch it.
Is it possible to request treatment outside the UK, a hospital in France, Germany, Spain, 'anywhere' to undertake the operation.
One of our dogs pulling for example.
The injury is the result of a Netball accident.
She has had two operations on it already, the last being about four years ago.
The frequency of dislocation is now more or less weekly and our local hospital have basically washed their hands so so wont even attempt to relocate it.
This means that she has to go to the neighbouring Authority for help.
The Surgeon there, at first, said that he would operate. My daughter was thrilled because this guy has a very good reputation but he has now changed his mind and said he would refer her to an intensive physiotherapy clinic.
5 months down the line my daughter has discovered that the referral has not taken place and so she is no closer to getting anything done.
I recently paid for a private consultation but quite frankly that was a complete waste of time and money.
My private medical insurance doesn't cover this existing problem.
Today she went to Manchester to attend an interview and then ended up in a Manchester hospital.
This turned into a nightmare as they gave her an anesthetic that basically temporarily paralyzed her such that the doctor was poking her in the eye etc and she couldnt respond and so ended up extremely upset and with her shoulder still not back in.
The whole situation has been going on so long now that my Wife is struggling to deal with it and we have no idea what to do.
Half the people she deals with, GP, Physio etc say she needs a third operation but the local specialists wont touch it.
Is it possible to request treatment outside the UK, a hospital in France, Germany, Spain, 'anywhere' to undertake the operation.
I feel for your daughter, having had a life time of shoulder dislocations, several operations, innumerable trips to A&E and ultimately, no positive outcome.
My experience has been consultants who promise the moon on s stick & end up making things worse. In one case, much worse. The inescapable fact is the shoulder is the most mobile joint in the body & once you start dislocating it, you render yourself more & more prone to further episodes as the ligaments & muscle surrounding it become stretched & Weakened.
Unless you can find an ace surgeon who can specifically identify your daughter's issue as distinct from the general we'll tighten this up, clean that out, shave a bit off here merchants, then I would go for intense physio & careful management. Sorry, not the answer you were hoping for, just the best way through the crap I've had with mine.
My experience has been consultants who promise the moon on s stick & end up making things worse. In one case, much worse. The inescapable fact is the shoulder is the most mobile joint in the body & once you start dislocating it, you render yourself more & more prone to further episodes as the ligaments & muscle surrounding it become stretched & Weakened.
Unless you can find an ace surgeon who can specifically identify your daughter's issue as distinct from the general we'll tighten this up, clean that out, shave a bit off here merchants, then I would go for intense physio & careful management. Sorry, not the answer you were hoping for, just the best way through the crap I've had with mine.
Thank you, I very much appreciate both of your responses.
My daughter has been seeing a physio for some time now with no improvement from the home exercises so unfortunately spikeyhead, this has not had the same positive outcome that you have had.
Abagnale, your situation sounds only too familiar with all of the A&E visits, broken promises and even that failure to make the transferal to the intensive Physio clinic.
Although it is not good news on her future prognosis, and I have a great deal of sympathy for your ordeal, it will help me to explain to her, her position.
As she is over 18 years old, my Wife and myself are blocked form having an opinion but I will now do everything I can to get her on to the intensive physio coarse.
Thanks again, you really have clarified things for me.
My daughter has been seeing a physio for some time now with no improvement from the home exercises so unfortunately spikeyhead, this has not had the same positive outcome that you have had.
Abagnale, your situation sounds only too familiar with all of the A&E visits, broken promises and even that failure to make the transferal to the intensive Physio clinic.
Although it is not good news on her future prognosis, and I have a great deal of sympathy for your ordeal, it will help me to explain to her, her position.
As she is over 18 years old, my Wife and myself are blocked form having an opinion but I will now do everything I can to get her on to the intensive physio coarse.
Thanks again, you really have clarified things for me.
Edited by so called on Tuesday 18th November 19:45
Edited by so called on Wednesday 19th November 20:04
Adding muscle will definitely help. It might be time to talk to another physio. Only you know the severity, but I've gone from dislocating when reaching for the remote control on the sofa to living without any major problems for two years now. Also if, anyone offers your daughter a Putti Plat repair, run away.
Good luck with it. Dunno if this will help but I learnt over the years in A&E that reducing the shoulder involves gas & air, a doctor pulling for dear life on your wrist while a nurse grabs you round the armpit.
A doctor will be along shortly to call me an ignoramus of epic proportions, but I found that copying that by turning the wrist inwards, placing it on the ground & standing on my palm then gently straightening up did the trick in seconds. I am in no way recommending this course of action, but if you don't like ambulances & A&E...
A doctor will be along shortly to call me an ignoramus of epic proportions, but I found that copying that by turning the wrist inwards, placing it on the ground & standing on my palm then gently straightening up did the trick in seconds. I am in no way recommending this course of action, but if you don't like ambulances & A&E...
Abagnale said:
Good luck with it. Dunno if this will help but I learnt over the years in A&E that reducing the shoulder involves gas & air, a doctor pulling for dear life on your wrist while a nurse grabs you round the armpit.
A doctor will be along shortly to call me an ignoramus of epic proportions, but I found that copying that by turning the wrist inwards, placing it on the ground & standing on my palm then gently straightening up did the trick in seconds. I am in no way recommending this course of action, but if you don't like ambulances & A&E...
The Doctor in Manchester was pretty brutal with her the other day and it he didn't manage to get back in anyway.A doctor will be along shortly to call me an ignoramus of epic proportions, but I found that copying that by turning the wrist inwards, placing it on the ground & standing on my palm then gently straightening up did the trick in seconds. I am in no way recommending this course of action, but if you don't like ambulances & A&E...
She went to our neighbouring hospital today and they have also been unsuccessful.
I sent her a link to this thread yesterday and so I'll text her to check out your 'procedure'.
Thanks again,
Tony.
I damaged my shoulder around 17 years old, I would say it took probably 10 years to get it to a place where it would not dislocate.
I had years of not being able to do certain movements, throwing a tennis ball, taking a throw-in during a football match, fending off an opposition team player even pulling open a door in a certain way etc.
I would often wake up in the middle of the night with it dislocated.
I was always advised to think long and hard about surgery, and settled on physio.
During those ten years, I got pretty disheartened, with little apparent progression, but I think I got there in the end.
I would keep trying with physio, I understand it will not be a quick fix, but as mentioned unless the surgeon knows exactly what they are doing, and is particularly skilled, it can be the wrong choice.
My physio had me doing lots of upper body work, and it eventually paid off, about 9 years after I stopped the actual physio appointments, but I carried on in a limited fashion hoping one day my shoulder would be strong again.
It is still not right, even sitting typing this reply I can feel that it is not positionally right with a general dull ache, but it's so much better.
Shoulders are not an easy fix. Hope she doesn't get too disheartened.
I had years of not being able to do certain movements, throwing a tennis ball, taking a throw-in during a football match, fending off an opposition team player even pulling open a door in a certain way etc.
I would often wake up in the middle of the night with it dislocated.
I was always advised to think long and hard about surgery, and settled on physio.
During those ten years, I got pretty disheartened, with little apparent progression, but I think I got there in the end.
I would keep trying with physio, I understand it will not be a quick fix, but as mentioned unless the surgeon knows exactly what they are doing, and is particularly skilled, it can be the wrong choice.
My physio had me doing lots of upper body work, and it eventually paid off, about 9 years after I stopped the actual physio appointments, but I carried on in a limited fashion hoping one day my shoulder would be strong again.
It is still not right, even sitting typing this reply I can feel that it is not positionally right with a general dull ache, but it's so much better.
Shoulders are not an easy fix. Hope she doesn't get too disheartened.
Dift said:
I damaged my shoulder around 17 years old, I would say it took probably 10 years to get it to a place where it would not dislocate.
I had years of not being able to do certain movements, throwing a tennis ball, taking a throw-in during a football match, fending off an opposition team player even pulling open a door in a certain way etc.
I would often wake up in the middle of the night with it dislocated.
I was always advised to think long and hard about surgery, and settled on physio.
During those ten years, I got pretty disheartened, with little apparent progression, but I think I got there in the end.
I would keep trying with physio, I understand it will not be a quick fix, but as mentioned unless the surgeon knows exactly what they are doing, and is particularly skilled, it can be the wrong choice.
My physio had me doing lots of upper body work, and it eventually paid off, about 9 years after I stopped the actual physio appointments, but I carried on in a limited fashion hoping one day my shoulder would be strong again.
It is still not right, even sitting typing this reply I can feel that it is not positionally right with a general dull ache, but it's so much better.
Shoulders are not an easy fix. Hope she doesn't get too disheartened.
Hi Dift, Thanks for telling me this.I had years of not being able to do certain movements, throwing a tennis ball, taking a throw-in during a football match, fending off an opposition team player even pulling open a door in a certain way etc.
I would often wake up in the middle of the night with it dislocated.
I was always advised to think long and hard about surgery, and settled on physio.
During those ten years, I got pretty disheartened, with little apparent progression, but I think I got there in the end.
I would keep trying with physio, I understand it will not be a quick fix, but as mentioned unless the surgeon knows exactly what they are doing, and is particularly skilled, it can be the wrong choice.
My physio had me doing lots of upper body work, and it eventually paid off, about 9 years after I stopped the actual physio appointments, but I carried on in a limited fashion hoping one day my shoulder would be strong again.
It is still not right, even sitting typing this reply I can feel that it is not positionally right with a general dull ache, but it's so much better.
Shoulders are not an easy fix. Hope she doesn't get too disheartened.
My daughter is pretty low at the moment.
Hur Mum and myself had started to get a bit desperate simply not knowing how to help her.
The common them here is clearly 1. No surgery unless the guy is realy good and 2. Physio is extremely important.
You have laid a path for her.
Abagnale said:
Good luck with it. Dunno if this will help but I learnt over the years in A&E that reducing the shoulder involves gas & air, a doctor pulling for dear life on your wrist while a nurse grabs you round the armpit.
A doctor will be along shortly to call me an ignoramus of epic proportions, but I found that copying that by turning the wrist inwards, placing it on the ground & standing on my palm then gently straightening up did the trick in seconds. I am in no way recommending this course of action, but if you don't like ambulances & A&E...
That's basically the Spaso Technique, and is often safe and gentle. The chance of a patient hurting themselves whilst trying to reduce a dislocation is very remote. Damage generally occurs courtesy of the person who's grabbing you.A doctor will be along shortly to call me an ignoramus of epic proportions, but I found that copying that by turning the wrist inwards, placing it on the ground & standing on my palm then gently straightening up did the trick in seconds. I am in no way recommending this course of action, but if you don't like ambulances & A&E...
OP: If at wit's end, then Prof Len Funk is perhaps someone to see for a 2nd/3rd/etc opinion
The_Doc said:
That's basically the Spaso Technique, and is often safe and gentle. The chance of a patient hurting themselves whilst trying to reduce a dislocation is very remote. Damage generally occurs courtesy of the person who's grabbing you.
OP: If at wit's end, then Prof Len Funk is perhaps someone to see for a 2nd/3rd/etc opinion
Hi The Doc, thanks very much for the information. I will definitely follow this up.OP: If at wit's end, then Prof Len Funk is perhaps someone to see for a 2nd/3rd/etc opinion
At the moment she's feeling very low and even missed an appointment this morning with a specialist in North Staffs.
I'm sure you'll understand that my Wife and myself are rather annoyed but she really cant see the wood for the trees at the moment.
The_Doc said:
That's basically the Spaso Technique, and is often safe and gentle. The chance of a patient hurting themselves whilst trying to reduce a dislocation is very remote. Damage generally occurs courtesy of the person who's grabbing you.
OP: If at wit's end, then Prof Len Funk is perhaps someone to see for a 2nd/3rd/etc opinion
Yeah, once I got a handle on what was being done to me, I sussed I could DIY it & save the drain on the public purse. OP: If at wit's end, then Prof Len Funk is perhaps someone to see for a 2nd/3rd/etc opinion
I dislocated my shoulder in April...went through a fairly gruesome process when the doctor in the medical centre (in a ski resort so fairly experienced in these things) tried getting it back in. Ended up having to be knocked out in the local hospital.
I had to have an operation as I had taken a sliver of bone off my humerus, something called a labral tear and frozen shoulder. Never great being told you're a "very interesting case"!
Had the operation and embarked on a long process of physio and also weekly going to see a personal trainer who I already knew and is great at injury rehab. Six months on I have had hopefully a really positive outcome with 95% of my full range (and still improving) and my shoulder being pretty strong. I honestly don't think just doing physio would have got me anywhere near where I am....your standard physio session involves 15 mins of doing release work/stretching and 10 mins of showing you exercises...my hour of doing work with the PT every week and doing more at home is what gets you where you need to be. The physio really monitors your progress but physio on it's own isn't going to get you a positive outcome IMHO.
Not local to you but the specialist I saw was a bloke called Andy Richards who was superb
http://www.fortiusclinic.com/index.php/shoulder/mr... Couldn't recommend him highly enough if you want a second opinion.
I had to have an operation as I had taken a sliver of bone off my humerus, something called a labral tear and frozen shoulder. Never great being told you're a "very interesting case"!
Had the operation and embarked on a long process of physio and also weekly going to see a personal trainer who I already knew and is great at injury rehab. Six months on I have had hopefully a really positive outcome with 95% of my full range (and still improving) and my shoulder being pretty strong. I honestly don't think just doing physio would have got me anywhere near where I am....your standard physio session involves 15 mins of doing release work/stretching and 10 mins of showing you exercises...my hour of doing work with the PT every week and doing more at home is what gets you where you need to be. The physio really monitors your progress but physio on it's own isn't going to get you a positive outcome IMHO.
Not local to you but the specialist I saw was a bloke called Andy Richards who was superb
http://www.fortiusclinic.com/index.php/shoulder/mr... Couldn't recommend him highly enough if you want a second opinion.
Edited by Cheib on Saturday 22 November 19:31
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